Prostitute chic?

[SoStrange]

Sorry for the title. I’m not trying to be antagonistic but don’t know what else to call this style (bearing in mind that I grew up in the 70s/ 80s).

I have two confident and assertive older teenage daughters. One over 18 and one under.

They both like to go out wearing things like black fishnets and tight bodices and very short skirts. They have dyed hair and piercings too. They are fiercely feminist and seem to find this way of dressing very empowering.

I worry about the negative attention and possible increased risk they get going out at night dressed like this and struggle to express this in a way that doesn’t sound like victim blaming.

I actually think they look fabulous but also really struggle with the urge to say ‘you can’t go out looking like that’.

Any advice whoever to explain my concerns without sounding like I’m a victim blaming dinosaur? ( maybe I am, lol!)

Also, can anyone help me to articulate my gut feeling that such a sexualised way of dressing isn’t actually very feminist? Or am I wrong here??

It's strange that both of them dress the same especially with the age gap but I would hold my tongue if I were you.

It’s not that strange where we live tbh as there’s a very strong ‘alternative’ influence!! And I think the younger is influenced by the older one in terms of specific style.

In that case they will only get the same attention as everyone else in the area.

Hmmm they are not that unusual in terms of their college community but still are in terms of wider population...

I dressed like this at that age and was fine. My parents sent me to self-defends classes, though I never needed to use them fortunately!

Would still feel like you if looking at it as a parent though, so do sympathise.

Prostitutes don't actually dress like that, except maybe in movies.

Personally I don't its absolutely necessary to dress a certain way, to that extent anyway, to show you are empowered.

Even if they were covered head to toe perverts are going to perv.

At 16 I went through a phase of wearing mini skirts just because I could. One in particular had bra fastenings down the front and attracted a lot of attention.

Sadly, men will hassle teen girls whether they wear miniskirts or burlap sacks. I'd teach them to look after themselves and be aware of their surroundings.

I would not worry. Most violence against women happens from people they know. Also a serious preditor is just as likely to be put off by what they are wearing, assuming they have a stronger personality as its weakness that triggers them.

@Wrongsideofhistorymyarse

At 16 I went through a phase of wearing mini skirts just because I could. One in particular had bra fastenings down the front and attracted a lot of attention.

Sadly, men will hassle teen girls whether they wear miniskirts or burlap sacks. I'd teach them to look after themselves and be aware of their surroundings.

As a man I often walk down the street and see young women and think "I'm all for being 'alternative' and challenging the norms, but you'd look so much nicer / more attractive if you lazered the tattoos / ditched the piercings / ditched the pink hair / ditched the horrid clothes etc etc".

Then I think that maybe a big chunk of the reason they look like they do is precisely because they don't want men thinking they look nice / attractive. Presumably a big part of it all is a fuck you to society generally, and an (entirely reasonable) "I'll do what I want". But I'd also guess that a big part of it is that they have very good reason NOT to meet society's normal expectations.

FWIW when I first shaved my head I was astonished at how much easier it was to get down crowded pavements - people get out of the way instead of assuming they can continue their path and you'll jump for them. I'm guessing many young women dress in alternative ways for a similar reason.

To be clear I also see young men and think similar things (eg FFS - it's 2021, the long haired metaller cliche was well past it's best 35 years ago, your clothes are also a sad mid-80s faux-biker cliche and your tatts are fucking horrid too)

I just fucking knew it

I generate quite a lot of attention from men and women because of how I look and dress (you literally won’t find people dressed like me here)

The most negative attention I ever get is actually from other women who I assume are just jealous as they make comments about me looking like a slag even though I’m actually more covered up than they are.

I have a a few sets with super flare mesh pants and I have suspenders on under them and there was a three inch section of leg you could see the straps through the mesh. I was covered from my neck to my ankles. Some woman with her arse hanging out of a skirt was stood glaring at me, storming around the shop. I didn’t even see her I felt her. My partner couldn’t believe it.

I wouldn’t worry about it. People will always have something to say especially if they look good.

Then I think that maybe a big chunk of the reason they look like they do is precisely because they don't want men thinking they look nice / attractive.

Or maybe a big chunk of the reason is they like the way they look ??

OP FWIW I used to go on nights out wearing revealing clothes, mostly because I liked it and also it was the done thing if you were 16/17 and trying to get the bouncer to let you in the bar without ID. I got a lot of attention and looks from men but didn't really care.

The night I went out straight after college wearing skinny jeans, boots, a checked shirt, biker jacket and wooly hat is the night I got attention from one particular man, which resulted in the worst happening.

I don't believe what you wear has any major bearing on you becoming a victim or not. If your daughters are happy with how they dress, let them be.

*"Then I think that maybe a big chunk of the reason they look like they do is precisely because they don't want men thinking they look nice / attractive.

Or maybe a big chunk of the reason is they like the way they look confused??"*

I don't think that it is unreasonable to suppose that a significant percentage of "alternative looking" young women and girls are doing so for a combination of reasons. I suspect that many are rebelling against society's norms, and they are forging their own identity which they like. No different to me between the ages of 16 and 23/24.

