How to identify the similar-minded women at work?

[SybillTrelawney]

I'm feeling suffocated by the dominance of gender ideology at work, and I want to find any female colleagues who feel similarly (assuming there are some), partly to feel less alone, and partly so that I can speak up about my concerns knowing that it's not just me. I've talked to some male colleagues who think it's ridiculous, but they tend to just stay out of it because it's not worth the hassle. Unfortunately the people who actually get involved in "employee activism" and anything relating to diversity initiatives seem to be almost exclusively very woke and very TWAW, and so theirs are the only voices that get heard, and they make it a very uncomfortable environment for anyone who doesn't subscribe to the orthodoxy.

My company is quite large (1000-ish?), so I'd like to believe there are others; though it's quite a male-dominated workplace, and the vast majority of women there are under the age of 35 (as am I), so that makes me less hopeful. Does anyone have any suggestions for how to find them?

Read a JK Rowling book in your tea break, and leave it prominently displayed on your desk. Carry an “adult human female” bag.
Start innocent conversations about why on earth rapists are allowed to choose a women’s prison to serve their sentence, and watch the responses you get?

I work in a male dominated , scientific environment and have no need to out myself as the men clearly have no truck with it. Eg volunteered to identify as women to sort out the sex inbalance

JK Rowling book a good shout, zero risk strategy.

I think the diversity stuff doesnt work well in largely male environments, particularly science based rather than silicon valley where they love it and love policing it.
My husband's work tried introducing diversity stuff, committees and pronouns and it all got dropped as everyone ignored it and no one volunteered for any committees.
My work place is mixed and most people are openly GC.
In a large company I'd just chat to people and maybe make an occasional comment but look after yourself and your income.

Wouldn't it be useful if we could all use some kind of sign that means nothing, so we'd be invisible to everyone except those in the know?

A narrow purple ribbon tied around the handle of a handbag, maybe? Almost invisible to anyone who wasn't looking for it. An emerald green scarf dangling over the back of an office chair or worn during a Zoom. A copy of Mary Wollestoncraft's A Vindication of the Rights of Women left on a desk or prominent on the bookshelf for Teams meetings. I've just checked on Amazon and currently there's a copy with an orange cover. How about leaving an orange-covered book or an orange-coloured file on your desk? Could be anything, could be empty. You could take any old book and wrap it in a sheet of orange card or paper. Or just carry an orange file around with you wherever you go. Orange stands out: best chance of other women noticing, perhaps. Just keep passing the word on the every GC woman you know. It would be wonderful to walk into the office, wouldn't it, and be able to see a dozen orange files and green scarves that are invisible to most of your colleagues.

I think there is a good balance , with the trans people reporting feeling very supported, it really is just the extreme side of things that is objected to ( and the local transwoman was part of that )

"Carry an “adult human female” bag."

Too obvious I think. JK Rowling OK.

Make it a Strike book - even more under the radar!

I do very much like the idea of the green scarves, purple ribbons and subversive copies of Mary’s book

Hi Sybill, I too work in tech, although in a small company and in one in which we are too busy to talk about much other than work.

My daughter is early 20s and gets frustrated that all her friends share woke/be kind messages. It's an incredibly hard orthodoxy to argue against because people are scared of being on TWSOH.

Just realised I assumed you meant a tech company when you said large and male dominated!

How to find other feminists: Quite simple.

Suggest setting up a woman-only group, or a feminist group, see who goes for it. Say 'women's rights', use the word 'woman'.

Make no mention, at all, of males, when discussing women. Clearly and calmly focus on women.

Remember your focus is on women. You need use no qualifying words, no concessions to 'not all men', no waffle about identity or thoughts about men's feelings. Men are free to set up their own groups if they wish.

Feminists will show up. Anyone who tries to get you fired, sends death or rape threats, starts whanging on about inclusion of males - not them.

You could also put your JK Rowling book in one of these?

www.redbubble.com/i/tote-bag/1984-Thought-Criminal-by-tasharosekhan/42673322.PJQVX?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=g.pla+notset&country_code=GB&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIi7rx0aj47gIVCbLtCh1ivAICEAQYASABEgKF1fD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

I work in a male dominated kind of "rough" industry. They liked Zuby's videos. Can be shared as a joke on non-work whatsapp with one or two male colleague friends. Do no more. They will spread it amongst the men themselves. Same with anything short silly or clearly insane (like some of the sports pictures).

Then wait for them to raise the topic with women.

A transwoman joined a tech team I work with regularly. I asked the men individually and quietly to please reassure the TW that they'd get no trouble in the men's toilets or men's showers. Pointed out that we have several Muslim and Hindu women in the tech teams who would say nothing but would stop using facilities if TW were present. They got it easily. They happily chatted to the TW. They took pride in being the kind of men who can tolerate difference. No trouble. That was a year ago.

