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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Judy Murray

107 replies

JellySlice · 08/07/2021 16:16

In yesterday's Times, in response to the judgemental statements made by certain male commentators about Emma Raducanu:

"Middle-aged men should generally avoid commenting on the physical or mental well-being of teenage girls. They will never experience or fully understand that world."

OP posts:
larkstar · 12/09/2021 00:49

I think @lolacola77 is ""a flash in the pan and we'll probably never hear of her again."

Casmama · 12/09/2021 00:51

Maybe we could just be delighted for Emma's success and resist crowing about someone's inappropriate comment and a whole thread mocking the poster who made it?

KingscoteStaff · 12/09/2021 00:54

@lolacola77

Nonsense. What if it was a female commentator and a teenage boy? I'm no fan of McEnroe but he was right. She's clearly not ready to compete at that level. I personally think she's a flash in the pan and we'll probably never hear of her again. Apart from reality shows.
@lolacola77, care to review those thoughts?
TedImgoingmad · 12/09/2021 00:55

So pleased for Emma, what a superstar! Please can the women on FWR flood the Sports Personality Of The Year phone lines in December, and make sure Emma wins this year. Last time we had a female winner was, I think, the wonderful Dame Kelly Holmes in 2004. We are long overdue another female winner.

LobsterNapkin · 12/09/2021 01:06

I don't agree with the idea that men, of whatever age, have no clue what teenage girls are like.

I have three girls. My husband has a much better sense of the mental make-up of the younger one than I do, having a similar personality. I expect he could make some fairly reasonable assessments about a teenage girl he met, having raised three of his own, and being reasonably observant. I think many women could do the same with regards to teenage boys.

McEnroe's main issue is that he is and always has been inclined to be a twat, and spout off about things he doesn't really have much information about. On the other hand, you can probably make a general statement that elite sports including tennis are an extremely high pressure environment that is going to be hard on almost any teen, and maybe especially teen girls.

Buffoonborisisatwat · 12/09/2021 01:15

@lolacola77

Nonsense. What if it was a female commentator and a teenage boy? I'm no fan of McEnroe but he was right. She's clearly not ready to compete at that level. I personally think she's a flash in the pan and we'll probably never hear of her again. Apart from reality shows.
Well you got that wrong 🤣
WarriorN · 12/09/2021 05:46

Nonsense. What if it was a female commentator and a teenage boy?

They'd never comment like that. Sexism.

WarriorN · 12/09/2021 05:47

I may have just shed a tear after finding she won... ❤️

Bellagio40 · 12/09/2021 06:35

I was also tearful when she won, @WarriorN

BlackAlys · 12/09/2021 08:28

@lolacola77

Nonsense. What if it was a female commentator and a teenage boy? I'm no fan of McEnroe but he was right. She's clearly not ready to compete at that level. I personally think she's a flash in the pan and we'll probably never hear of her again. Apart from reality shows.
This thread popped up in active.

What sublime timing!!

Care to comment?!

BlackAlys · 12/09/2021 08:45

... and Emma? You are an incredible athlete and deserve every success. Congratulations 💐

JSL52 · 12/09/2021 08:46

@lolacola77

Nonsense. What if it was a female commentator and a teenage boy? I'm no fan of McEnroe but he was right. She's clearly not ready to compete at that level. I personally think she's a flash in the pan and we'll probably never hear of her again. Apart from reality shows.
Oh dear ...
SpindleWhorl · 12/09/2021 08:55

And she did really well in her A Levels, I believe?

I happen to agree with Judy Murray. As for 'my DH ...' argument, it doesn't hold universally. My father raised three teenage girls and he was bloody hopeless.

