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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Maya's judgement Thursday 10th June 10.30am

856 replies

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 08/06/2021 18:13

Wishing her the very best of luck. twitter.com/MForstater/status/1402310977115279362?s=20

I'll be absolutely gutted if the original decision isn't overturned, but at least her case has let a lot of sunlight in.

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GNCQ · 10/06/2021 11:07

Fantastique

Does this mean Maya gets her job back???

I hope she tells her former employer to FOTTFSOFAWYGTFOSM

NativityDreaming · 10/06/2021 11:10

This is great news! Well done to all involved in fighting this.

RedToothBrush · 10/06/2021 11:10

I don't think it just has implications for on going cases. I THINK I'm right in saying that if this is a ruling using the ECHR as a defence it potentially has implications for Scottish Law. As in if someone is done under hate crime legislation along similar lines and takes the Scottish Government to court along similar lines there is going to be an issue. You could well end up seeing a case go to the ECHR in time.

The Scottish Government would do well to take note and realise there is an issue in the making here and to preempt it.

But they won't.

nauticant · 10/06/2021 11:11

Prosecco Stormfront originated a few years back:

twitter.com/CaseyExplosion/status/1099723204539617281

It's one of those slurs that often says more about the people using it than their targets.

FannyCann · 10/06/2021 11:11

Such a relief, fantastic news.

Now need stickers and posters of this image.

Maya's judgement Thursday 10th June 10.30am
BathTangle · 10/06/2021 11:11

what other protected characteristics might be relevant if someone doesn't qualify for gender reassignment?

Sex. If a TW failed at gaining a promotion for wearing a dress to the interview (for example) that could easily be argued as sex-based discrimination because a woman would be allowed to wear a dress with impunity.

Something similar done in the USA in the 1970s, where wives of servicemen were entitled to be dependents of their husbands and get financial support, but husbands of service women were not. This was challenged on the basis of sex discrimination and was won.

Abhannmor · 10/06/2021 11:11

FlowersFlowers Wowsers! Well done Maya Smile

Tibtom · 10/06/2021 11:11

@GNCQ

Fantastique

Does this mean Maya gets her job back???

I hope she tells her former employer to FOTTFSOFAWYGTFOSM

No, Maya has to face another tribunal to argue she was discriminated against because of her beliefs - this just sets up that her beliefs are protected.
EndoplasmicReticulum · 10/06/2021 11:12

BBC breaking news story says this:

"A woman who lost her job after saying that people cannot change their biological sex has won an appeal against an employment tribunal."

When you put it like that it makes no sense at all, does it? People who haven't been following the case will presumably be confused.

I'm glad I can't be sacked for teaching biology.

fantastaballs · 10/06/2021 11:12

Holy shit balls this is amazing!! I can't believe how emotional I am about it to be honest. Maya, thank you SO much ❤️

Oblomov21 · 10/06/2021 11:12

Twitter: " over transgender tweet"
FFS
Angry

OldTurtleNewShell · 10/06/2021 11:13

I'm actually in tears at this. Thank god.

PronounssheRa · 10/06/2021 11:15

So many men on twitter disappointed by this ruling.

It's probably the only time I wish Harrop was still there 🤣

yourhairiswinterfire · 10/06/2021 11:15

@Thingybob

Has it already been said that JKR retweeted the Sex Matters tweet almost immediately.
Weird to think that JKR was probably furiously refreshing with the rest of us Grin
nauticant · 10/06/2021 11:15

Evan Davis will be made to cover this on PM later today. It will be interesting to see how he deals with it and whether he can be even-handed.

StealthPolarBear · 10/06/2021 11:15

I daren't like gc tweets. But I am liking the ones that say stating facts is legal. Feels so freeing.

malloo · 10/06/2021 11:15

So happy to hear this, feel quite emotional! Had a quick scan of the judgement, so many clear, sensible statements. I particularly liked this one:
the Claimant’s belief that sex is immutable and binary is, as the Tribunal itself correctly concluded, consistent with the law.....Where a belief or a major tenet of it appears to be in accordance with the law of the land, then it is all the more jarring that it should be declared as one not worthy of respect in a democratic society. para 114, 115

OvaHere · 10/06/2021 11:16

@WinterTrees

#IStandWithMayaForstater is trending on twitter.

So much support, and then Katie Montgomerie missing the entire point about women as a class being allowed to define and speak up for themselves and making it all about Katie Montgomerie. A groundbreaking ruling on freedom of speech, and the best counter-argument KM has got is "I'm a woman and I'm going to have a family one day. I think it's sick that anyone would want to take that from me"

Just seen another tweet stating the same thing. This must be the party line they are going with.
Maya's judgement Thursday 10th June 10.30am
MrsBunHat · 10/06/2021 11:17

"over transgender tweet" Hmm

Yess BBC because everything is all about transgender 🤦🏻‍♀️

How about:
"over factual tweet"
"over biological sex statement"
"over tweet about men and women"

Grellbunt · 10/06/2021 11:19

@ChloeCrocodile

what other protected characteristics might be relevant if someone doesn't qualify for gender reassignment?

Sex. If a TW failed at gaining a promotion for wearing a dress to the interview (for example) that could easily be argued as sex-based discrimination because a woman would be allowed to wear a dress with impunity.

Exactly

So a man should be allowed to present as a woman sartorially / use a feminine name etc in the same way as a woman would.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 10/06/2021 11:20

The summary of things the judgement doesn't mean is very interesting / important I think.

I am not a lawyer but I think it is essentially saying that gender critical views do not make the world unsafe for transpeople, which is something that is often argued from both sides.

I am so, so relieved she won though.

senua · 10/06/2021 11:20

This has huge implications. Is it the end for the Professionally Offended?

MrsJamin · 10/06/2021 11:20

What an absolute relief! Maya - if you're reading this, thank you thank you thank you!! 🙌🏻

GroggyLegs · 10/06/2021 11:21

I didn't realise how much this case meant to me until I read the (bullshit 'transgender tweet' Hmm) BBC headline that Maya has won.

My relief is immense.
Maya has won her right to know believe people cannot change sex, and therefore so have I.

Thank you so much for standing up Maya Flowers I am so very grateful for your bravery.

UnnecessaryFennel · 10/06/2021 11:21

This is so brilliant - and also so completely fucking bonkers.

'Woman wins legal right to say biological sex is a thing.'

Fucking hell, well done Maya, you are amazing. But it's just so insane that you ever ended up in this position in the first place. I hope this will really open some eyes to the madness so many women have been negotiating for so long.