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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Alba

154 replies

howard97A · 28/03/2021 12:26

"Alba … appears to be a home for those who fear that gender self-identification for trans people poses a threat to women's rights."

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-56555096

OP posts:
MissBarbary · 29/03/2021 15:37

In relation to Salmond being "exonerated" I find myself in the odd position of actually agreeing with what Sturgeon said about him.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 29/03/2021 15:47

That he didn't have a sexist bone in his body?
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/sturgeon-rejects-sexist-jibe-about-salmond-8z359l5vh2m

haggistramp · 29/03/2021 16:03

Mn is notorious for its anti Scottish independence stance, so no surprise there is little support for Alba here. Apparently once a man has been accused of a sex crime, he is forevermore a guilty sex pest regardless of what the courts find or what evidence there is.

Callixte · 29/03/2021 16:14

My apologgies about "exonerated" - I'm not a native English speaker and I had understood it to mean cleared of legal blame or guilt, which Salmond was. I understand sometimes the Scottish legal system uses different words in different ways and I may have made a mistake here. My point still stands: as far as the public knows, he is not guilty of a crime.

MissBarbary, thanks so much, but I didn't ask a how a feminist would vote because I thought you were one and wanted your personal advice, but because this is a board about feminism.

ArabellaScott · 29/03/2021 16:14

Aye, right you are, haggistramp. Hmm

stumbledin · 29/03/2021 16:22

I think being cautious about Salmond has nothing whatsoever to do with whether anyone supports Scottish Independence.

The problem is neither Salmond or Sturgeon have come out of this very well.

The issue of independence doesn't belong to two individuals.

NecessaryScene1 · 29/03/2021 16:25

The issue of independence doesn't belong to two individuals.

Nor, indeed, does the issue of women's rights.

alpenguin · 29/03/2021 16:27

I cannot bring myself to vote for the man. I don’t know any feminists who would, although I see a fair few here.

7 years ago I’d have said differently although I was never particularly comfortable with him as a person, as a politician he was cunning and as an orator he could be captivating. He had great appeal back then but he fell from grace. His time has passed. His ego has gone into overdrive and he doesn’t want sturgeon, who managed to get yes to over 50% in the polls, to get the credit. It’s his vanity project but our lives. Her moderate approach, too slow for many quite abusive cyber-nats was working in terms of numbers and converting wavering voters. People became impatient when the numbers were showing consistently ahead for yes and he saw that as his opportunity to return and that is all about his ego. He wants the glory.

I think, and I respect others disagree, that he has done and could do more considerable damage to soft yes/no voters with all this media furore around him and his slating of NS. Any other reputable pro-Indy party I’d seriously consider but his band of Merry men (many of whole are questionable) are a complete turn off

MissBarbary · 29/03/2021 16:30

MissBarbary, thanks so much, but I didn't ask a how a feminist would vote because I thought you were one and wanted your personal advice, but because this is a board about feminism

I'm not quite sure what point you are trying to make. I wasn't giving you my personal advice beyond mentioning being feminist wasn't my main concern for who to vote for, but if it were, then at the moment- Conservative.

I'm not sure how any reply given to you is not a personal reply- the board doesn't have its own voice.

MissBarbary · 29/03/2021 16:34

[quote ItsAllGoingToBeFine]That he didn't have a sexist bone in his body?
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/sturgeon-rejects-sexist-jibe-about-salmond-8z359l5vh2m[/quote]
No. Ms Sturgeon has re- evaluated her opinion of Salmond- showing rather surprising but welcome clarity of thought.

BBC News - Nicola Sturgeon: 'Significant questions' over Salmond election bid
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-56548830

Thecatonthemat · 29/03/2021 18:12

If I were in Scotland I would vote for the least worst in any party on an individual basis. Where I live there is always the option to post a blank paper...ie don’t want any of the candidates.- always counted.

OhBuggerandArse · 29/03/2021 18:16

A good list of reasons why feminist women might consider the Alba Party here:

twitter.com/HotchkissRhona/status/1376545958402605056

Pookah83 · 29/03/2021 18:39

I'm an American who will be voting in Scotland for the first time and I am trying to educate myself about the different parties here.

Based on what I have gleaned so far it really seems like voting for the least bad option. In the American presidential election I voted for Biden with the same thoughts of it being choosing the lesser evil. Would a vote for the Alba party at least show SNP that they are alienating part of their voter base?

I care about independence because Scotland seems to have little representation based on past results of General elections and imho leaving the EU was a mistake (an understatement.) Climate change is a huge concern but Scotland does fairly well with that I think. Free speech is important to me as well as being able to speak about biological reality. I also think the monarchy is extremely outdated which is probably not surprising coming from an American.

My husband and I discussed the proposed strategy of the party and it seems clever, i.e. maximizing the votes for the regional lists and obtaining an independence supermajority. I plan to attend the online women's conference to hear more and also for them to reveal more information about policies and candidates.

