Sunday Times today covering Keira's case

[McDuffy]

Trans clinics face puberty-blocker ban for under-17s

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dd78a746-317a-11eb-9ce2-e80c572086aa?shareToken=649822141870d95ec1c0ad2644c39940

The Times have been outstanding in their coverage of this - so many journalists - not just Janice Turner and Andrew Gilligan (when he was there) have produced high quality investigative articles.

Oh my goodness, well done Keira et al. At last ♥️

Wow. Fucking wow.

Keira, Susan, et al - you are amazing.

@vivariumvivariumsvivaria

I'm relieved and delighted, but, also sad for my friend who's child started cross sex hormones because they thought it was the right thing to do.

It isn't the right thing to do.

Thank you, Kiera. You are very brave and we are very grateful.

Do you think there'd be any recourse now for further discussion?

MidClegs I do hope so. She's only been on T for about 10 months.

The problem is that once they are on the drugs that they believe are essential it is really hard to get them off.

My friend feels very mixed about the whole approach. She's quietly GC, but, absolutely terrified of the kid's suicidal ideation. I do get it.

I think they are buying the hormones from the Webberly's.

www.barnardos.org.uk/news/joint-statement-barnardos-nspcc-national-childrens-bureau-and-childrens-society-about-gender

A concerning joint statement. These organisations need an eye kept on them.

When was that statement made/posted? Maybe the will start beep-beep-beeping as the back off me pretend they never said it?

And she (and her lawyers) are meeting the baroness tomorrow... probably for cake and gin I hope.

How can children’s organisations not support proper informed consent for child patients?

Stonewall?

There's a statement by stonewall posted around the 600 mark on this thread.

Keira www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4094862-keira

@MammothMashup

Has anyone ever reversed after starting blockers? Could they? I'd imagine especially for boys it would be hard to then become what they would have physically? God knows what it does to female reproductive systems.

Women who took it for early puberty report a lot of long term endocrine issues.

So if a male child who had been on blockers and then discovered at 18 that the effects on physical development had compromised their choice of options for a vaginoplasty, as has been documented to happen?

Is there any evidence that puberty would resume and this young person's development would progress in full, if they came off the blockers then?

Is there any evidence that puberty would resume and this young person's development would progress in full, if they came off the blockers then?

I remember on a certain televised show that the options for vaginoplasty were colon or a tissue expander. No mention of coming off blockers and/or stopping hormones as an option to encourage growth. One would assume really that you "miss the window " so to speak.

I also remember a certain woman laughing about how small her son's penis prior to a sex change operation was after pb.

From the BBC report

The charity said: "We believe very strongly that every young person has the right to make their own decisions about their body and that should not differ because somebody is trans."

Interesting pov. All decisions? Tattoos? Piercings? Anorexia? What ages? How they seemingly cannot grasp that that has far wider implications then just "someone who is trans" beats me.

@TheGreatWave

From the BBC report

The charity said: "We believe very strongly that every young person has the right to make their own decisions about their body and that should not differ because somebody is trans."

Interesting pov. All decisions? Tattoos? Piercings? Anorexia? What ages? How they seemingly cannot grasp that that has far wider implications then just "someone who is trans" beats me.

Yes, exactly my thought, TheGreatWave. Children & young people are very clearly not allowed to make their own decisions about their bodies in many cases, this is pretty basic 'age of consent' stuff that any charity working with children & young people should be very, very clear on.

Dear god I was 20 and really keen to get some piercings. Thankfully I was talked out of it by someone who cared - it would have been a stupid thing for me to do and for the wrong reasons. I was 20 for gods sake (with a degree, postgrad, job and a flipping mortgage).

Here is what the Tavistock is telling all staff in the organisation to think in relation to the judgement.

"As you may know, or have seen in the media today, we have now had a judgment in the judicial review the Trust and its partners have been facing in respect of treatment with puberty blockers.

Though the ruling is clear that the practice of the Trust is not unlawful, we are clearly disappointed by today’s judgment and we understand that the outcome is likely to cause anxiety for patients and their families. Our first duty is to our patients, particularly those currently receiving hormone blocking treatment. We have been carefully planning how we can support them as well as possible.

If you are interested in knowing more, we have a statement on the GIDS website explaining where we are and next steps and trying to answer as many questions as possible in a Q&A. We will be updating this when we have further information later today or in the coming days.

Read more information on the GIDS website:
gids.nhs.uk/information-following-judicial-review-judgment-december-2020

It is important to remember that GIDS is largely a psycho-social service providing extensive support to children and young people facing issues relating to the development of their gender identity. We offer a safe and supportive environment to explore these issues. Only a minority of those referred to the service go on to access a physical intervention pathway.

At this time more than ever, it is important that we all pull together and support one another. Please be particularly kind to our GIDS colleagues and respectful of the work they have done, and the care that they will continue to offer."

I think I'll save my kindness for the GIDS whistleblowers.

#bekind my arse

NHS England moving quickly.

@BlackWaveComing

I think I'll save my kindness for the GIDS whistleblowers.

I've dug for that cause today!

If you are interested in knowing more
Lots of us are actually interested in knowing more, particularly about the long-term outcomes of GIDS patients and their treatment. Has it occurred to GIDS to perhaps record this somewhere?

Thanks for the GIDS link TavistockNews. gids.nhs.uk/information-following-judicial-review-judgment-december-2020 From looking at their FAQ for patients, I hadn’t previously understood that overseas to UK prescribing also came under this judgement, but it seems they do?:

Eg

I am currently on puberty blockers from a private provider – will these be stopped?
This judgment applies to the treatment, not to the provider, so all providers, public and private, are bound by it. See the responses above. This includes any treatment administered in England and Wales.

If my puberty blockers from GIDS are stopped, can I access them via private providers?
This judgment applies to the treatment, not to the provider, so all providers, public and private, are bound by it. See the responses above. This includes where providers are based overseas, but treatment is administered in the England and Wales.

So does ‘administered’ mean a patient taking their own medicine, or a health professional giving/sending a medicine to the patient?

Gender GP’s response is this, I’m not sure quite what they mean they will provide?: www.gendergp.com/gendergp-launches-charitable-fund-trans-youth-puberty-blockers/