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Prince Phillip

122 replies

chickadeeee · 10/04/2021 08:35

His passing is very sad, however aibu to be annoyed about the constant reference to him 'giving things up' to be the Queen's consort.
How many women 'give up' their lives when they get married, would the conversation be the same if he were King and his wife had passed away Hmm

OP posts:
WarriorN · 10/04/2021 10:32

I think what's annoying is there wouldn't be chat about a female consort "giving things up" if it was the king's wife.

That's the narrative we don't hear when we hear this narrative.

At the same time, he's been a fantastic role model and as Babdoc says.

SelkieBeag · 10/04/2021 10:34

Well, Kate gave up freedom to spend her family's money without scrutiny! Freedom to have an opinion.

I never had a career but id never put myself in the firing line of that much scrutiny. So the idea that you're not giving up anything because you didnt have a worthy respected career is not correct.

MattyGroves · 10/04/2021 11:01

@WarriorN

I think what's annoying is there wouldn't be chat about a female consort "giving things up" if it was the king's wife.

That's the narrative we don't hear when we hear this narrative.

At the same time, he's been a fantastic role model and as Babdoc says.

Agree. A comparison you might make is Michelle Obama who gave up a pretty serious career but no one talks about her sacrifice even though the only condition she placed on it (him giving up smoking) he didn't even stick to.
YetAnotherSpartacus · 10/04/2021 11:01

I think what's annoying is there wouldn't be chat about a female consort "giving things up" if it was the king's wife

Yes - agreed! I can remember the outrage when Hilary Clinton didn't want to give it all up to be first lady but still wanted her own career - I can also remember Dennis Thatcher being ridiculed for being the husband of a woman PM.

Angrycat2768 · 10/04/2021 11:07

Barack Obama said in his tribute 'He showed the world how to be the consort to a powerful woman'. I thought his tribute was the best one overall.

JackieWeaversZoomAc · 10/04/2021 11:10

People talk all the time about how Diana, Sarah, Kate &Meghan had to "give up their lives" on entry to royal family.

Difference is they all get busy with kids & prioritising their family rather than playing polo & doing a lot of stuff outside the family.

peak2021 · 10/04/2021 11:13

It was very rare at the time so I think reasonable to be noted. Hopefully with the historical perspective.

Mrsfrumble · 10/04/2021 11:18

Diana worked in a nursery, didn’t she? That’s a proper job.

QpopTYUIop9 · 10/04/2021 11:19

I overheard in the radio yesterday someone talking at length about what he “could have been”, examples given were a corporate chairman or CEO type role. This would never ever be a topic for discussion if the sexes were reversed. So yes, the world is still very sexist. Quelle surprise.

NRCS · 10/04/2021 11:19

I don't really see why he had to give up his career, did she really need some bloke hanging around at every even as a fit 20 something? He could have stayed in the navy for at least another 10/15 years and just got on with it - or had some other career with protection officers with him if that's what it was about - I can see terrorists wanting to blow up the ship with the queen's husband on etc. And I don't see how it was particularly noble either, he was then able to spend his prime years relaxing on yaughts, playing polo, having fun with other women, travel, all funded by us/his wife.

MissBarbary · 10/04/2021 11:27

@MattyGroves

I'd put his actions perfectly in the feminist camp when it came to his wife

Well, except for the hissy fit about the kids not having his surname and the very public infidelities.

The name thing didn't reflect well on him. Possibly however it was Lord Mountbatten stirring things. I didn't know about this or that Winston Churchill, quite rightly, vetoed it.
Ihopeyourcakeisshit · 10/04/2021 11:35

I'm more than a bit eye rolley at all this talk of sacrifice and giving up stuff.
He didn't seem to do too badly from it.

Lockdownbear · 10/04/2021 11:41

@OppsUpsSide

Did they know she would be Queen when they wed?
They would have known but they didn't expect her Dad would die just 2 years later still in his 50s.

You have to take time and culture into account in the 1950s it was a time to be the Man of the House but the Queen. Few men would have taken the role of being a SAHD.

EdgeOfACoin · 10/04/2021 11:43

@UsedUpUsername

Kate Middleton worked as an accessories buyer for Jigsaw, which could be argued would be a the start of a well-paid and interesting career

A very part-time job so it was gonna go nowhere lol

Kate was very much in a damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you-don't position, iirc.

The press was always very keen to point out any time when she might be seen to be 'cashing in' on her connections. She was criticised for not working enough, yet there was also an expectation she would join Prince William for certain events. Her not-in-not-out status in the royal family before she got engaged to William was becoming untenable, and I think she ended up quitting her job (hence earning the nickname 'Waity Katie'). Kate and her family were given a pretty rough ride by the press in the years before her engagement.

If Kate hadn't dated William, and hadn't had to deal with the rubbish that went with it, she probably would have ended up with a decent career somewhere.

