Autistic girls seeking answers ‘are seizing on sex change’ Times Article

[Igneococcus]

Just seen this in the Times:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/6a2ab6b2-529f-11eb-b5cf-1d37166171d9?shareToken=30103997eddad28e5067e7f74e8bc877

@TheGreatSloth

That’s shocking. Are the full expert opinions available anywhere? (The article quotes bits of them.) They sound devastating.

No I doubt they will be available, because it says The Sunday Times won court approval to publish extracts from the evidence.

They went to some bother to do this. I took out a subscription to the Times when it was really only Janice Turner there & the bloke at the spectator who were writing about this whole general issue in the main papers. They have stuck with it. This is important work. It's amazing what so many people have been hiding, or deliberately not looking at in case it turned out to be iffy.

And it's amazing how aggressive so many people have been in trying to prevent scrutiny of this.

[quote Dimpsey]I just saw this on twitter and it got me thinking how disgraceful it is that we haven't heard a peep out of Barnados the NSPCC et al since the Keira Bell case. They were very keen to get a joint statement out before the case.

Reminder: www.barnardos.org.uk/news/joint-statement-barnardos-nspcc-national-childrens-bureau-and-childrens-society-about-gender[/quote]
Yes good point. They did keep that statement vague, but when they talk about how we should give children their agency in this, given that the context was medical treatment, it does sound like they were saying children should be allowed to consent to this treatment.

Wow. Amazing article. Surely there must be increasing squeaky bottom syndrome at Mermaids et al.

I'm so impressed that they drew on experts from all over the world. People who are top-notch in their field.

They weren't messing about were they?

It's unequivocal.

Glad this is all coming out. I'm stunned that autism groups and charities aren't speaking out about it and have largely been in favour of it all. Given autism spectrum conditions have a genetic component, and that these drugs damage fertility, it's eugenics by the back door. There was a case a few years ago of two doctors in the US who were struck off for pushing Lupron as an autism cure, this all reminds me of that. scienceblogs.com/insolence/2009/05/22/why-not-just-castrate-them-part-2

Another thread on a similar article published after getting court approval to go to press. Hope the sunburn isn’t too painful.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4131231-mail-on-sunday-article-showing-testimony-from-keira-s-case

Reading with interest.

My DD is 12 and has a diagnoses for Asperger’s. She has always been on the fringes socially and has never quite fitted in, if that make sense. I keep a close eye on her phone messages (she knows about this) as she has been subject to subtle bullying in the past and her perceived friendships are often toxic.

In a recent message to a friend, she came out as Bi. I’m completely fine with this, which I’m sure she knows as we are a very open, liberal family. However, I’m worried that she might be vulnerable to being sucked into the trans ideology (for want of a better word). She is a big Umbrella Academy fan and has followed Ellen/Elliot Page’s transition with interest. I have brought her up to believe that you do not have to conform to gender stereotypes.

I know there are many gender critical articles and websites, but they aren’t particularly child friendly. Are there any documentaries we could watch together? I have discussed the case of Keira Bell with her. Alternatively, since, in my experience, lesbians are not represented in mainstream media - can anyone recommend anything we could watch together? I don’t want her thinking that the only options are stereotypically straight, or trans.

I’ve tried google and most of my searches took me to pornhub .

A couple of my daughters friends are umbrella academy fans and also call themselves trans.
My dd and sister are autistic, but luckily understand basic biology.

MacDazzle it might be worth contacting Transgender Trend for advice.

There are also some good articles by parents of ASD children on the site.

These are all the blog posts tagged “autism”:

www.transgendertrend.com/tag/autism/

I am an autistic woman. I was called a "tomboy" as a child because many of my friends were boys and I liked cars and football and climbing trees and mud and lego and running around and trains etc. But I also liked playing the piano and clarinet and cello and dressing up and cooking and Mary Poppins. Apparently some of these things are "male" and some are "female" and it makes as much sense to me as the way that French and Spanish and German languages etc gender nouns in a random way (often differently in each language!).

