Meeting my MP about the Proud Trust sex ed materials

[Mollscroll]

I wrote to my Conservative female MP about the Proud Trust sex ed materials in May. I told her of my objections to the fact that they:

• promoted male-focussed sexual activities to girls as young as 13
• made no mention of any safe sex requirements around, for example, inserting objects in an anus
• made no reference to breasts, clitoris
• were designed to help girls discard their natural boundaries

And that all this was funded by the tampon tax which is supposed to be used in support of women and girls.

She did not get back to me despite multiple chasing letters. I suspect someone in her office did not like my objections. I have finally secured a meeting with her on zoom next week - I had to write to the local chair of the Conservative Party in order to get this.

Now that I have this meeting, I can't think what to say. I am so angry about the Proud Trust and about the betrayal of women and girls that I don't know what else to add.

I also don't know the current status of this material - I believe it may have been withdrawn but obviously the money, taken from the pockets of women and girls, has already been spent on a product which reduces us to mere tools for men's sexual pleasure.

Can anyone calmer and more succinct than me give me some pointers? What would you raise at this point?

13 year old girls' body are not designed to do anal sex. It causes them quite significant health issues and damage, and they do not even have a prostate to stimulate.

Let's be honest, "normalising" anal sex (something that is relatively niche and that the majority of women get no pleasure from) is all about breaking down girls' boundaries further.

Because women and girls tend not to get as much out of it. I doubt it’s something any teenage girl ever asks for unless she’s had it normalised by porn or thinks it makes her more desirable. As for objects - no. Why objects? Why introduce objects into holes as a concept for children ? If this is all about female sexual pleasure as you insist it is, then it needs at least to mention the ways in which most women achieve this. It’s not through objects in the anus. This is entirely aimed at chipping away boundaries. The guidance even exhorts teachers to ‘hold your nerve’ while going through all this ie, silence your natural and healthy boundaries over this and force 13 year olds to talk in a group with you about putting objects in their anus.

@NRatched

I really enjoyed your post, could you set up a new thread? about woke assistants not passing on correspondence they disagree with to your MP

[quote FindTheTruth]@NRatched

I really enjoyed your post, could you set up a new thread? about woke assistants not passing on correspondence they disagree with to your MP[/quote]
Yes, definitely - I think there were a couple of other mentions and wonder if we might be onto something? Could explain the massive derail?

Right so the objection is to having the word anus on the dice. Presumably you would have preferred another female term yes, breasts or something, tipping the dice in favour of female anatomy over male? Can I just check as well, do you all think that anal sex/ exploration should not be discussed at all in any context? Other than to tell girls it's painful and they won't like it?

I think you're hearing the word 'educate' or 'discuss' and hearing 'normalise'.

Perfect, I think the issue is normalising anus and object for children, and this resource being used for children. I am not speaking for others though, it's just an observation.

It does normalise. The material says ‘all combinations are valid and worthy of discussion’. And it says that some combinations may seem hard to achieve (anus to anus) but they are all achievable. There is absolutely no discussion of consent or safety. This is not education.

And as for the female aspect this was funded by the Tampon Tax - it’s supposed to be about women. That was in the project mandate.

You seem to like it. It looks like most disagree. My MP disagreed. The government’s new guidelines disagree. Statutory safeguarding requirements appear to make it illegal. It looks like even the Proud Trust disagree. I was on the website this week and the material is still up there but as V2. I can’t open it without paying for it (even though Women already funded it to the tune of £99,960 via the tampon tax - can’t imagine how they spent that much). I suspect the press coverage they got earlier in the year on this prompted a whitewash of this material. Too late Proud Trust. We see you.

Perfect28

They are simply trying to educate and normalise what a lot of people do in their sex lives. It's totally fine if your vanilla and straight but it's also totally fine if you're not...

Also Perfect28

I think you're hearing the word 'educate' or 'discuss' and hearing 'normalise'.

The fact that rape and sexual assault is so high would suggest the way we've done things so far doesn't work would it not?

@Perfect28

The fact that rape and sexual assault is so high would suggest the way we've done things so far doesn't work would it not?

And you think normalising niche sexual activities and porn use by children, which objectifies women and girls, and telling children that girls can not enforce boundaries and must accept getting changed in front of any males who says he is unsure of his gender because boys feelings matter more than girls right to boundaries and consent, is going to stop that?

Which makes boundries and cinsentbeveb more vital to teach.

Rather than making dangerous practices so mainstream that in order to "shock" or not be labelled frigid, abusive sex becomes the go to...

the gaslighting in this derail is straight out of the abusers handbook. It makes me feel for any prepubescent teen forced to question their own judgment or sense of reality ("what a lot of people do in their sex lives"), shamed ("you're vanilla) and dismissing that 13 year old girl anal sex means health issues, damage, and not a prostate to stimulate. (just "patchy sex education"). The manipulation won't work on here but my thoughts are with those facing it in real life.

