Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Biden has completely obliterated woman’s sex based protections as he said he would do.

999 replies

yourfaceisaforeignfood · 21/01/2021 05:45

www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/2021/01/20/executive-order-preventing-and-combating-discrimination-on-basis-of-gender-identity-or-sexual-orientation/

“Children should be able to learn without worrying about whether they will be denied access to the restroom, the locker room, or school sports."

Biden just passed all the worst parts of the Equality Act by executive order (so without going through any legislation at all). It is limited in effect to agencies (I think) but those agencies include the Bureau of Prisons, Dept of Housing and Urban Development, Dept of Education, Dept of Labor etc

This will of course be unchallenged, even welcomed by the media. It will likely have a knock on effect around the world.

And I am so angry. So so angry. He was never the ‘least worst option’ he is the absolute worst option.

As Abigail Shriner says
twitter.com/abigailshrier/status/1352121732723666946?s=21

OP posts:
Thread gallery
17
TheBuffster · 21/01/2021 20:31

As a woman, to be recognised as fully human I need to live in a world that does not demand I serve at the pleasure of men.

Hear hear!

jj1968 · 21/01/2021 20:32

@7Days

Jj is doing that disrupt and distract thing again.
Given the thread had been discussing the terrible impact of trans inclusion on minority religions such as Orthodox Jewish women it seemed pertinent and revealing that despite this concern when people starting posting that Biden's support for trans rights is a plot by Jewish billionaires everyone just nods along or stares at their feet.

Almost as if women from some religions and cultures are merely being used a convenient tool to attack trans people with rather than any genuine concern about the societal hostility and prejudice they might face.

Aria999 · 21/01/2021 20:33

@FreshFreesias

At least Trump didn’t start any wars. Obama and Biden had an aggressive foreign policy that has disrupted great swathes if the world.
People keep saying this. I think it was just good luck tbh. What if 9/11 had happened when he was president? Or a foreign leader had looked at him funny
HmmSureJan · 21/01/2021 20:37

Given the thread had been discussing the terrible impact of trans inclusion on minority religions such as Orthodox Jewish women it seemed pertinent and revealing that despite this concern when people starting posting that Biden's support for trans rights is a plot by Jewish billionaires everyone just nods along or stares at their feet.

Yes, TRA never do like it when "Martine" gets a mention. This isn't the first time the "deflect and accuse to distract" technique has been used when I have drawn attention to "Martine".

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2021 20:41

Generally speaking about online discussions, If you personally think any specific individual is posting with an agenda to disrupt a conversation, it's best to talk past them, by replying to something someone said earlier in the thread. This keeps the flow of the original conversation and avoids the confrontation such people thrive on.

MichelleofzeResistance · 21/01/2021 20:43

As a woman, to be recognised as fully human I need to live in a world that does not demand I serve at the pleasure of men.

This ^^

I am not a fucking support human. I am not everyone's mum. The ridiculous dichotomy of this appalling sexism from those who would tell you that sex doesn't actually exist? They'll tell you endlessly how it's complicated, but its very simple as to who makes the rules and gets to choose and who must do as they're told. And it's sex based, and females always lose.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2021 20:43

Humans can speak the truth without being punished for disobedience Quaagars.

If I have the rights of a full human being I should be able to state the truth without adverse consequence. That any man I am being ordered to call a woman is not female, not a woman, not a transwoman, not a trans woman. That no-one can transition to being female. That there is no human group characteristic called gender, and that to force me into a false group with members of the opposite sex under the banner of my own sex's name is inhumane.

If I am fully human then no-one can censor or punish me as if I were a pet for defying and refuting and refusing to comply with men's wishes.

If I am fully human then there can exist no other human with more powerful authority who can have me arrested and remove my freedom for saying no to him.

If I am fully human I cannot be compelled to adopt a false, nonexistent 'female gender identity' imposed upon me by men simply to regain access to what once was a right for my sex but which has been reallocated to men for their pleasure.

If I am fully human I can stand eye to eye with any man and openly defy his outrageous claim to be a woman, and there would be no higher authority that would seek retribution, and my defiance would be seen as a justified expression of truth.

As a woman, to be recognised as fully human I need to live in a world that does not demand I serve at the pleasure of men.

Brilliant post, Barracker! ThanksWine

persistentwoman · 21/01/2021 20:45

@Barracker

Humans can speak the truth without being punished for disobedience Quaagars.

If I have the rights of a full human being I should be able to state the truth without adverse consequence. That any man I am being ordered to call a woman is not female, not a woman, not a transwoman, not a trans woman. That no-one can transition to being female. That there is no human group characteristic called gender, and that to force me into a false group with members of the opposite sex under the banner of my own sex's name is inhumane.

