School Video. Words just can’t convey...

[ConcreteUnderpants]

For all those who PM’ed and wanted me to put it on its own thread.
Here you go.

This is the video my year 6 watched at school (without any consultation with parents)
I’m just speechless.

They were also told about Robert/a Cowell and puberty blockers were mentioned, although I’m not sure of those details.

Head and deputy are the safeguarding leads at the school, so where do I start with the Governors? Overwhelmed.

I work with this age group and I’m gobsmacked. We teach PSHE and we teach that families can take many shapes such as two mummies/daddies etc but that is shocking. I’d refuse to teach it and so would my colleagues.

WTF did I just watch? I hope they don't show this tripe to my dc at their school.

Doctors sometimes assign the wrong gender? WTAF.
Baby has a penis, its a boy.
Vagina, Its a girl
What are they supposed to say. Congratulations, you've had an it?
Worlds gone fucking mad.

@Squiblet

OP, why not just watch the video again with your DC at home, and explain your concerns? This will give you an opportunity to explode any myths you believe to be false.

It's a hugely complex & wide-ranging issue, and we've got to accept that kids and teens will be exposed to a plurality of views over their 13+ years of education. Trying to stifle a two-minute video, without discussing why you think it's problematic, will not help them.

How would you even start explaining that to a six year old?

Ah just seen it’s year 6 not age 6. Phew! But still, it’s inaccurate. Doctors don’t assign a gender, they record the sex of the genitals of the newborn.

@Artichokeleaves

The DfE have clearly stated it is not acceptable for schools to present biased, political information as the truth, nor allow political lobby groups access to their children, nor to allow them to tell them factual inaccuracies using the trusted platform of school and safe adults so that children assume they are being told the objective truth.

This is the same as any political or religious indoctrination. It is not acceptable to send in the Labour party to train them to vote Labour or the Church of England to explain about there is only one true faith and everyone else who thinks otherwise is wrong.

This has to be reported to the DfE. Repeatedly. And Ofsted. Basic failure of duty of care, and abuse of a position of trust. This is wholly unacceptable.

Excellent post Artichoke

This is an American video. Here, it’s obstetricians who generally deliver babies , and they note a child’s sex. This bizarre video telling children doctors are wrong just creates trouble.
The conflating of feminism with LGBT causes at the end is insane. I was born a girl. I am now a cisgendered lesbian. I am attracted to other people who were born women. There is nothing that can make me believe a boy or a man who puts on female clothes and perhaps takes hormones is a woman. It’s just not true. Even five year olds can tell you that.

Why on earth are year 6 children being shown something like this?
The woman who is presenting (+ talking teddy), is doing it as if to an infants class; that is not the point but I am not sure what is the point.

I'd be hopping mad if my kid had to see that at school.

There is going to have to also be a systematic government/DfE approach as to how the actual fuck they plan to undo this confusion and misleading that they have allowed to happen in school to children. I don't see anything else for it, this stuff has been released to too many kids as if it's the objective truth. They're going to have to UnStonewall this generation.

@Benjispruce3

Ah just seen it’s year 6 not age 6. Phew! But still, it’s inaccurate. Doctors don’t assign a gender, they record the sex of the genitals of the newborn.

Quite - that's just the sort of line I'd want to discuss with DC, so that they're aware it's problematic. Let's face it, they're going to bump up against this stuff many, many times, so the more we keep the lines of communication open, the better. In the end they'll have to make up their own minds.

I’ve worked out what the four letter word was - c... to rhyme with adult.

It’s a bit sinister having a post deleted for a word like that.

I think it's great to teach children to treat cisgender people with respect.

They didn't choose to be born cisgender. They are just as worthy of respect as others.

If you want to get very precise, doctors don't observe sex at birth either.

They observe external genitalia and, based on this observation, the child is assigned M or F in official documents.

There is no assignment. Doctors observe a male or female child based on external genitalia and record their observation.

That method is imperfect. Depending on how you define sex - the external genitalia don't always match other sex characteristics (e.g., chromosomes, hormones).

It might be imperfect, but that method is correct with at least 99.99% accuracy. And chromosomes are not the end point of sex differentiation but the beginning. A female-bodied child with XY chromosomes is female, a male-bodied child with XX chromosomes is male.

Also, hormones do not determine sex. Both sexes produce all types of androgens and estrogens, at varying levels throughout their lifespan, with the most noticeable effects of masculinising androgens and reminiscing estrogens experienced in puberty. Female-bodied individuals with high testosterone levels (for instance those suffering PCOS) are still female and male-bodied individuals with high oestrogen levels are still male (for instance those suffering prostate cancer).