I find it highly plausible that consciously or sub-consciously their rebellion against society is a rebellion against normal standards of beauty, and that being found less attractive by people you don't want to see or speak to is a bonus. Whether it works in practice is another matter, indeed I can see that it could work the other way - less offensive male attention, only to be replaced with more very offensive male abuse.

FFS - it's 2021, the long haired metaller cliche was well past it's best 35 years ago

This is incorrect. Long hair and an Iron Maiden t-shirt are never past it. Like the Queen and her headscarf, they are above fashion.

Also agree that prostitutes don't seem to wear what the OP is describing, which sounds like unremarkable alternate/goth/punk attire that wouldn't look out of place in any club playing loud guitar music over the past four decades.

As a mum, surely you should just be making suggestions about practicality and the weather? Mums and nans always seem convinced you can catch a deadly chill from a draught across your kidneys...

It’s not prostitute chic.

It’s ‘alt’. I’m reliably informed by my alt daughter who is currently sporting a bright red mullet with shaved sides, fifteen earrings and two rings in her nose. She also wears a vial of her own blood round her neck. Bodice, tiny kilt skirt, fishnets and five inch platforms.

She tones it down a bit for work.

I was a teenage goth so I highly approve.

All the sex workers I knew in my pre-kids life wore jeans or joggers with vest top and hoodie

But then they were all the ones that don't fit the "happy hooker" and "sex work is empowering" storyline we are told to believe. The ones that had scabs all over their arms and bruised faces and sores round their noses and haunted eyes, who definitely didn't feel empowered by their drug habits or their 'boyfriends' who threatened them with violence if they didn't earn enough for his habit too. So maybe you're thinking of something else when you say "prostitute chic" ?

Prostitute chic makes me think of fake leather mini skirt, fishnet tights and white stilettos circa 1981 or something.
Your daughters sound cool to me. I also have a goth/alternative daughter. I never say anything about what she wears as I went out dressed exactly the same at her age. (In fact, some of her clothes are actually mine.) If a man is going to make inappropriate comments, or worse, he probably wouldn't care if they were dressed in a bin bag to be honest.

This is how my little sister dresses at the moment. Although I would never say anything say anything to her, it makes me feel really uncomfortable. It's like BDSM chains around her neck and breasts, with plaid school girl girl skirts. I think it's overly sexualised and I hate that it plays on clothes you would see on a child. I don't like that in all of the pictures of her holding my newborn that she's wearing it all with boobs barely held in. Hardly nice pictures for the family album... that being said, it's normal for teenage girls to experiment, but I I think she will cringe when she's older! I also hate how I see men look at her when we are out

@MowldyStupidAndAssive

All the sex workers I knew in my pre-kids life wore jeans or joggers with vest top and hoodie

But then they were all the ones that don't fit the "happy hooker" and "sex work is empowering" storyline we are told to believe. The ones that had scabs all over their arms and bruised faces and sores round their noses and haunted eyes, who definitely didn't feel empowered by their drug habits or their 'boyfriends' who threatened them with violence if they didn't earn enough for his habit too. So maybe you're thinking of something else when you say "prostitute chic" ?

Yes

One of the significant realisations in my teens that startled me one step closer to adulthood was finding out that there were women in my boring, rural town who were engaged in prostitution in their perfectly ordinary homes wearing perfectly ordinary clothing, during the school day. Not the image of prostitution I'd grown up with in my sheltered world.

@JediGnot I don't understand your point at all. You are saying women who have tattoos and piercings do it to be less attractive?

Because you, a man, find it less attractive?

Then you call it a rebellion against normal standards of beauty... it's hard to find concrete statistics but Ipsos says 40% of 18-34yos have tattoos, with 40% of those having tattoos on their forearms (so highly visible), and a survey of UK businesses saying 65% of employers in the Beauty Industry preferred tattoo'd employees.

So... are you defining societies standards for beauty as what you find beautiful, or what 40% of young women in society (inc the beauty industry itself) find beautiful?

Whether it works in practice is another matter, indeed I can see that it could work the other way - less offensive male attention, only to be replaced with more very offensive male abuse.

Tattoos and piercings make you less likely to have offensive male attention but that will be replaced with male abuse?

WHAT? can you explain this please? As someone covered in tattoos with 9 ear piercings... I would like to know why males give me attention in a dress - or running gear! - (when according to you, society finds me unattractive and I would look better lasered), but abused me after wearing jeans and a jacket?

Do you think it could be that rapists / abusive men don't actually care how little piercings, tattoos, and clothes you have?

And men who crave attention and enjoy catcalling / beeping / sleazing on women will do it wether they're in school uniform, gym clothes, or stockings and suspenders? Pink hair or not.

I had a phase like that in my teens - but it was a bit punky (shaved hair, DMs and green lippy). We (our family) used to go to the opera and ballet with me dressed like that.

OP, I get this too, my teenage dd goes out in fishnets and a corset and I want to sound like my mum and shriek no, you're not going out like that but I never do

Jedignot, I think you've got a point, my dd I think is trying to say “fuck you” to trad dressing and deliberately looks gothy.

No idea what the answer is though