My interests have no relationship to my genitals and I find it all quite offensive. It scares me that if I'd been a child now people would have told me I am not female because I like things that they associate with boys, for no reason that they can explain. I hate that young girls are pressured to behave in a different way to boys and I'm relieved to hear some sense being spoken about this now because I really cannot understand what people mean by "gender". What is it?

My sex is female, that is a function of biology and it's caused me many problems e.g. an abusive stepfather, physical aggression from men and disadvantage in my career from taking time off to give birth to children. But I do not understand what "gender identity" even means? I have tried to ask before but nobody seems able to answer in a coherent way. I do not want these ideas pushed on my children that girls should do this or boys should do that, and I am very worried hearing these statistics about young autistic girls. It is hard enough to grow up being different without people trying to impose ideas on you that they cannot explain that really have nothing to do with your problems.

I want my children to grow up to be decent people who understand that we do not judge people based on their sex and that people can be interested in whatever they like. The whole idea of "gender" seems repressive to me. But maybe it's just another thing about society that I don't "get" because I am autistic. It seems so pointless to me, and worse, I think these ideas are damaging. Surely whatever genitals people have, they can live whatever kind of life they choose? Is that not the point of is trying for decades to get equality? Why would people drug children like this? It's so horrific and baffling and disturbing.

She is a big Umbrella Academy fan and has followed Ellen/Elliot Page’s transition with interest.

My children are too (and dp and I like it too, I still need to watch the last two episodes) and my 16 year old (straight) daughter is really disappointed that a succesful openly lesbian actress felt the need to come out as trans rather than be a lesbian.
I wonder how they'll deal with it in season 3, if there'll be any acknowledgement in the story of the show.

This is a fantastic article.

Gawd I'd love to see some of the main child transing tras response to this, especially the medical one.

🌞

Comments still not coming through. Just saw one disappear before my eyes.

I'm wondering if the fox bothering barrister will review his assertion that experiences of trans teenagers weren't considered. There seem to have been quite a few experiences of teenagers who should never have been treated this way presented. Or don't those ones count?

The Mail on Sunday are also covering this. They also state that they went to court - some shocking examples with the headline beginning
"A live experiment on children" - which of course it is.

At it's most simplistic, these articles are perfect for parents to print out and send to those schools still supporting the trans gravy train with dangerous trans policies that promote this stuff.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9130157/The-physicians-testimony-led-High-Court-judge-ban-child-puberty-blocker-drugs.html

Great and depressing to see the findings from the experts.

So sad that it is being left to experts at the end of their careers to feel brave enough to speak out. And thank goodness they have

I wonder if those experts had to give their agreement for their evidence to be published. And if they are now taking any heat for that.

It basically confirms what many of us have been saying for years now.

Re seeking advice online, influence of YouTube etc.

This couldn't have come quicker.

Keira Bell and Mother of child we don't know's hard work will have such a huge impact on all of this for years to come. Thank you to them both.

Hopefully.

Thanks for the share token.

While the focus is (rightly) on the medical abuse of these girls, I hope another thing to come out of this will be improvements to diagnosing and treating ASD in girls and women. Anti-cure rhetoric has gone too far when the response to getting an ASD diagnosis is ‘yay, you’re not disabled, you’re neurodiverse, off you pop’. No wonder girls are seeking an escape route via maleness. Their distress is being ignored.

Wow, get your sunglasses out as that is some STRONG sunlight

Fantastic article!

The Sunday morning moderator shift is very slow on the comments. I’ve got two pending now and nothing has come on Alfie hours this morning.

A hangover perhaps? Or the enthusiastic censoring one?

@gardenbird48 absolutely! She is now training as a speech and language therapist and is very vocal and well researched on her opinions around autism and communication and girls and women. She hopes to make a small difference professionally, she still struggles but I am immensely proud of her.