Below I've linked to an interesting Twitter thread where Dr Emma Hilton explains her findings from looking at karyotype studies in newborns which recorded the phenotypes of these babies. She found that of almost 65,000 newborns, 99.99% had a male or female kartotype in accordance with their phenotype. 1 newborn had ambiguous genitalia.

mobile.twitter.com/FondOfBeetles/status/1111352888385769472

Furthermore and just FYI, in the rare cases where genitalia are ambiguous, sex is not assigned at birth. Specialist doctors are called in for a series of tests in these babies. In the UK, that's approximately 130 babies each year. These tests allow doctors to determine the sex of most of these newborns. They are inconclusive only in a small number, and those are the only newborns who are ever assigned a sex, in consultation between the parents and the specialist doctors. That amounts to 0.001% of newborns each year.

Making it entirely incorrect to speak of doctors routinely assigning a sex to all newborns. And appropriating the language used for and by people with extremely rare and often very complicated and difficult medical histories is reprehensible.

(The percentage I quote stems from the submission to the Scottish Census consultation by dsdfamilies, an organisation set up by and for people with and parents of children with Differences in Sex Development (DSDs) to better support their needs in Scotland.)

"feminising estrogens"!

I have no idea what reminiscing estrogens would be...

I think I watched that video before, certainly not putting myself through it again!

I think it's worse that it's being shown to year 6. Very young children would probably just mark it down as one more incomprehensible thing a teacher expected them to get to grips with. A year 6 child, though - on the verge of puberty or already in the early stages - peak time for discomfort and embarrassment about the changing body and all that entails - suddenly being told that actually sometimes doctors get it wrong and you're not really a girl/boy and there's medical treatment available to sort it out - there are going to be some kids thinking 'Hallelujah! A way out of this nightmare'.

I'm sure even as a ten year old I'd have been distracted by how the Teddy looks dead when it isn't talking.

This is excellent. Good for all ages. Growns ups too.

The way this woman implies there is something intrinsically wrong with saying 'it's a boy'! when a baby is born is very disturbing. In times before tech took over, telling women they have a healthy baby boy/girl is about the only fact that's undeniable about a newborn.

Most of them look pretty much alike apart from that. And of course we have no idea what kind of people they're going to turn into.

But their sex is fixed.

Awful.

yeahbutnaw what about those of us that aren't trans or cisgender, are we worthy of respect?

Those who feel it's appropriate to share highly biased, highly politically motivated and factually incorrect information with children as if its the truth - are you ok with other groups doing this too? Do you see this as an ethical thing? Or do you just support the teaching of the biased political/faith based ideologies you personally agree with?

How do you feel about Fair Play for Women popping into that school and presenting the other side of the argument for example?

A year 6 child, though - on the verge of puberty or already in the early stages - peak time for discomfort and embarrassment about the changing body and all that entails - suddenly being told that actually sometimes doctors get it wrong and you're not really a girl/boy and there's medical treatment available to sort it out - there are going to be some kids thinking 'Hallelujah! A way out of this nightmare'

Exactly. And then to mention puberty blockers and Robert/a Cowell in the same lesson...easy peasy solution. Then with all this Jigsaw Fight Club type confidentiality business...

@yeahbutnaw

It's important to teach children to be tolerant and accepting.

That includes teaching them that LGBT people exist. As someone who was once an LGBT child, I'd have benefited greatly from knowing that I'm not "abnormal" and that there are others like me.

This video is great. More of this sort of thing.

My youngest was in year 6 last year. They had classmates who identified as gay, gender neutral and trans. It is ultra important that these things are discussed openly and in an accepting manner, and her school did brilliantly. Everyone was very accepting of everyone and continue to do so in their Year 7 cohort. I'm proud of my daughter and her classmates for rolling with it and treating their classmates as individuals, not labels.

I have no problem at all with videos akin to this one. It's not about us; it's about accepting others for who they are.

I think it's great to teach children to treat cisgender people with respect.
They didn't choose to be born cisgender. They are just as worthy of respect as others

And what about the vast majority of people who don't identify as cis or trans? Are they worthy of respect in your opinion?

Paraphrasing:

Lindsay: “Teddy, do you remember when your new little baby bear brother was born?”

Teddy: “Of course!”

Lindsay: “Well, do you remember the very first thing you learned about the new baby bear in your life?”

Teddy: “Um...that he cried a lot?”

Lindsay: “ No, Teddy. What you probably learned is that your new baby bear brother...was a boy.”

Teddy: “Oh yeah...that’s definitely it.”

Don’t tell a child what their memories are Lindsay, you manipulative fuck.

I’m think it’s important that kids are being taught about transgenderism. The same as I think it’s important they’re taught about religion.

However that video is shocking. That’s fucking appalling. I’m actually stunned.

The audience sounds very much infants so you tell me what five year old would understand ‘gender assigned at birth’ what five year knows what assigned means? How very odd.

Also anyone any ideas on LGQT?!