There are more non-woke-beards than little OJs. They judge the motivations of other men far more harshly than we do. They can get away with it too in a way that we just can't. They can be woken up.

It is shit to have to walk behind men but it does work.

A transwoman joined a tech team I work with regularly. I asked the men individually and quietly to please reassure the TW that they'd get no trouble in the men's toilets or men's showers. Pointed out that we have several Muslim and Hindu women in the tech teams who would say nothing but would stop using facilities if TW were present. They got it easily. They happily chatted to the TW. They took pride in being the kind of men who can tolerate difference. No trouble. That was a year ago.

That's brilliant. I wish we could see more men setting up initiatives like this. 'You can pee next to me', was it? Something similar - men welcoming non gender-conforming males, showing support for men who may wish to present differently than other men, etc.

The little OJs of this world like to make out that men are them or gammons or Reese-Moggs. Totally untrue.

The vast majority of men are decent human beings who can genuinely want no discrimination as well as seeing the problem with gender ideology.

We necessarily spend so much mental energy on the illiberal wokey misogynists and the predators taking advantage that it is easy to lose sight of ordinary men who are mostly reasonable people trying to be decent human-beings who will readily become GC allies.

@ArabellaScott

How to find other feminists: Quite simple.

Suggest setting up a woman-only group, or a feminist group, see who goes for it. Say 'women's rights', use the word 'woman'.

Make no mention, at all, of males, when discussing women. Clearly and calmly focus on women.

Remember your focus is on women. You need use no qualifying words, no concessions to 'not all men', no waffle about identity or thoughts about men's feelings. Men are free to set up their own groups if they wish.

Feminists will show up. Anyone who tries to get you fired, sends death or rape threats, starts whanging on about inclusion of males - not them.

My worry would be that it becomes a magnet for the genderists. Even if no men turn up, I would bet money that you'd immediately get emails from the woke contingent asking whether it's for "all" women.

I would mention reading or take in Invisible Women. I have managed to identify several like minded women in my workplace by reading it.

I love the idea of secret signals to find fellow GC women. I'm an academic and younger colleagues tend to be woke AF but it's wonderful to talk to fellow oldies. We tend to just explode with GC talk when we find each other

I think a JKRowling book is the best. It's easy to start up a conversation with someone over a book without outing yourself, to see how the land lies.

At the same time, you can't be accused of anything by having a Harry Potter book!

"Hi HR I want to make a complaint about Suzie in Development. She's making the workplace unsafe for trans people."
"Oh? What has she been doing?"
"Well she has been reading a children's book by a well known author."

In fact, this would be brilliant bait for the sort of person who would complain. They'd make themselves look like a total numpty!!

Have you tried a secret coded message in the paper?

@Darcinian

I work in a male dominated kind of "rough" industry. They liked Zuby's videos. Can be shared as a joke on non-work whatsapp with one or two male colleague friends. Do no more. They will spread it amongst the men themselves. Same with anything short silly or clearly insane (like some of the sports pictures).

Then wait for them to raise the topic with women.

A transwoman joined a tech team I work with regularly. I asked the men individually and quietly to please reassure the TW that they'd get no trouble in the men's toilets or men's showers. Pointed out that we have several Muslim and Hindu women in the tech teams who would say nothing but would stop using facilities if TW were present. They got it easily. They happily chatted to the TW. They took pride in being the kind of men who can tolerate difference. No trouble. That was a year ago.

There are more non-woke-beards than little OJs. They judge the motivations of other men far more harshly than we do. They can get away with it too in a way that we just can't. They can be woken up.

It is shit to have to walk behind men but it does work.

So, to summarise, the men should be tolerant of trans people, so you don’t have to?

'You can pee next to me' making male spaces safe and inclusive is an excellent approach 👍

So, to summarise, the men should be tolerant of trans people, so you don’t have to?

The men should be tolerant of gender-nonconforming men so that these men can use the men's facilities. So women aren't asked to share with men.

Back to networking with like-minded gc people, there will definitely be others within the 1000 or so, just probably keeping quiet, or haven't realised how much it affects women.

I like the idea of suggesting a women’s group. You could tie it in to IWD which is coming up soon.

So, to summarise, the men should be tolerant of trans people, so you don’t have to?

Damn! Outed! Going out of my way to encourage other people to accept transwomen clearly demonstrates my bigotry.

What planet are you on?

Said TW and I get along well in the virtual workplace. I am sure we will go out for team drinks together again when the pandemic is over. No hatred. Mutual acceptance. It's great you should try it.