USA gymnastic trans inclusion policy

[Kit19]

I think Ross Tucker is very much done with this bs now! I remember the days when he was much more “it’s a difficult issue/we need to be kind” but the TRA have of course destroyed that

[bluebluezoo]

Oh and girls are allowed to wear shorts, especially at recreational levels. They don’t at upper levels because of the risk they may affect judges opinion...

[Micah]

you've given a good dose of reality there.

Perhaps we all have our knickers in a knot about a non-event?

Is it a non-event? What about the young girls sharing their changing rooms, or not getting on the medal podium. Girls being told from a very young age to “be kind” and allow males in their spaces.

Just because it’s allowed, why does that make it a non event? Chances are nobody would complain because they’d likely be banned for transphobia.

[PearPickingPorky]

Men definitely have an advantage in women's gymnastics, due to their strength and power. It's not difficult to teach choreography and some flexibility (as anyone who watches strictly will know, men are perfectly capable of that too).

This is so unfair to girls.

And coming off the back of them harbouring a pedophile for 20 years to sexually assault hundreds of young girls.

Shocking.

[Norma27]

Girls cannot wear shorts to compete in, even at low levels. I questioned this for my daughter who started her periods just before her 11th birthday. I'm thinking they may have said she could if she was 13 actually. Yep very helpful at the time.
She also couldn't wear knickers under her costume.
This was one reason my daughter left a couple of months later before she had 2 competitions in one month and very possible her period could have been during one.
Shorts during practise sessions were fine though.

[PearPickingPorky]

Norma I think they recently changed the rules around shorts because male children who identify as girls wanted to take part, but the leotard alone would "out" them, so they wanted to be allowed to wear shorts over the leotard. However, they realised this too would be outing for the "trans" children as they'd then be the only ones in shorts, so they then relented and said girls could wear shorts too.

Nice how the rules got changed to meet the wishes of the male sex class, but they adamantly refused to let girls from religious families wear shorts, despite many years of asking. Until the rule inconvenienced males, it was a complete no-go to change it.


There was a thread on it a year or so ago.

[jcurve]

The difference with thus ruling is that in the U.K. there’s no financial benefit to being a gymnast unless you’re at the very highest levels. The drop off rate is high here because it’s a massive commitment during your high school years.

However in the US, one track for non-elite gymnasts is to compete for college scholarships with real and tangible value. It’s not infeasible that one of the more woke schools in California or the East coast embrace a transgender athlete into the women’s team with open arms, especially if they happen to have a particular set of vault skills that the girls routinely struggle with.

[Cwenthryth]

The comments from those two women in the video - both of whom have multiple Olympic medals incl gold and won multiple world championships - “I’m glad they weren’t competing with us in our day” “they’ve just done things that we cannot do”. But sorry ladies, if they say they feel feminine then it’s ok for them to waltz into your category, deal with it.

How fucking depressing.

[Whatwouldscullydo]

I'm with notbad

So sick of having to come up with lists of reasons in the hope that one is deemed remotely worth consideration. And sick of having to solve the problems before we even raise a point .

Both males and females are able to do gymnastics. So those born male do gym all together and those born female have their group too.

Its not hard. Its not a complex decision. All you need is your eyes.

[Norma27]

I didn't realise that pear thank you.
We left 3 years ago now so didn't know of the changes.
Of course the changes were only to make males feel better. Absolutely diabolical.

[Norma27]

That video is so interesting to watch. Women in sport are going to be one extinct in our lifetime.

[bluebluezoo]

Girls cannot wear shorts to compete in, even at low levels. I questioned this for my daughter who started her periods just before her 11th birthday. I'm thinking they may have said she could if she was 13 actually. Yep very helpful at the time.
She also couldn't wear knickers under her costume

fig- federation International gymnastique who set all international gymnastics rules have allowed shorts/leg coverings for women since 2013. BG rules reflect this.

It is likely your club had it’s own rules, lots do. Underwear is very definitely allowed, the only thing is if knickers are hanging out the leo in an unsightly manner judges can deduct. Lots of clubs have this unreasonable rule- probably aimed at kids with baggy pants hanging out, but lots also use it as control. If you’ve seen the recent issues around BG and gymnastics coercive control is huge in gymnastics, and uniform is one part of this.

Most parents unfortunately don’t know enough to argue their case, and of course clubs can always refuse to let you compete or train if you don’t toe the line. You’d have to go to the competition organisers, regional body or BG itself. Which is a no no in many clubs.

If you google london gymnastics floor and vault- lots of kids competing in shorts.