Tamingofthehamster · 29/03/2021 19:06

Pookah - we’ve had lots of Scottish PMs. Before the Labour lost their vote share to the SNP there wasn’t such an issue. I don’t see you can think Brexit is bad but Indy would be good ( as a non-Scot so therefore no sentimental reasons)?

ArabellaScott · 29/03/2021 19:15

[quote OhBuggerandArse]A good list of reasons why feminist women might consider the Alba Party here:

twitter.com/HotchkissRhona/status/1376545958402605056[/quote]
Rhona Hotchkiss is fantastic.

ArabellaScott · 29/03/2021 19:22

If I wasn't worried about independence, I'd probably go Tories 1st vote, Alba 2nd vote.

As it is, I think I find the idea of independence under the SNP terrifying, so I'm going to go ... maybe Tories 1st vote Labour 2nd.

Maduixa · 29/03/2021 19:31

I don’t see you can think Brexit is bad but Indy would be good (as a non-Scot so therefore no sentimental reasons)?

I'm a Scot and I think Brexit (well, specifically Scotland being out of the European Single Market) was and is disastrous. I'm wide open to Scottish independence. I don't think my reasons are sentimental - I was raised mostly abroad by pretty staunch unionists, and I've also had the luck to spend a lot of time in some European countries that relatively recently became independent (and some of them have joined the EU). I don't think that having wanted the UK to stay in the EU and now wanting Scotland to be independent from the ex-EU UK and in the EU or EFTA in its own right (which is the only way it can be, now) is a contradictory position. I don't understand the argument that it is contradictory; it seems like a false equivalence to me.

MissBarbary · 29/03/2021 19:48

[quote OhBuggerandArse]A good list of reasons why feminist women might consider the Alba Party here:

twitter.com/HotchkissRhona/status/1376545958402605056[/quote]
Is feminism the only reason for selecting who to vote for?

MissBarbary · 29/03/2021 19:52

I don’t see you can think Brexit is bad but Indy would be good (as a non-Scot so therefore no sentimental reasons)?

I live in Scotland and have no sentimental reasons for wanting to remain in the Union. I can't get my head round the idea that Brexit is terrible but breaking up the UK is fine, and I was a Remainer.

I don't actually think Brexit will be the disaster the Remainers make it out to be. There was an awful lot wrong with the EU. I'm not now clamouring to get back in.

The idea that a separatist Scotland can just pitch up and get admitted to the EU on reasonable terms seems extremely sentimental.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 29/03/2021 19:55

Is feminism the only reason for selecting who to vote for?

It's certainly an important one. Recognising the issues women have is pretty important to many women. I'd say that voting for a party that doesn't know what a woman is would be a fairly foolish move. As far as I can tell if you want women's rights and support indy, Alba, if you support women's rights and are a unionist, Tories.

Maduixa · 29/03/2021 19:55

Is feminism the only reason for selecting who to vote for?

Obviously not, but is it so perplexing that people on "Feminism Chat" would ask about feminist perspectives?

Pookah83 · 29/03/2021 20:45

Apparently the constituency where my husband was raised hasn't voted Labour or Conservative in 62 years. The 2005 Labour win is also 16 years ago. We may have differing opinions on whether or not that is a long time. In America 4-8 years seems to be about as long as we can stand one government.

To me there is a massive difference between the support for Conservatives in Scotland and the rest of the UK. I believe the political discourse in Scotland would change once independent because the parties would not be beholden to the parent UK parties. SNP might have more competition after as well since they can't use the single issue of Indy anymore.

I don't think the PM needs to be Scottish just that Scotland doesn't seem to align very well with how the rest of the UK votes and that leads to lack of representation. Voting reform would be a big issue for me but I haven't seen any talk of that. First past the post isn't great.

Brexit is a big reason I am for Indy because Scotland voted remain and there was misinformation about leaving/staying in the EU at the Indy referendum. Brexit seems very isolationist and I don't think that is good. The federal system of the EU is preferable to me.

Tamingofthehamster · 29/03/2021 21:42

The problem for me is that the SNP seems to choose candidates on their malleability and willingness to tow the party line rather than think for themselves. Therefore they don’t particularly seem to want intellectual MPs or MSPs as they’re more likely to argue back. I hate Sturgeon, but can see that she is obviously clever. I’m just not so sure about the next level down.

ArabellaScott · 29/03/2021 21:57

@Tamingofthehamster

The problem for me is that the SNP seems to choose candidates on their malleability and willingness to tow the party line rather than think for themselves. Therefore they don’t particularly seem to want intellectual MPs or MSPs as they’re more likely to argue back. I hate Sturgeon, but can see that she is obviously clever. I’m just not so sure about the next level down.
Yes. That top circle is vanishing small.
ArabellaScott · 29/03/2021 21:58

Noting that Andy Wightman is standing as an independent for H&I, after resigning from the Greens over their farcical anti-women stance.