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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

ForwomenScot have been granted permission for a Judicial Review of the Gender Representation on Public Boards Act 2018.

108 replies

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 16/10/2020 14:15

This is excellent news. For those of you unaware, the Scottish Government legislated that there had to be equal number of men and women on boards. Of course, they defined women as including men, so For Women Scotland applied for, and have been granted, a judicial review. Piece about it here www.scottishlegal.com/article/blog-shifting-sands-on-the-definition-of-woman-in-scots-law

Spades out!

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DidoLamenting · 17/10/2020 11:53

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DidoLamenting · 17/10/2020 11:53

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Calyx72 · 17/10/2020 12:10

Shared that excellent Stephen Daisley article on twitter (not my work twitter but my anonymous twitter unfortunately) and have donated to For Women Scotland as well as Glinner's funder.

Hope this keeps going and picks up speed

334bu · 17/10/2020 13:15

Interesting tweet on For Women Scotland twitter time line. It is often said that men wouldn't abuse the ability to self Id as a woman to take away rights or privileges. which have been given to women to make up for the discrimination they face in society, well here is just that in action

www.sopitas.com/noticias/muxe-transgenero-oaxaca-candidaturas/amp/?__twitter_impression=true
It's in Spanish but it should give you the option to see it in English.
In Scotland they wouldn't even need to change their clothes or shave their beards.

334bu · 17/10/2020 13:20

I realise that these are men pretending to be trans to take positions specifically for transwomen but if they were willing to do this I am sure they would change their name on a utility bill to get a woman's place.

Sorry posted before I added aboveBlush

BetsyM00 · 17/10/2020 13:33

The Mexican story was reported in the Guardian a while back:
www.theguardian.com/world/2018/jun/22/mexico-elections-fake-transgender-candidates-disqualified

And if a Scotsman was called Lee or Alex or Lesley, or any other unisex name, there would not even be a need to change details on a utility bill.

Wonder how it works in practice? If someone who clearly appears to be a man turns up for an interview for a position on the board, does the interviewer have to ask if he is actually a woman so they know which part of the quota to allocate him/her to.

Cismyfatarsey · 17/10/2020 15:05

This is an extraordinary piece of work from FWS (who I support). They are taking a government to court. Please find spades and share widely.

334bu · 17/10/2020 17:37

Not allowed to ask for any proof . They can be in s three piece suit with a beard and can't be challenged.

CharlieParley · 17/10/2020 17:56

@334bu

I realise that these are men pretending to be trans to take positions specifically for transwomen but if they were willing to do this I am sure they would change their name on a utility bill to get a woman's place.

Sorry posted before I added aboveBlush

Not quite. So this Mexican law is the same kind of law that FWS are going to court about.

It was intended to ensure that at least 50% of all candidates are female, because women are hugely underrepresented in Mexico. The lawmakers were persuaded to allow Muxes, that is males who present and/or behave in feminine ways, to take slots otherwise reserved for female candidates. There is no justification for this either, just as there is none for the Scottish law including males, but in any case it was immediately and massively abused.

Men did find other ways to undermine the law, but self-identifying as women is the easiest and most popular.

334bu · 17/10/2020 19:25

Thanks Charley.
" Men would never do that! " say the transactivists.

Well as they would say up here "Aye right!

334bu · 18/10/2020 08:53

Looks like Shirley Ann Somerville who was in charge of GRA reform might be having difficulty in getting reselected. Article in Times. Makes a change from the attempts to get rid of anyone remotely GC.

334bu · 18/10/2020 08:56

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4053719-Elections-in-Scotland-next-year

I can't seem to open Times link but maybe you can

ArabellaScott · 18/10/2020 10:50

Shirley Ann Somerville. I wrote to her a year or so ago on the subject of GRA reform. I have an obviously female first name. The reply was addressed to 'Mr Arabella Scott'. (I dont use titles, will have signed with my name). Just deliberate misgendering; so utterly childish, it made a very clear mockery of the pretence of 'be kind and inclusive'.

fatblackcatspaw · 18/10/2020 13:02

@ArabellaScott

Shirley Ann Somerville. I wrote to her a year or so ago on the subject of GRA reform. I have an obviously female first name. The reply was addressed to 'Mr Arabella Scott'. (I dont use titles, will have signed with my name). Just deliberate misgendering; so utterly childish, it made a very clear mockery of the pretence of 'be kind and inclusive'.
I'm now wondering if there is a underling layer of wokies at SNP as others have indicated in MP's offices who are effectively cutting out all the critical voices and filtering what actually gets to politicians?
ArabellaScott · 18/10/2020 13:10

Seems highly likely.

Alicethroughtheblackmirror · 18/10/2020 17:49

In light of this definition of woman in the dreadful act: "always using female pronouns; using a female name on official documents such as a driving licence or passport, or on utility bills or bank accounts", it's rather fascinating that Mridul Wadhwa - the legally male manager of a rape crisis centre who has now taken a spot on a all woman shortlist - has a name that, in India, is a boy's name.

I know wings are not everyone's cup of tea, but this is a zinger of an article on MW and shows the direction of travel in the SNP wingsoverscotland.com/waiting-for-the-men/

I wonder if the SNP will draw up an approved list of "female" names. Does the former FM's name, Alex, count, I wonder...?

midgebabe · 18/10/2020 17:59

Whoops

By the definition, I guess I am not woman as my Sainsbury's account is mr midge

334bu · 19/10/2020 15:45

Bump!

BetsyM00 · 21/10/2020 15:20

The case has been written up in Scottish Legal News.

And the Crowd Justice fundraiser could do with a bit of a bumping too for anyone on Twitter.

Alicethroughtheblackmirror · 21/10/2020 15:26

This is so important!

It looks like this could set precedent in E&W as well as Scotland, so EqA couldn't be undermined by stealth in other legislation.

Keep bumping that crowdfunder!

Aesopfable · 21/10/2020 15:31

Wasn't Jennifer James taking legal action on AWSL? Or was that for something else? Did that ever come to anything?

NonnyMouse1337 · 21/10/2020 15:48

@BetsyM00

The case has been written up in Scottish Legal News.

And the Crowd Justice fundraiser could do with a bit of a bumping too for anyone on Twitter.

Great article. Makes the policy capture very clear.

During stage two of the legislative process, following representations from Scottish Trans Alliance, the definition of “woman” in the bill was altered to include people who have not changed their legal sex to ‘female’ using a gender recognition certificate (GRC) and to exclude some people who remain female in law – those transitioning to live as men, but who do not have a GRC.

FindTheTruth · 21/10/2020 15:51

"It is vital, not only for Scotland but for the wider UK, that equality law cannot be ignored or set aside in this manner.”

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/10/2020 15:57

Wasn't Jennifer James taking legal action on AWSL? Or was that for something else? Did that ever come to anything?

Still ongoing, latest update I had from her.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 21/10/2020 16:05

I wish it would get a wriggle on now that a transwomen is standing as a candidate in an AWS.

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