Prince Phillip | Mumsnet

chickadeeee · 2021-04-10T07:35:09+00:00

His passing is very sad, however aibu to be annoyed about the constant reference to him 'giving things up' to be the Queen's consort. How many women 'give up' their lives when they get married, would the conversation be the same if he were King and his wife had passed away [hmm]

sashagabadon · 10/04/2021 08:41

I get your point and agree generally. Male consorts are a rarity and I think that is why it is commented on as it was unusual back in the day.
Women do and did routinely give up their careers etc for their husbands and no one bats an eye.
To be fair to him, he did do it gracefully as far as I can see, and must have been frustrating for him with a promising navy career ahead.

sashagabadon · 10/04/2021 08:43

I think Camilla and Kate would get similar “support” comments but probably less angst about them giving up their future careers etc. Doesn’t apply to Camilla really anyway as she was older when they wed.

RainingBatsAndFrogs · 10/04/2021 08:48

It is a fact that he made significant adjustments in order to support his wife’s role.

He should be used as an example as to how more men could support their partner’s career! Instead of the man assuming he is the only one who can work late / travel / not cover sick days or organise holiday care.

OppsUpsSide · 10/04/2021 08:49

Did they know she would be Queen when they wed?

Babdoc · 10/04/2021 08:51

Well, you can look at it negatively like that, OP. Or you can see the positive - that he was a great role model for men, showing that they can prioritise their wife’s career while still being an admirable bloke with interests of his own. And I think he would have been the first to dismiss all the eulogies and talk of his “sacrifices” - he would have seen it as simply doing his duty.

SelkieBeag · 10/04/2021 08:53

@OppsUpsSide

Did they know she would be Queen when they wed?

I'm Irish so no expert on this subject! but I think she was about 11 or 12 when her uncle abdicated.

Pumperthepumper · 10/04/2021 08:53

I think it’s fair to point out what he gave up to support the queen, as PPs said, a male consort is fairly rare and he had a promising navy career. And all at a time where the woman being the breadwinner (I know it’s the Queen!) would have been very unusual.

I quite like him being used as an example of men taking a back seat.

Pumperthepumper · 10/04/2021 08:54

@OppsUpsSide

Did they know she would be Queen when they wed?

Yes, the did. Her dad was already king by that point.

bdd2017 · 10/04/2021 08:54

No they wouldn't talk about it as much, but isn't that the point.

At a time, especially where men were seen as the head of the house, he very publicly had to kneel before his wife in front of the world and pledge his allegiance. I think what he did was quite gutsy. And he supported her through the years, carving a role out for himself whilst never taking her limelight.

I'd put his actions perfectly in the feminist camp when it came to his wife.

Floisme · 10/04/2021 08:56

@OppsUpsSide

Did they know she would be Queen when they wed?

Yes but they probably thought they had 20-odd years before they needed to worry about it. George V1 was only in his 50s when he died.

Gladimnotcampinginthisweather · 10/04/2021 08:56

They did know she would be Queen, but didn't expect it to happen so soon. King George vi was only about 56 when he died. They probably expected 10-20 years before she came to the throne.

Trixie78 · 10/04/2021 08:57

I was going to start a thread on this. I actually loved Prince Philip, he's one of the best royals but some of the coverage has IMO been very disrespectful to the Queen. It's all 'she was a young compliant girl and she really needed his guidance, she would never have been able to do it without him' etc etc. Don't get me wrong, they've obviously had a wonderful marriage and he's supported her greatly but her achievements are hers, he's done his own work and that should be focused on.

MattyGroves · 10/04/2021 08:57

I'd put his actions perfectly in the feminist camp when it came to his wife

Well, except for the hissy fit about the kids not having his surname and the very public infidelities.

Mrsjayy · 10/04/2021 08:58

Did they know she would be Queen when they wed?

Yes her father was already king. he did give up his career to be by her side and for a man of his time that was a huge deal to become a queen consort.

sashagabadon · 10/04/2021 09:00

@OppsUpsSide

Did they know she would be Queen when they wed?

Yes as her father was king. But he died shortly after their marriage so it was only really on his death that his role really changed. I imagine that he thought they’d have 10 or 20 years before Elizabeth became Queen. She was 21 wasn’t she? He was late 20’s I think. Look at Charles, still waiting now. Maybe he expected / hoped to “wait” for years too.

