Children born in the wrong bodies

[Wandawomble]

I’m confused about this - how can children be born in the wrong bodies and why are schools teaching this? Why are adults including people at the BBC, Guardian and Pink News pushing this idea?
How are doctors pushing this too, or members of the Green Party, SNP and Labour?
Where is the science to say that children are born in the wrong bodies?

Welcome to the party Wanda! If you have a search through feminist chat you’ll find lots of posts on this, but very little - if any - actual scientific evidence to support the ideology of a soul outwith a physical body.

I think the dfe specifically said not to teach this actually.

Yes it's appalling.

Nobody is born in the wrong bodies unless you believe that who you are and what you are develop seperately and are put together by some external force before birth. It's complete and utter nonsense spouted by the scientifically illiterate.

I’ve been here for a while and it’s a question that I think needs sunlight all in one place. A version of which needs to go on the AIBU at some point.

I thought Mermaids had said this was no longer a thing? that it had in fact never been a thing and we were just misinterpreting it all the time they actually said 'children born in the wrong body'?

The less we push the gender stereotypes the better

Of course a young girl is going to look at the misogyny of the world and want to reject the notion of expecting to be sexually harassed/paid less/expected to do the childcare shit work/valued mostly on her looks.

@FatCatThinCat

Nobody is born in the wrong bodies unless you believe that who you are and what you are develop seperately and are put together by some external force before birth. It's complete and utter nonsense spouted by the scientifically illiterate.

Exactly. If you believe that your body is created separately from your "self" I suppose it would be possible that your "self" had entered the wrong body. But your sex is determined from the very start of the making of your body! The fastest sperm wins so unless there was some cheating going on in the sperm race it isn't possible to be born in the wrong body.

I kind of get I don't really why an adult might think life would be better as the opposite sex. I would love to be able to see standing up, anywhere.
But being born in the wrong body is absolute tosh IMO. I think it's a natural progression from being able to have plastic surgery to change your face, have your teeth veneered, bigger boobs/penis etc. If I can change all that, why can't I also take tablets that make me change sex.

No child is born in the wrong body and there's no evidence to support claims they can. Government guidelines state the wrong body message should not be taught.

*wee standing up, obvs.
I can see standing up perfectly well

And if there are no children born in the wrong body then why are we stopping their puberty with drugs?

@Wandawomble

And if there are no children born in the wrong body then why are we stopping their puberty with drugs?

Yes, good question.

If a child “feels” they are born in the wrong body does that mean they are imagining it? In which case why are we drugging them and altering their bodies?

@Wandawomble

And if there are no children born in the wrong body then why are we stopping their puberty with drugs?

That is the 64 million dollar question.

That is probably also the answer.

I can only imagine how crap it must be for children with disabilities having to listen to otherwise healthy peers buying into the suggestion they have somehow been 'born in the wrong body' for being too masculine or feminine.

Welcome to our world Wanda

@Wandawomble

And if there are no children born in the wrong body then why are we stopping their puberty with drugs?

So they can 'pass' better for the other sex as an adult. Except - if that is the case, why the same treatment for both male and female children? If only the Tavistock had collected data on this massive experiment

According to the experts no one is born in the wrong body.

Dysphoria is not a requirement to be considered trans

Its not about stereotypes either

We still however don't know what it is or why we need to medicate bodies that are healthy and apparently not remotely wrong.

If a child “feels” they are born in the wrong body does that mean they are imagining it? In which case why are we drugging them and altering their bodies?

Well, yes, the whole thing has lost touch with reality.

But gender dysphoria, as a specific type of body dysphoria is real. And body alteration can be a valid treatment. The problem is it's an extreme one. Therapy, or even just waiting for it to resolve during puberty as it usually does, is far less risky. Even another sort of drug treatment would likely be less risky than cross-sex-hormones+surgery. (There has been some reported success with one drug that I forget, but such research is now frowned upon, nonsensically).

And we've got this social contagion problem where all sorts of typical (particularly female) body issues are misinterpreted as simple "gender dysphoria". The numbers of treatments is skyrocketing, and the number of detransitioners that it didn't help is rapidly following.

Actual gender dysphoria is rare. More general body issues in pubescent girls are common. Huge amount of misdiagnosis apparently happening.

Check out this recent documentary: .

Some great contributions in there - I particularly like all Dr David Bell's stuff. He's ex-Tavistock, and has been speaking out a lot about how everything's going wrong because the complexity of childhood development is being forgotten at the altar of this "gender" thing.

How is gender dysphoria different from anorexia?

NHS Website says

Gender dysphoria is a term that describes a sense of unease that a person may have because of a mismatch between their biological sex and their gender identity.

This sense of unease or dissatisfaction may be so intense it can lead to depression and anxiety and have a harmful impact on daily life.

and

Anorexia is an eating disorder and serious mental health condition.

People who have anorexia try to keep their weight as low as possible by not eating enough food or exercising too much, or both. This can make them very ill because they start to starve.

They often have a distorted image of their bodies, thinking they're fat even when they're underweight.

Men and women of any age can get anorexia, but it's most common in young women and typically starts in the mid-teens.

How is gender dysphoria different from anorexia?

Correct question. Good luck finding a coherent answer from people who are on board with the current gender approach.

You will find inverse correlation - anorexia has declined as gender dysphoria has gone up in young women.

Young women are particularly prone to social contagion, and the way they express their mental health issues changes in different eras due to that. Gender dysphoria is this era's primary focus, and it's probably one of the least healthy ever.

We'd already managed to figure out the contagion thing for anorexia, so "pro-ana" content was cracked down on quite hard in the early days of the Web. But "pro-GD" content is much worse than that ever was.

@Wandawomble

How is gender dysphoria different from anorexia?

I think it's mainly male people who feel that they are "in the wrong body", anorexia affects (effects?) females. Male issues are seen as more important.

Definitely a license to print money for the drug companies, leaving aside anything else. If someone is convinced that taking your drug for the rest of their lives is vital for their whole sense of self then you are on to a winner.