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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Urgent - Ministerial Maternity Bill this Thursday 11/02

148 replies

ConservativesForWomen · 09/02/2021 12:21

#SixWords
For the word ‘person’ substitute ‘woman’

It is beyond belief that it has taken governments 103 years to notice women in government may have babies. We are very pleased to see long overdue recognition of this fact.

But it is unacceptable that this bill talks about ‘pregnant people’ and makes no mention of women at all. This is not a situation that will ever apply to a male minister, so why the obfuscation of language?

The Equality Act 2010 is very clear; it talks about pregnancy and maternity using ordinary language. Women. She. Her.

We are encouraging everyone to contact their MP as a matter of urgency; there is less than 48 hours before this bill is presented. See our example letter here:
docs.google.com/document/d/1B24BPG-OL9-3I3vvm_mfR6UnVjVAkVXj6KI2gHG_dUY/edit?usp=sharing

Amend it as you see fit, even telephone your MP if you are able to. Language matters. Sex matters. Women must not be erased. Please email or call your MP TODAY. Share this post across your networks; it affects all women and all political parties.

This excellent article by @MForstater gives more detail. (Thank you Maya).

mforstater.medium.com/pregnant-people-in-parliament-62adaa521c2d

“Giving birth is not like chairing a meeting. It cannot be done by a person of either sex.”

Less than 48 hours to go. #SixWords (with respect to @JohannLamont) and with thanks to @StoatlyL for initiating this and providing the draft email text.

twitter.com/CforWomenUK/status/1359109798944534537?s=20

www.facebook.com/Conservatives-For-Women-104300591505734

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
Sexnotgender · 12/02/2021 12:22

@hanahsaunt

My appalling MP to whom I wrote yesterday, replied at 7.10am to note that he agreed with me, and suggested that the wording was a clumsy clerical error. I am pleasantly surprised. He notes that the wording will be corrected during the committee stage.
That’s good to hear.

It’s rips my knitting though that this shit is attempted to be passed off as an innocent mistake when it’s so obviously deliberate.

Coffeeandcocopops · 12/02/2021 15:04

It’s so deliberate. Someone decided to change the words. Were they influenced/instructed? It it had got through think of the damage it could have done.

dotoallasyouwouldbedoneby · 12/02/2021 19:20

@crushedsilk

Great speech from Sir John Hayes as well! Even quoted Orwell. Great to see men fighting back.
It's so embarrassing that women have to rely on men to do this for us! What is wrong with these (mainly Labour) women MPs?
WeeTorag · 12/02/2021 20:26

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BaronessWrongCrowd · 12/02/2021 20:36

@WeeTorag you might want to ask MNHQ to delete one of your photos as its identifying.

I think that your MP is talking about filibustering. I believe It's where someone keeps talking and wasting time so time essentially runs out so no votes can be taken on the bill/amendment.

I remember an MP doing it a while back and he got in hot water as the bill was very important and his waffling prevented it from being passed. Also sound like your MP was not impressed with the female MP/MP's who kept talking, we all know who it was (looking at you SC from Labour).

MerchedCymru · 12/02/2021 20:56

WeeTorag

Stella Creasy talked endlessly about women and pregnancy and equality which mean that there was no time to vote on the amendments. No doubt Labour members didn't want to have to get off that particular gender-neutral fence.

Penny Mordant incorrectly stated that it would in any case be illegal to use the word 'woman' since the House was abiding by Jack Straw's 'gender-neutral' guidelines. They specifically allow for sex-specific words to be used for sex-specific issues. Like maternity. So that's a red herring.

On 22nd, after the recess, the bill goes to the Lords where there are more allies willing to put forward more woman-type amendments. Then it comes back to the Commons.

So it's not over yet.

WeeTorag · 12/02/2021 21:07

@ConservativesForWomen

These are the MPs who are supporting amendments in our favour, in case anyone wants to thank them!

Amendment 16: Clause 1, page 1, line 14, leave out “person” and insert “minister”

Jackie Doyle-Price Conservative
Sir John Hayes Conservative
Ben Bradley Conservative
Tonia Antoniazzi Labour
Rosie Duffield Labour
Cherilyn Mackrory Conservative
Andrew Rosindell Conservative
Fiona Bruce Conservative
Stephen Metcalfe Conservative
Bob Blackman Conservative

Amendment 18: Clause 1, page 1, line 14, leave out “person” and insert “woman”

Sir John Hayes Conservative
Miriam Cates Conservative
Lee Anderson Conservative
Alexander Stafford Conservative
Ben Bradley Conservative
Tom Hunt Conservative
Sir Edward Leigh Conservative
Karl McCartney Conservative
Brendan Clarke-Smith Conservative

Tonia Antoniazzi Labour
Rosie Duffield Labour
Andrew Rosindell Conservative
Andrew Lewer Conservative
Fiona Bruce Conservative
Danny Kruger Conservative
Chris Loder Conservative
Robbie Moore Conservative
Dr Kieran Mullan Conservative
Stephen Metcalfe Conservative
Bob Blackman Conservative
Martin Vickers Conservative

Amendment 17: Clause 1, page 1, line 16, leave out “person” and insert “minister”

