Gender bending. Documentary on the telly.

[PurpleHoodie]

This Morning is promoting a programme about The Blitz Club.

When gender bending was all the rage and very 'Pop'.

When people understood female and Male AND gender bending.

The TRAs are going to hate it. Or not understand it. The young TRAs will have their eyes opened to who the older (to them) LGB/GC people are.

Get ready for the narc' rage.

This thread just shows what a load of bollocks gender is. There is biological sex, and then there's clothes, they're two completely different things.

This thread just shows what a load of bollocks gender is. There is biological sex, and then there's clothes, they're two completely different things.

'This thread just shows what a load of bollocks ice cream is. There is fruit, and then there's bicycles, they're two completely different things.'

Really not making sense there.

@Evarish

No, I am trying to understand why anyone would promote ideas that in my life time in the U.K. would have reduced my access to education and work, and still would in many parts of the world. Calling that a ‘transphobic dog whistle’ without explanation is just shutting down communication.

How is something that doesn't exist that's solely used to point to, quote, 'gender woo weirdo's and straight people with blue hair who are trying to be special', capable of reducing your access to anything?

Look at the past year. See how women have been adversely affected by the pandemic. Why is this? Because most women are forced to make compromises to care for children, and this starts with maternity leave. Because women have had to give birth alone. Because women need access to the morning after pill. Because women have a shorter fertile period and are more affected by restrictions on IVF. Because women are less likely to be employed in industries that have been allowed to stay open like building and more likely to do low paid service jobs (again - see childcare).

My rights are completely and absolutely dependent on my ability to fight sex discrimination. I can tell you that when the primarily male government forgot to think about childcare it was because they assumed women would just quietly sort things out without complaining (gender expectation). I need sex based rights. I need words that have clear meanings. Gender can sod off.

Is there a legitimate argument that someone who is male but feels female can not conform to the stereotypes of femininity and so express himself/herself by wearing masculine clothes, playing rugby and downing pints at the weekend?

Going to completely ignore the lingo you use and say that yes, a woman who wears masculine clothes, plays rugby and downs pints in the weekends is entirely a woman, regardless of whether she's cis or not.

Brits talking about colonizing anything really is the epitome of irony.

How is that relevant to men wanting to colonise women’s spaces because they’re having a Shania Twain moment? Please educate me.

Ach, sorry got it now, it’s about the use of power to subjugate. Quite a good analogy now I think about it.

How is that relevant to men wanting to colonise women’s spaces because they’re having a Shania Twain moment? Please educate me.

For one, no one's trying to colonise women's spaces, for two, trans women aren't men, three, your echo chamber makes the same argument roll out over and over, at least pick a different song.

a woman who wears masculine clothes, plays rugby and downs pints in the weekends is entirely a woman, regardless of whether she's cis or not.

Yes you’re right, even if they identify as a trans man, they are still a woman.

Well they’re not women and they shouldn’t be using their privilege to be trying to colonise our single sex spaces, as you rightly pointed out.

And if you want to know when language is important, look at the recent reluctance of some MPs to accept that maternity rights are related to sex.

Yes! As he and Marilyn said on a rado/magazine interview a couple of years ago. They are men, gay men, feminine gay men in appearance. They ain't trans, don't want to be transed. And they took quite a bit of stick for it, both branded Truscum, iirr.

If it at all happened then the people who used the word truscum were just flinging in any word of a group they didn't like as truscum by default indicates someone who is trans.

No one's trying to get feminine gay men 'transed', but you won't actually accept that statement no matter how many times it's repeated because the default assumption is that trans women or girls are either feminine gay men with internalized homophobia or predatory straight men trying to 'colonise' women's spaces.

For one, no one's trying to colonise women's spaces, But you are trying to enforce language, aren't you?

And yes, TRA actions are about colonisation of all things female, all things woman!

Yes you’re right, even if they identify as a trans man, they are still a woman.

I was talking about women, not men.

And yes, TRA actions are about colonisation of all things female, all things woman!

Repeating it until you're blue in the face doesn't make it true. Trans rights activists are not colonising anything.

So much control over language... so much insistence on only1 reality!

Why?

Transwomen are male, men.

I wasn't lying about the slurs thrown at Boy George and Marylin, at the same time as some well known transwomen who say they are trasnwomen, not women! Here, magazines, newspapers, interviews etc.

No one's trying to get feminine gay men 'transed', Really? OK!

Yes Evarish, me too.
Repeating it until you're blue in the face doesn't make it true.
I’m glad you can see that, but then you went on to repeat yourself anyway?

Look at the past year. See how women have been adversely affected by the pandemic.
Actually, I would argue that its men that have been adversely affected simply because they are more likely to die from covid. I've heard this is because our disease fighting is connected to the x chromosome, the fact that females have two x chromosomes has helped them cope with covid. I would be very surprised if trans woman didn't have the same death rate from covid as men.

Yes, it's both.

One sex due to biology, the other due to social norms!

Deviating from social norms can't save you from increased Covid RR, you can't identify out of that!

I would be very surprised if trans woman didn't have the same death rate from covid as men.

You might be right, unfortunately I don’t think Transwomens chromosomes have been taking their re-education very seriously, they seem to have stuck with sex and science rather than gender and ideology

@Kendodd

Look at the past year. See how women have been adversely affected by the pandemic. Actually, I would argue that its men that have been adversely affected simply because they are more likely to die from covid. I've heard this is because our disease fighting is connected to the x chromosome, the fact that females have two x chromosomes has helped them cope with covid. I would be very surprised if trans woman didn't have the same death rate from covid as men.

Also true - health is another reason why sex is so obviously more important than gender. However there are now reports that women are more affected by long Covid.

There is fruit, and then there's bicycles, they're two completely different things.'

There is the human male and then there is the human female, they're two completely different things.

Sex - the reason why a world organised around the default male doesn’t suit me.

Gender - the social expectations that oppress me.

Gender isn't 'I'm masculine therefore I'm a boy' or 'I'm feminine therefore I'm a girl', which is the conclusion you seem to jump to, rather than 'I'm a woman/man/non-binary because this is the word and group I feel addresses who I am whereas the others don't'.

So when Rachel Dolezal says that African-American is the word and group that addresses who she is, that makes her a person of colour? Surely that cannot be right?

Gender identity ideology - justification for enforcement of gender and removal of language necessary to talk about sex.

Again, quite possible to be trans without insisting that sex classes don’t exist. The slogan ‘Trans women are women’ removes language necessary to talk about sex.