@FindTheTruth so now I'm gaslighting as well as misogynistic and a pedo. Lovely! Anything else you want to throw at me? How absurd. I've said several times there's nothing wrong at all with vanilla straight sex just like there's nothing wrong with alternatives to that. But sure hear what you want to hear. 🙂

Good catch Aesopfable re "normalising."

Presumably you would have preferred another female term yes, breasts or something, tipping the dice in favour of female anatomy over male?

Or here's a radical thought, but bear with me for a second, you could have sex education that doesn't involve getting groups of 13 year olds to roll dice with body parts written on them. I know it might seem like a shocking idea but once you've really thought it though I'm sure you'll see the advantages.

Anyway, I too would like to see a thread on the MP staff issue. I've seen this mentioned on multiple occasions in multiple threads and it's something the press really ought to pick up on. If staff members for many different MPs are doing this, then I think it would be interesting to know what channels of communication people who work in these roles have with each other. If it's being co-ordinated, how? Via WhatsApp groups?

I don't know for sure that the MP was not getting my correspondance on that topic btw. I just suspect, based on his usual replies on all other topics. I would be wary of starting a thread for that very reason (along with HATING starting threads anyway, not sure why) however I would contribute to one. I only mentioned it as others were talking about it. I have also seen it mentioned elsewhere a few times, and there might even already be a thread on it? Not sure. Brains not working right at the min due to no sleep and meds!

Yes I have namechanged, after the wonderful vulva people thread/new way of saying woman.

Or here's a radical thought, but bear with me for a second, you could have sex education that doesn't involve getting groups of 13 year olds to roll dice with body parts written on them. I know it might seem like a shocking idea but once you've really thought it though I'm sure you'll see the advantages.

Exactly! This sort of activity appears to be designed (deliberately or not) to advance the 'decoupling' of body parts/functions from the sex class of women and should not be used at all in school. The sort of discussion is likely to be way beyond the boundaries of many children in a public setting, possibly with other children they don't feel fully comfortable with.

I can't remember the number of sexual assaults that take place in schools but it is horrendous - the boys are obviously in the schools so it is not beyond the realms of possibility that someone that has made a girl feel sexually uncomfortable is in that class enjoying her further discomfort.

Perfect28 appears not consider that there may be impact on children that have suffered CSA who could feel extremely distressed with such conversations in school which previously may have been their only escape. I would go so far as to say that I don't think teachers have any place bringing up any detailed discussion about less common sexual practices and should be focusing on relationships, safety and consent. I would imagine a number of teachers would not feel particularly comfortable in having such discussions - sexual harassment and assault on female teachers by students is not unknown so to have that sort of conversation with young male students could be particularly uncomfortable.

There is little to be gained from children learning about that at such a young age and it could be to the detriment of many.

My children tend to find the whole discussion in a classroom very uncomfortable (we talk about all sorts happily at home) and often switch off entirely so if their boundaries are pushed so they feel uncomfortable, they will miss the important stuff which is not helpful for anyone.

I would definitely like to see a thread on communications and possible filtering in MPs offices - @Mollscroll or @NRatched - it sounds like you both have experience of this so if you were prepared to start one off it would be interesting to see if anyone else has had a similar experience (or an odd response that seems out of character for their MP).

I think if it was discussed in the context of safety/hygeine/age of consent, it would be very different. For those of us who understand CSE the way it's presented is clearly grooming, and I think most decent teachers would recognise that it crosses a pretty clear line.

Sex education is supposed to be factual and informative. It's not supposed to induce a sexual response and dangerous experimentation from children the way the Dice Game obviously is. Playing inappropriate games with children in order to lower their boundaries is sadly the oldest

*oldest paedophile trick in the book.

Playing inappropriate games with children in order to lower their boundaries is sadly the oldest

This is what I dont get.

If any of us played this game with our children , jts a game you can buy in ann summers, something done to "spice things up" in the bedroom, or when you are pissed at a stag/hen do.

We would get a knock at the door or at the very least a phone call.

Why is it ok at school
And why are schools not consulting educational departments or official sources of some kind for this info, but are turning to lobby groups and charities instead. I mean u wouldn't go to the dentist for a broken leg so it doesn't make any sense at all

I have seen the dice game.

It is very inappropriate to be used in schools pretending to be educational

Imagine your kid coming home from school and you asked what they learnt in school today

I can’t imagine

I would go so far as to say that I don't think teachers have any place bringing up any detailed discussion about less common sexual practices and should be focusing on relationships, safety and consent.

I agree.

@Perfect28, of course I have read the article, I have a different conclusion to you, however. I read it as part of my role in the health service, from my own work life I have seen anal sex change from being a niche hardcore porn activity to being tried quite commonly, and I have also seen that most (not all, yes there are women who enjoy anal), most of the women and under -18s who try it don't enjoy it.
They try it because they are pressurised into trying it by their partners. So rather than encouraging talk about physical sex, to my mind a lot more emphasis needs to be on giving girls and women the skills and confidence to say what they want, and to be able to say no to what they don't want: be it anal or choking or slapping, or anything else.