Silverfly · 10/04/2021 09:01

In an ideal world, men would routinely support women in their careers and no one would feel the need to comment.

However as we don't live in an ideal world, I think it's fair enough to recognise what he did and commend him as a role model for men with powerful wives.

donquixotedelamancha · 10/04/2021 09:05

must have been frustrating for him with a promising navy career ahead

He pursued her from the age of 13 (he was 18) because she was the heir to the throne. Prince consort was a much better 'career' option for him than minor royal of an exiled monarchy.

I'd put his actions perfectly in the feminist camp when it came to his wife.

I don't see how the royal family is anything other than a power structure of the patriarchy.

The fact that one woman in centuries happens to be first in line doesn't change the structural disadvantages in UK society which disproportionally affect women, the working class, non-white people etc.

UsedUpUsername · 10/04/2021 09:10

@Trixie78

I was going to start a thread on this. I actually loved Prince Philip, he's one of the best royals but some of the coverage has IMO been very disrespectful to the Queen. It's all 'she was a young compliant girl and she really needed his guidance, she would never have been able to do it without him' etc etc. Don't get me wrong, they've obviously had a wonderful marriage and he's supported her greatly but her achievements are hers, he's done his own work and that should be focused on.

Meh he just died so they are going to highlight that part for now. Doubt it will be more than a passing statement in a few years (and certainly not when she passes)

AdriannaP · 10/04/2021 09:11

What career did Kate give up?
Meghan was given the option to keep acting and apparently didn’t want to.
I guess Sophie Wessex had to give up her career and firm. Not sure Fergie ever had a career and Diana certainly didn’t.

sashagabadon · 10/04/2021 09:13

Well the Queen as always destined to marry someone I guess. And this man was always going to be royalty of some sort so on balance he made a good match. 74 years marriage is no mean feat.
The U.K. has had a fair few female monarchs over the years and they are the ones British people often remember the most so imo could be considered “progressive” compared to other monarchies?

YetAnotherSpartacus · 10/04/2021 09:18

Yes - lots of hints that he was if not the power behind the throne then very much the head of the family.

Gender norms, stereotyping and hierarchies are all at play.

Soontobe60 · 10/04/2021 09:22

@OppsUpsSide

Did they know she would be Queen when they wed?

Yes, her father was King

Biscuitsanddoombar · 10/04/2021 09:31

I think the coverage holds up an interesting lens to how society thinks of male & female roles & ‘sacrifices’.

There have only been 5 male consorts because the eldest male child always inherited which made queens rare. Of those, Philip II husband of Mary Tudor was a king in his own right thigh he was not given the title of king of England, William III refused point blank to not be given equal status with his wife Mary even though she was the one with the claim to the throne by birth, Prince George of Denmark husband of Queen Anne pretty much forgotten and Prince Albert the only to be given the title of Prince consort (parliament refused Victoria’s request he be made king)

I think it was a big deal back then that Philip always had to be figuratively & literally behind his wife in public. I always assumed he had far more influence over family stuff becatse it was a way of managing his feelings about always been subordinate in public and possibly because the queen was pretty busy with being queen. Unlike Prince Albert, Philip never saw state papers or sat in on official meetings.

As far sacrifice, I suppose he “sacrificed” the common expectations of society of the time ie that as a man he’d come first in all things. Equally, he was a younger son of an impoverished deposed royal family. If he hadn’t married the queen, I’m assuming he’d have a naval career and married a minor member of European aristocracy

AbsintheFriends · 10/04/2021 10:06

@AdriannaP

What career did Kate give up? Meghan was given the option to keep acting and apparently didn’t want to. I guess Sophie Wessex had to give up her career and firm. Not sure Fergie ever had a career and Diana certainly didn’t.

Kate Middleton worked as an accessories buyer for Jigsaw, which could be argued would be a the start of a well-paid and interesting career. Sarah Ferguson worked in marketing/PR I think, and Diana certainly did have a job in a kindergarten, which she apparently loved and was good at.

They're not senior roles in the admiralty, but I don't think their work should be dismissed as being insignificant, or denied altogether.

UsedUpUsername · 10/04/2021 10:12

Kate Middleton worked as an accessories buyer for Jigsaw, which could be argued would be a the start of a well-paid and interesting career

A very part-time job so it was gonna go nowhere lol