Shiloh Jolie-Pitt: always a girl, doing her own thing.

[Malahaha]

I love this!

thevelvetchronicle.com/shiloh-jolie-pitt-and-the-ongoing-claims-of-gender-vultures/?fbclid=IwAR2OgqvBzIwcFz0xnNjRw4o1uxNTe8hGWeezvlGjOG0Fg3PXiie4WW_-NSw

Also in 2010, Jolie said, “I don’t think it’s for the world to interpret anything. She likes to dress like a boy and wants her hair cut like a boy and she wanted to be called ‘John’ for a while. Some kids wear capes and want to be Superman and she wants to be like her brothers. It’s who she is. It’s been a surprise to us and it’s really interesting, but she’s so much more than that – she’s funny and sweet and pretty. But she does love a tie…”

As an adult people have queried my hatred of musicals and love of sci fi. Even very sensible aforementioned girl's mum. (Who I said should know better!)

To me that's just very sensible.

Dh was just relived.

I also have some shoes I loved from top shop named after her when she was born. Very high; can't wear them now!

Wouldn't be surprised if she back lashed against the pink hype around her when she was young. (Not from her parents, I imagine everyone else.)

Are there any Mermaids mums watching?

If so, wouldn't you prefer your quirky, gender non conforming children to be like Shiloh? A child who has been allowed to grow up and develop their own interests and personality in an environment that didn't enforce gender norms.

SebastianTheCrab

Holly Branson put up an Insta message last year basically saying exactly the same thing - that she dressed only in boys clothes until she was about 10/11. She now has three kids which, if the gender vultures had gotten their claws into her back then, she wouldn't have been able to - yknow, after they brainwash her into slicing off her breasts, removing her womb and taking sterilising hormones.

Thank goodness!

To be fair thingybob, I think the younger children I'd as trans with mothers who believe they need "correcting" tend to be male wanting to be female.

It's easier for younger girls to be tomboys and girls who want to be male tend to be older. (Not always obviously.)

As a bit of an aside, I started a thread a few days ago on this exact same topic, using some of the exact same pictures of Shiloh Jolie Pitt and posing the same questions.

Within about half an hour it was zapped. There was quite a pile on - half a dozen or so posters telling me I was disgusting, in poor taste to discuss a child, 'fuck off with using a child to prove your point, reported'....

I was bewildered. I did email mumsnet hq to ask for more clarification - here is what they told me:

'We'll generally take down threads discussing a child in this way especially if it's largely speculative. The thread was also reported by many MNers - quite a few of whom have been members for a while now. Given all of this, we really couldn't see this one ending well and we aren't currently minded to reinstate that thread.'

...... Obviously this is not the case.

I did have a quick look around the Internet afterwards and it is not speculative at all - Brad Pitt said in an interview that his child likes to be called John and be referred to as a boy...... Many many official interviews have been accompanied by pictures with John being referred to as 'john' -, including their wedding photos!

I am soooo glad to see discussion on this. However, it was clear to me at the time that there were quite a gang of people very keen to shut down any discussion, because I think it probably proves that many children play dressing up, make believe, and don't actually need puberty blockers, etc. It's like they don't want it discussed at all....

....However, it was clear to me at the time that there were quite a gang of people very keen to shut down any discussion, because I think it probably proves that many children play dressing up, make believe, and don't actually need puberty blockers, etc. It's like they don't want it discussed at all....

Absolutely.

@rabbitwoman was the thread in fwr or elsewhere?

Some areas of mn don't like us talking about being female.

Yes, rabbitwoman I noticed that too.

I don't know what to make of the Jolie-Pitts a lot of the time. Their 'rainbow family' as it was called in the early noughties was lauded at the time (with rainbow being a reference to colour rather than the LGBTQ community.)

Now if they tried to do the same thing, I think they would be criticised for having a 'white saviour' mentality.

However, they seem to have taken the right approach with Shiloh (which doesn't seem to have been the affirmation approach, contrary to the view of one PP on this thread) and as a result Shiloh feels free to live and dresses as she pleases.

I worry about the people at Google and other places who stare that Shiloh 'is' John and who hold her up as an icon of the LGBTQ community. I don't think kids should be 'icons' of anything - they are still figuring out who they are!

[quote TrashedWarrior]@rabbitwoman was the thread in fwr or elsewhere?

Some areas of mn don't like us talking about being female. [/quote]
Right here, on FWR, where it was most relevant.....

It's okay, I clocked it for what it was at the time. Whoever 'they' are who like to shut down discourse by complaining as a group may well be asleep right now, so a sensible, respectful discussion can continue....

I think it is very clear why this is so important. This disproves a lot of the ideology of the transgender debate very publicly.

I personally know girls who did the same thing, insisting they were boys with a new, boy's name up until a certain age. It terrifies me that any of them could end up like Jaz Jennings.

Ah I see I missed that.

I posted about her being named a boy by google a couple of months ago (or longer, Covid time is weird) and it wasn't an issue. But was on a thread about another celebrity daughter.