If I am fully human then no-one can censor or punish me as if I were a pet for defying and refuting and refusing to comply with men's wishes.
If I am fully human then there can exist no other human with more powerful authority who can have me arrested and remove my freedom for saying no to him.

If I am fully human I cannot be compelled to adopt a false, nonexistent 'female gender identity' imposed upon me by men simply to regain access to what once was a right for my sex but which has been reallocated to men for their pleasure.

If I am fully human I can stand eye to eye with any man and openly defy his outrageous claim to be a woman, and there would be no higher authority that would seek retribution, and my defiance would be seen as a justified expression of truth.

As a woman, to be recognised as fully human I need to live in a world that does not demand I serve at the pleasure of men.

Outstanding post Barracker . Thank you. Flowers
Quaagars · 21/01/2021 20:47

The same wall of text can be posted over and again, it doesn't make me not fully human just because a lot on here seem to feel that way.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2021 20:50

They'll tell you endlessly how it's complicated, but its very simple as to who makes the rules and gets to choose and who must do as they're told. And it's sex based, and females always lose.

We do. And I'm not sure whether I pity or envy the ones who haven't quite grasped that.

MichelleofzeResistance · 21/01/2021 20:51

Probably that would be because different people have different feelings. Mine don't negate yours, and yours don't negate mine either.

This is why we need a choice between women who are fine with this and perfectly happy to use mixed sex spaces, and women who really are not and would be seriously affected by it. Instead of trying to talk those women with feelings that don't match yours out of mentioning them.

MichelleofzeResistance · 21/01/2021 20:51

Choice of provisions for that should say, not choice between.

Delphinium20 · 21/01/2021 20:54

If you want to be activist around this, my suggestion is not to focus on rescinding the EO. But to tell the Biden Administration, and the relevant Agency heads, that the review must encompass ALL aspects of sex discrimination. And that protecting Trans persons should NOT come at the expense of women.

thanks @stumbledin Flowers I agree this is an excellent strategy.

MolyHolyGuacamole · 21/01/2021 20:56

Reading comments on threads like these are like wandering into a group of anti-vaxxers. It's like an alternate universe where everyone wears tinfoil hats.

TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 21/01/2021 20:56

I feel this deliberate unrecognition of all female people as an act of abject terror enacted upon half of humanity. The half that we all know have always been treated as lesser humans, possessions. And I feel us slipping into the status of less-than-human.

Yes, absolutely, Barracker. It has always been very clear to me that this is an act of structural abuse against women and girls: and yes, an act of terror, in the context of millennia of acts of terror against us. By the other half of the human race.

It’s only very recently that women in some countries (of which the USA is not one, given their failure to ratify the ERA) have had full equality before the law, and there are still plenty of places worldwide where women’s status is officially, legally less than that of men. Added to the fact that even where we do have legal equality, culturally and socially we have never stopped being “less-than-human”, and it’s very easy to see women slipping back into that category in legal terms too.

When otherwise rational, fair people cling tenaciously to an obviously irrational, unjust belief, there has to be a psychological basis for it. They gain something that means more to them than being actually rational or just, although they’re not usually aware of this and con(vince) themselves that their belief is actually rational, and make up more and more absurd theories to try and prove they are, in the face of all evidence to the contrary. (The staggering pseudo-science of “biological” gender identity, clownfish, intersex et al, for example, in the face of the immutable, blindingly obvious reality of human sexual dimorphism.)

The only explanation I can find for the truly breathtaking cognitive dissonance among “liberal” women in the USA and Canada (and here) is that recognising how deeply embedded our second class status really is just too painful for them. Their gain, or payoff, is sustained denial of the unbearable truth of how entrenched misogyny is; in what contempt we are still held by (a critical mass of) men; how powerless we still are to make men treat us as fellow human beings.

Presumably some of the men who genuinely believe that they care about women but nonetheless throw us right under the bus are also just incapable of acknowledging the full horror of how much their sex hates our sex, because it would be so very, very uncomfortable for them.

Because it is truly horrific. The (ongoing) history of male oppression and abuse of females is an absolute atrocity, a global, millennia-long atrocity. One that doesn’t show any signs of ending soon. We achieved some rights, yay. Now watch them being rolled back, and see us getting punished for getting above ourselves.

Whether conscious or unconscious, this belief that women are less than men is a deeply-rooted and powerful one and still exerts enormous sway over the world. And the men and women who think they have evolved beyond that, who don’t think they have to worry about their own internal bias because they are progressive - they are the ones who are doing most to wreck women’s rights in the western world.

The longer it goes on, though, the more women wake up not just to this part of the picture, but the whole picture. How many of us have had the scales fall from our eyes as a result of this issue? We know we’re human. We’re quite pissed off that not everyone apparently does. And we’re mobilising.