Flywheel · 10/04/2021 11:52

I agree. If he had married someone else I doubt I'd ever have heard of him. He sacrificed his navy career, but was given far more opportunities as a result of the wedding. The downside, having to play second fiddle to a woman. I'm sure it wasn't easy, but she was the Queen. He and his family pursued her and that role.

IloveJKRowling · 10/04/2021 11:55

Kate Middleton worked as an accessories buyer for Jigsaw, which could be argued would be a the start of a well-paid and interesting career. Sarah Ferguson worked in marketing/PR I think, and Diana certainly did have a job in a kindergarten, which she apparently loved and was good at. They're not senior roles in the admiralty, but I don't think their work should be dismissed as being insignificant, or denied altogether.

This.

Of all of these, the most important IMO is Diana's - looking after children, nurturing them is an important job. Blowing people up, not so much.

Quite liked Prince Phillip and I feel sad for the Queen because the one thing I always thought was great about them both was how much of a team they seemed to be. I think that's the most important thing, not who had the most important role, or who gave what up. They worked as a team.

It must be very hard for her now.

Floisme · 10/04/2021 12:01

I think comparisons with younger royalty are spurious. I was born in the fifties; my dad was a caring man and a loving father but he wasn't there for my birth, as was the norm. I doubt it even occurred to either him or my mum that it was an option.

This was Prince Philip's world. I can disagree with the monarchy as an institution and still acknowledge that he was a man's man, living in man's world who accepted that his role was to walk behind the Queen and that he appeared to do so with good grace. As to how well he took it in private - well only once person really knows the answer to that and I doubt she'll be telling.

As a slight aside, I find it astonishing how little we actually know about either the Queen or Prince Philip. I think that's a tribute to them both.

customwatkins · 10/04/2021 12:17

Well...he did give up his career (prematurely) and supported her, he also devoted a lifetime to public service. I don't think the praise he's receiving for supporting her role first (above his own ambitions) has got anything that do with him being a man - but rather being the queens support for 73 years, he came in to the family as an outsider, gave up everything and found a place and role for himself always putting the monarchy first.....something some of the younger royals and their spouses could learn from.

MysteriousAffairAtStyles · 10/04/2021 12:25

@Babdoc

Well, you can look at it negatively like that, OP. Or you can see the positive - that he was a great role model for men, showing that they can prioritise their wife’s career while still being an admirable bloke with interests of his own. And I think he would have been the first to dismiss all the eulogies and talk of his “sacrifices” - he would have seen it as simply doing his duty.
I agree wholeheartedly. Considerable media mentions of a man who gave up a promising career to play ‘second fiddle’ to a woman in a more powerful position, especially given at a time when this was even rarer than it is now, is good to see.
VanGoghsDog · 10/04/2021 12:34

I found myself annoyed at them referring to him as a "hands on dad", I mean, like that's an extra thing? Women don't get congratulated for being hands on. Given how little many dad's do, if women weren't hands on a lot of kids would probably just die.

MeltsAway · 10/04/2021 14:21

How many women 'give up' their lives when they get married, would the conversation be the same if he were King and his wife had passed away

Well quite.

And - from what one gathers (although it's basically gossip) - he wasn't averse to flinging his 'sacrifice' in his wife's face on occasion.

MeltsAway · 10/04/2021 14:23

I don't think the praise he's receiving for supporting her role first (above his own ambitions) has got anything that do with him being a man

But it absolutely has!

The point is, that if you reverse the sexes, it would be rare indeed that eulogies for a wife to a king would be phrased in this way.

Pookah83 · 10/04/2021 14:27

On vacation I stayed in an Airbnb flat across from one of their palaces. I was struck at the shameful juxtaposition of wealth and poverty. Maybe not for those who rent out the flats but those that have lived in them.

I think Philip did all right for himself.

PurpleWh1teGreen · 10/04/2021 15:27

I think it's a mirror of the behind every successful man... quote.

The Queen was 25 when she ascended the throne and surrounded by stuffy, Edwardian courtiers. I'm certain that his role supporting her and his dynamism has been critical to her success. He should be given credit for it.

AskingQuestionsAllTheTime · 10/04/2021 16:43

@Trixie78

I was going to start a thread on this. I actually loved Prince Philip, he's one of the best royals but some of the coverage has IMO been very disrespectful to the Queen. It's all 'she was a young compliant girl and she really needed his guidance, she would never have been able to do it without him' etc etc. Don't get me wrong, they've obviously had a wonderful marriage and he's supported her greatly but her achievements are hers, he's done his own work and that should be focused on.
The World Service last night and this morning had programmes about him, his early life, what he did, what his career was before he gave it up, his work for various charities and institutions, the DoE Award Scheme, and so on, and not a lot about her or her needing his support (as opposed to him giving it) or whatever. Lots of clips of him saying things, sfa about her except as allowing him to do stuff. Oh, and that he stood a few paces behind her as a rule, deferring to her and never trying to take the limelight when they appeared together.

I didn't hear anyone saying anything about her needing his guidance; maybe I was simply half-asleep and missed all that.

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