I spent some time trying to work out if she had "transed" but all articles referred to her as she.

I found the google and wiki references very chilling.

It may not have been a wiki page? I can't find one now.

Hmm. Maybe there was one and it's now gone.

This is very shit:

Listed as "transgender."

www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q55430492

Refreshing article. Nice to see common sense applied.

I was the sane as a child- I longed to be a boy called Peter but did I have dysphoria? No. Do I wish I had a sex change? No.

See, as a very little child I was obsessed with big flouncy Princess dresses, fairies at the bottom of the garden, shiny jewels etc..... But my mum only bought me dungarees, cut my hair short and told me I was a tomboy. She told all her friends I was a tomboy, whilst I sat there thinking, no, I am a Princess!!

Nothing really wrong with that, though, didn't make me particularly unhappy or anything. But isn't that another huge danger of this ideology? Parents make decisions about what their children wear, what if a parent has decided they want a transgender kid? For attention, to be trendy?

Just where has this all come from!???!

I personally know girls who did the same thing, insisting they were boys with a new, boy's name up until a certain age. It terrifies me that any of them could end up like Jaz Jennings.

I was that child, and it was the late 50's! Even then, it was no big deal. My mother (she was divorced) went along with it. Cut my hair short, wore "boy" clothes, despised dolls and frills. My mother added a name to my birth certificate so I could be called "Jo". It was all fine; when I changed schools, I was known as Jo in the new school and apart from school uniform I was all tomboy.

When I was 14 I decided I wanted to be a girl again and that was fine too. Jo disappeared.

what if a parent has decided they want a transgender kid? For attention, to be trendy?

Or because they're uncomfortable with having a feminine boy.

@SkeeterP

I remember a little girl I taught (a long time ago) who you would always find in the construction area in the classroom and on non-uniform day would come in dressed in a little suit and tie. I never once thought she was ‘trans’ ... only that she’d grow up and probably be an amazing engineer.

I think the Jolie-Pitts have this exactly right.

Exactly me - I was going to be a telephone engineer like my dad (my mum didn’t work although she designed, produced all the drawings and completely project managed a house build using sub contractors so no slouch either) - I love finding out how things work, and now I fix stuff as a business - complete joy. I had long hair as a youngster then short hair as a teen (although that wasn’t a good look for me) - mad on horses and being filthy.

At no point did anyone ever consider that I might be a boy and every time I think of it I consider what a regressive ideology it is.

@rabbitwoman

As a bit of an aside, I started a thread a few days ago on this exact same topic, using some of the exact same pictures of Shiloh Jolie Pitt and posing the same questions.

Within about half an hour it was zapped. There was quite a pile on - half a dozen or so posters telling me I was disgusting, in poor taste to discuss a child, 'fuck off with using a child to prove your point, reported'....

I was bewildered. I did email mumsnet hq to ask for more clarification - here is what they told me:

'We'll generally take down threads discussing a child in this way especially if it's largely speculative. The thread was also reported by many MNers - quite a few of whom have been members for a while now. Given all of this, we really couldn't see this one ending well and we aren't currently minded to reinstate that thread.'

"'We'll generally take down threads discussing a child in this way especially if it's largely speculative. The thread was also reported by many MNers - quite a few of whom have been members for a while now. Given all of this, we really couldn't see this one ending well and we aren't currently minded to reinstate that thread.'"

What? Wait, so @MNHQ truly think a member's seniority gives the preferred status and means they are right? I already thought @Mumsnet was unprofessional by telling people in emails that they have had 'many reports' - um, as if that means jack shit? All it means, is vexatious bullies and trouble makers are vexatiously reporting posts - I have experienced that myself, and the mod who I was emailing with refused to see that I was being vexatiously reported. I think it is poor form to tell someone they've received 'many reports', and further poor form to suggest that the 'volume' of reports means one rather than the other is wrong. But it takes the cake for Mumsnet to openly say they have a hierarchy of what posters rule the roost and that longer term members can bully and report and get away with it, which you would be concerned that it would discourage new members from joining if they are going to be treated like that. It's disconcerting just how unprofessional the jokers that are mods on this site really are.

It very nearly put me off posting anything else. It got quite personal, I was called disgusting, one poster said looking at the photos made them feel sick - I even apologised and was told that my 'faux apology was embarrassing'......

But here we are, discussing it, and hasn't cast so much sunlight on this subject? I bet Angelina Jolie is so glad she didn't go down the heavily medicalised route; I bet she is glad she didn't introduce her daughter as transgender to the world - something very hard to go back on, as another celebrity mother might find out one day......

See, as a very little child I was obsessed with big flouncy Princess dresses, fairies at the bottom of the garden, shiny jewels etc..... But my mum only bought me dungarees, cut my hair short and told me I was a tomboy.

Same. Except my Mum didn’t buy me dungarees, she just made me wear all my brother’s old clothes. Which was probably why she did it to be honest, couldn’t afford to buy me dresses so just stuck me in bro’s hand me downs and told people I was a tomboy. I fucking hated having short hair.

Looks like Google have now fixed her name & gender.