Sisters in the USA, I hope that the next four years see numbers of liberal American women waking up the way women have been waking up the last few years over here. I hope there will be a flourishing of grassroots women’s activist groups, like there has been here. We need more numbers on both sides of the Atlantic! Let’s wish for that. Bon courage.

Quaagars · 21/01/2021 20:58

@MolyHolyGuacamole

Reading comments on threads like these are like wandering into a group of anti-vaxxers. It's like an alternate universe where everyone wears tinfoil hats.
Yes, absolutely Moley
TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 21/01/2021 21:00

@Barracker

Humans can speak the truth without being punished for disobedience Quaagars.

If I have the rights of a full human being I should be able to state the truth without adverse consequence. That any man I am being ordered to call a woman is not female, not a woman, not a transwoman, not a trans woman. That no-one can transition to being female. That there is no human group characteristic called gender, and that to force me into a false group with members of the opposite sex under the banner of my own sex's name is inhumane.

If I am fully human then no-one can censor or punish me as if I were a pet for defying and refuting and refusing to comply with men's wishes.
If I am fully human then there can exist no other human with more powerful authority who can have me arrested and remove my freedom for saying no to him.

If I am fully human I cannot be compelled to adopt a false, nonexistent 'female gender identity' imposed upon me by men simply to regain access to what once was a right for my sex but which has been reallocated to men for their pleasure.

If I am fully human I can stand eye to eye with any man and openly defy his outrageous claim to be a woman, and there would be no higher authority that would seek retribution, and my defiance would be seen as a justified expression of truth.

As a woman, to be recognised as fully human I need to live in a world that does not demand I serve at the pleasure of men.

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
yourhairiswinterfire · 21/01/2021 21:04

^They said that about our concerns about what was going on at the Tavistock too, and look how that turned out. Vindicated by 3 high court judges and an appalling CQC report.

Funny the posters constantly sneering at us didn't turn up on those threads, eh?

EdgeOfACoin · 21/01/2021 21:04

@Quaagars

The same wall of text can be posted over and again, it doesn't make me not fully human just because a lot on here seem to feel that way.
But doesn't it bother you that women are not able to speak the truth?

Does it not bother you that girls in America are losing sports scholarships to biological males, with all the physical benefits that a male body brings, and if the girls object they are deemed 'transphobic'?

Does it not bother you that in the US a woman lost her job due to breastfeeding and because men can breastfeed too, it was not seen as an issue of sexism?

Does it not bother you that crime statistics are showing an increase in female sexual crime, even though the increase has been due to mtf transitioners having their crimes recorded as being committed by a female?

It's all lies and women are barred from speaking about it in so many places. Mumsnet is one of the few places it can be discussed.

You know all this stuff, Quaagars - you've been on the boards longer than me. Yet none of this stuff seems to bother you and I genuinely don't understand why.

zzizzer · 21/01/2021 21:05

I often wish I could ignore it all - it would be an enormous mental relief to not give a shit.

yourhairiswinterfire · 21/01/2021 21:05

@yourhairiswinterfire

^They said that about our concerns about what was going on at the Tavistock too, and look how that turned out. Vindicated by 3 high court judges and an appalling CQC report.

Funny the posters constantly sneering at us didn't turn up on those threads, eh?

Sorry, this ^ was in response to this:

Reading comments on threads like these are like wandering into a group of anti-vaxxers. It's like an alternate universe where everyone wears tinfoil hats.

EdgeOfACoin · 21/01/2021 21:08

@MolyHolyGuacamole

Reading comments on threads like these are like wandering into a group of anti-vaxxers. It's like an alternate universe where everyone wears tinfoil hats.
Really?

The comments on these threads tend to be based in biological reality and scientific fact (unlike anti-vaxxer propaganda).

In which way do you think these threads are like anti-vaxxer threads?

NotBadConsidering · 21/01/2021 21:09

Always interesting to read certain posters on here talking about tinfoil hats and paranoia and happy to contribute to the celebration of the removal of the rights of women and girls. The absence of those posters on threads about puberty blockers, the inadequate standards of Tavistock, the damage done to children, the threads about the mental health impacts on a trans man, etc is always noted, consequences that have all been entirely predicted by posters here over the years, with previous allegations of paranoia made only to be subsequently justified.

Therarestone · 21/01/2021 21:12

''At least Trump owned who he is''

No he didn't, he lied, lied and then lied some more to the point that he couldn't even tell his truth from his fake.

OvaHere · 21/01/2021 21:12

Reading comments on threads like these are like wandering into a group of anti-vaxxers. It's like an alternate universe where everyone wears tinfoil hats.

Unlike your universe where for the first time in a millennia women have penises I presume?

Swipe left for the next trending thread