Whattheflecker · 12/09/2021 08:56

@lolacola77

Nonsense. What if it was a female commentator and a teenage boy? I'm no fan of McEnroe but he was right. She's clearly not ready to compete at that level. I personally think she's a flash in the pan and we'll probably never hear of her again. Apart from reality shows.
That aged well eh?
Outbutnotoutout · 12/09/2021 08:58

@lolacola77

Nonsense. What if it was a female commentator and a teenage boy? I'm no fan of McEnroe but he was right. She's clearly not ready to compete at that level. I personally think she's a flash in the pan and we'll probably never hear of her again. Apart from reality shows.
Eat your words!!!!!
ladygindiva · 12/09/2021 09:08

@lolacola77

Nonsense. What if it was a female commentator and a teenage boy? I'm no fan of McEnroe but he was right. She's clearly not ready to compete at that level. I personally think she's a flash in the pan and we'll probably never hear of her again. Apart from reality shows.
Lol this hasn't aged well!
ladygindiva · 12/09/2021 09:11

Sorry, didn't mean to jump on the bandwagon. Like none of us have ever been entirely wrong. Just amused me. It probably felt a very valid point at the time. I agree with the posters sentiments before the radanucu write off actually.

MsHedgehog · 12/09/2021 09:21

Following with popcorn!

IvyTwines2 · 12/09/2021 09:25

Please don't turn this into a pile-on. I think the poster's comments were rather mean-spirited, but there have been young players before who have been really hyped up prematurely and haven't managed to deliver, in part because of the massive expectations suddenly piled on them. I happen to think McEnroe's comments about the stress were correct: he didn't deliver them in a gentlemanly way, but that day Raducanu was made to wait all day until the late evening for her match to satisfy a hungry public (us) at prime time, when if things had been running normally, without the rescheduling for TV and the Centre Court, her match would have been on in the early afternoon, and, who knows, we might even have been celebrating her second grand slam victory today!

prudencepuffin · 12/09/2021 09:30

@TedImgoingmad

So pleased for Emma, what a superstar! Please can the women on FWR flood the Sports Personality Of The Year phone lines in December, and make sure Emma wins this year. Last time we had a female winner was, I think, the wonderful Dame Kelly Holmes in 2004. We are long overdue another female winner.
Zara Phillips won the sports personality of the year in 2006. But I agree - would be nice if Emma won it this time.
Whattheflecker · 12/09/2021 09:34

@ivyTwines2 yes you're right but there needs to be some understanding that athletes are people too and if they're struggling with self confidence then comments such as 'they'll probably never amount to anything' can be crushing. There's just no need.

Ok so she's probably not on Mumsnet but it's the overall principle.

Like many things, Marcus Rashford's response at the time was spot on. How many other bright hopes might have gone on to great things if that'd been the way they were treated?

IvyTwines2 · 12/09/2021 09:34

I also think the pile-on on McEnroe (probably water off a duck's back!) was a convenient misdirection when the real villain that day was us, wanting the match at prime time and on centre court and making her wait for hours and then walk out into that massive jam-packed arena.

Lessthanaballpark · 12/09/2021 09:35

Well done Emma. So pleased for her. And it was great to see so many men cheering her on. Flowers

Marguerite2000 · 12/09/2021 09:35

Are teenage girls and teenage boys that different when it comes to stressful situations such as playing in grand slam tournaments, waiting for A level results, dealing with the press, anxiety, and all the rest of it? I'm not sure what is so specific to her sex here.
Congratulations to Emma, what a wonderful achievement.

Saintsofsaint · 12/09/2021 09:41

@Marguerite2000

Are teenage girls and teenage boys that different when it comes to stressful situations such as playing in grand slam tournaments, waiting for A level results, dealing with the press, anxiety, and all the rest of it? I'm not sure what is so specific to her sex here. Congratulations to Emma, what a wonderful achievement.
It's the extra layer of sexism that teenage female athletes have to contend with: Smile, look pretty, don't grunt, be polite. There was a guy on BBC just now saying she's the 'whole package' because he tennis skills are not enough.

It's similar to what black male athletes have to contend with.

And for black female athletes it's insane the standards to which they are judged.

White male athletes can behave however the hell they like.