Jackie Doyle-Price Conservative
Sir John Hayes Conservative
Ben Bradley Conservative
Tonia Antoniazzi Labour
Rosie Duffield Labour
Cherilyn Mackrory Conservative
Andrew Rosindell Conservative
Fiona Bruce Conservative
Stephen Metcalfe Conservative
Bob Blackman Conservative

Amendment 19: Clause 1, page 1, line 16, leave out “person” and insert “woman”

Sir John Hayes Conservative
Miriam Cates Conservative
Lee Anderson Conservative
Alexander Stafford Conservative
Ben Bradley Conservative
Tom Hunt Conservative
Sir Edward Leigh Conservative
Karl McCartney Conservative
Brendan Clarke-Smith Conservative
Tonia Antoniazzi Labour
Rosie Duffield Labour
Andrew Rosindell Conservative
Andrew Lewer Conservative
Fiona Bruce Conservative
Danny Kruger Conservative
Chris Loder Conservative
Robbie Moore Conservative
Dr Kieran Mullan Conservative
Stephen Metcalfe Conservative
Bob Blackman Conservative
Martin Vickers Conservative

Apologies for formatting, best I can do on here. Obviously some MPs are supporting more than one amendment so they appear more than once

Firstly, thanks @BaronessWrongCrowd, lapse in concentration. #idiot

Hey @ConservativesForWomen thanks for everything. 🙏

If I can't see my MP's name on those lists does that mean he actively chose to not support the amendments?

If so, I'll be chibbing him about it!

Itreallytiedtheroomtogether · 12/02/2021 21:53

I've just seen this on Twitter.

Urgent - Ministerial Maternity Bill this Thursday 11/02
MerchedCymru · 12/02/2021 22:27

The world is spinning on its axis so rapidly I can't keep up. Ranted for years about the unelected Lords: now I look to them for salvation. Voted Labour/Plaid forever: now find myself railing at Creasy and co and sending virtual bouquets to Jackie D-P and blowing kisses at Sir Edward Leigh.

Need to lie down in a darkened room for a week.

MaudTheInvincible · 12/02/2021 22:36

Strange times MerchedCymru, strange times

poshme · 13/02/2021 08:33

@WeeTorag if your MP is a member of the government they wouldn't support amendments even if they agree with them.

And yes- SC was filibustering. Probably on orders of her party so there was no vote on language.

Sexnotgender · 13/02/2021 08:42

@MerchedCymru

The world is spinning on its axis so rapidly I can't keep up. Ranted for years about the unelected Lords: now I look to them for salvation. Voted Labour/Plaid forever: now find myself railing at Creasy and co and sending virtual bouquets to Jackie D-P and blowing kisses at Sir Edward Leigh.

Need to lie down in a darkened room for a week.

It’s really disconcerting isn’t it?

The people I thought were ‘the good guys’ are a nightmare.

ThatIsNotMyUsername · 14/02/2021 10:22

Why is precious time being wasted with this? Have we cured Covid? Are all children fed? Are the homeless all not housed and the elderly in safe accommodation? Has all crime been solved and the environment secured?

poshme · 15/02/2021 10:15

@ThatIsNotMyUsername obviously not.

By do you think that in 2021 a woman who wants to take maternity should just lose her paid position? Personally I don't.

ThatIsNotMyUsername · 15/02/2021 11:00

Why on earth would I? It’s the time used debating the terminology that I object to.

334bu · 15/02/2021 11:12

Why on earth would I? It’s the time used debating the terminology that I object to.

Well they should of got it right in the first place ! Blame the idiots who got it wrong and not the ones trying to put it right.

Lifeaintalwaysempty · 15/02/2021 11:15

@ThatIsNotMyUsername because every time sex is replaced with gender or just removed altogether, in language, but particularly in law, another brick is removed from the wall that is protecting women’s sex based protections. Every time.
It didn’t happen over night, it has happened brick by brick.

ThatIsNotMyUsername · 15/02/2021 11:38

You don’t have to tell me (serial ranter)!

I just despair when I see grown ups being waylaid from the important stuff, and wasting time debating student uni politics like flipping numpties (rather than being clear, accurate and precise).

Lifeaintalwaysempty · 15/02/2021 12:13

sorry I misunderstood!

EyesOpening · 18/02/2021 11:33

A bit late on the day but I got a lovely positive letter back from my (Conservative) MP today

ConservativesForWomen · 19/02/2021 12:58

@EyesOpening

A bit late on the day but I got a lovely positive letter back from my (Conservative) MP today
Very pleased to hear that EyesOpening!

For those who have nothing better to do on Monday afternoon, you can watch the live debate on the #MOMABill in the House of Lords. Here is the calendar:
calendar.parliament.uk/calendar/Lords/All/2021/2/22/Daily

If you click on the 'speakers list' you can see who has requested to speak. The order is decided on the day. We hope to live tweet it @CforWomenUK but it will depend on the timing.

Urgent - Ministerial Maternity Bill this Thursday 11/02
OP posts:
Manderleyagain · 19/02/2021 13:32

Thanks for the Lords link op. There are many Lords & baronesses down to speak. Obviously the issue of language - dropping woman and female - is only part of what needs discussing, but I only recognise a few names so it will be v interesting to see where they all stand. I hope you are able to live tweet!

EyesOpening · 19/02/2021 14:21

Me too ConservativesForWomen I shall write back and thank him tomorrow, before I move on to my letter about prisons

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