[CatsCantCatchCriminals2]

@334bu

Any transwoman athlete who chooses to compete in women's sport is a narcissistic cheater.

That's really all that needs to be said on this matter.

Seconded.

[HPFA]

@Winesalot

One of the tweets replying to Ross brought suicide stats into their argument.

They stated something like wasn’t less suicides worth females winning a few less medals.....

Unbelievable! That someone fully believes the answer to make mental health issues is for females to lose their opportunities. That someone fully believes the answer is to penalize women and not improving mental health care access. Of course, the female gymnasts who have trained and suffered for that opportunity, their mental health doesn’t count. Their lost opportunity doesn’t count.

I saw that one. It's an argument that's a complete admission that no rational argument can be made.

[NotBadConsidering]

And the whole pubertal/prepubertal argument? It doesn’t matter! I have 3 DD, one post, one peri, and one prepubertal. None of them want to compete against males, at all, ever. My prepubertal DD recognises there are sex-based differences even at her age of 8, and wants to be the best girl. She doesn’t want to compete against boys, no matter what their inner feelings are telling them. I will never capitulate to the idea that her idea of fair competition is wrong. These boys can do what they want with their own sex class. It doesn’t need to be justified, it doesn’t need science, it doesn’t need research. Women and girls’ sport is for women and girls.

The adults enabling this entitlement in children, allowing them to think they are owed what they want rather than what is fair and right, can fuck off, then fuck off some more, then fuck off to the far side of fuck.

Rant over

[ThatIsNotMyUsername]

I assume there will be allowances for costumes. How will they ever decide who gets to wear the shorts and vest?

[CatsCantCatchCriminals2]

Excellent post notbad as per.

I don't have children at school but my inclination (upon discovering that a girl of mine is expected to play sport with males) would be to tell the school that's not going to happen and ask that she could do something else in the games lesson.

How would that go down? Has anyone successfully pulled a girl out of such nonsense?

[Athrawes]

I have a ten year old male gymnast. He is skinny as a twig and very much prepubescent but it is quite clear looking at him and his gym mates of the same age that they are men in the making. Their bodies even at 8 or 10 are already so different to the girls.
Boys and girls are different. It is biology, not feelings.

[ThatIsNotMyUsername]

Those poor girls who were abused by the team doctor. He knew...

[ChakaDakotaRegina]

@Winesalot

One of the tweets replying to Ross brought suicide stats into their argument.

They stated something like wasn’t less suicides worth females winning a few less medals.....

Unbelievable! That someone fully believes the answer to make mental health issues is for females to lose their opportunities. That someone fully believes the answer is to penalize women and not improving mental health care access. Of course, the female gymnasts who have trained and suffered for that opportunity, their mental health doesn’t count. Their lost opportunity doesn’t count.

Gosh can you imagine us suggesting Roger Federra or Lewis Hamilton or Ronaldo stand aside and be nice and ‘let someone else have a turn’. We’d be shot.
Women linesman and presenters are barely tolerated.

I really thought sport would be the tipping point in this.

[SusannaSpider]

This will bite the woke countries in the arse, as the more unscrupulous countries will exploit it and win by doing so. Unfortunately it's the damage done in the mean time, damage to children who will be forced to compete as trans in those other countries and damage to girls in countries like the US who rely on their sport for a college scholarship and the exclusion of girls from their own sports.

[ThatIsNotMyUsername]

They will end up having to change the marking systems and specified moves/jumps (sorry I don’t know the marking terms) To accommodate the strengths/agility/moves of the different types of bodies surely?

[VulvaPerson]

I cannot see many men wanting to compete with women in gymnastics. Its one of the few areas where a woman would out perform a man generally speaking, I would think anyway..unless it appeals to some as the women get to wear sparkly leotards and stuff

Mind I guess theres still the changing rooms issue to worry about, its not only about fairness, but fairness is a big part.

[VulvaPerson]

Sorry, posted before reading the thread OK they have an advantage here too, makes sense. I cannot see fuss being made abut 'inclusion' policies in areas wher women would outperform men.

[ThatIsNotMyUsername]

Jockeys - but women can race with men anyway can’t/don’t they?

[MichelleofzeResistance]

They stated something like wasn’t less suicides worth females winning a few less medals.....

And there, yet again, is the profound sexist misogyny that underpins every inch of this.

The belief that females matter less, are worth less, and whatever they do with their little selves it ought to be useful to and serving men anyway.

I've moved from trying to rationally debate with this to an increasingly disgusted Just fuck OFF.