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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Why 'MAP'?

116 replies

JellySlice · 17/08/2020 00:08

Why has 'Minor Attracted Person' replaced 'paedophile'?

OP posts:
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ItsLateHumpty · 17/08/2020 10:07

Yep, non-offending minor attracted person.

And yep, if their bio says MAP does that mean they are (currently or in the past) child sex offenders.

Mind blown 🤯

Skyliner001 · 17/08/2020 10:14

@Motherofmonsters

Skyliner- they've said it themselves that they want to be included in LGBT+. It's not something I've just made up to cause friction, I'm not saying they'll ever be excepted but it's what they want
I didn't mean to offend you. I appreciate that that's what they're trying to do, however I think it's a completely ludicrous idea. I'm deeply offensive. That's not aimed at you though. It's aimed at them!
Skyliner001 · 17/08/2020 10:15

@merrymouse

Skyliner 'kinks' are already included in LGBT+ and there is already confusion over whether a Pride event that celebrates kinks can be 'family friendly'. Many kinks that seem to be viewed as 'main stream' by pride organisers - e.g. furries - have an obvious appeal for children.

mobile.twitter.com/Docstockk/status/1294889727741616128

Kathleen Stock
@Docstockk
The thought-crushingly banal language of "diversity and inclusion" can be used for literally any cause.

"Some felt that not all kinks were represented and there was a lack of diversity within the groups that were present"

UK Pride Organisers Network

"Is your Pride event REALLY inclusive of everyone within the LGBTQ+ community?

We recently shared a survey focusing on the inclusion of Pups, Furries & Kinksters at Pride."

There have been a lot of comments on this tweet about inclusion of 'kinksters' because one of the questions they asked was whether a 'physical kink area' should be 18+, and a significant proportion of respondents appear to have said no.

Oh dear God. Paedophilia is not a kink.
Cocothefirst · 17/08/2020 10:17

Perhaps when we see 'MAP' we should avoid the trap of being drawn into the precise technical definitions of paedophilia and ask for clarification - do they mean Child Rapist, other Child Sex Abusers, Child Sex Abuse Fetishist , and a second question - why are they trying to enable or normalise Child Sex Abuse?

This.

FlamingoAndJohn · 17/08/2020 10:24

Oh dear God. Paedophilia is not a kink.

But this is exactly what they are trying to do. In their mind being attracted to children is like being attracted to the same sex.

FlamingoAndJohn · 17/08/2020 10:24

Which is not to say same sex attraction is a kink of course.

Oncewasblueandlangtoo · 17/08/2020 10:26

MAPs are paedophiles.
They have an "age of attraction" on their twitter bios,that is, the age of the children they are attracted too.Why do twitter allow this?
These people say they are not harmful to children and they don't offend.So why do they put the age of the child in their bios.What purpose does it serve.
I've noticed a lot of these paedophiles claim to be 18 up to early 20s.

merrymouse · 17/08/2020 10:27

Does it matter to society whether an adult wants the right to sexually assault a 6yo or a 12yo?

I think there is minimal difference, even if the other party is a 15 year old.

A 'MAP' is not somebody attracted to a contemporary who would want to form relationships with adults once they were also an adult, or somebody who wasn't aware of the other party's age.

It's somebody who is specifically attracted to people who cannot give legal consent to sex.

FemaleAndLearning · 17/08/2020 10:32

I read somewhere, sorry no source, that these paedophiles get away with using MAP on their Twitter bios as they are not committing crime. Still disgusting though as most of them say in their bio to private message so basically Twitter is being used as s platform to share this interest. Twitter doesn't know what they say in private messages.

ThePurported · 17/08/2020 10:33

It's amazing how many MAP/NOMAP advocates have been exposed as child abusers.

This article is illuminating
thepostmillennial.com/the-bizarre-world-of-tax-exempt-pedophiles/

"In 2009, the anti-pedophilia blog Absolute Zero (now defunct) reported that [convicted sex offender] Melsheimer was active on the forum BoyChat after he would have founded B4U-Act, and was dismissing concerns from fellow “boy lovers” about the mission statement of the organization. Melsheimer was rallying fellow pedophiles around the notion that NAMBLA had failed in its mission to normalize pedophilia, and a new approach focused around the appearance of “prevention” would be more publicly acceptable.

B4U-Act regularly employs and invites convicted and “non-offending” pedophiles to speak at symposiums and workshops described as “heart opening, powerful, and courageous.” Their Know the Facts page begins by suggesting that “most” adults have an attraction to children or prepubescent adolescents. Both the including Stories of Hope and of Being a MAP sections are populated by a man named Richard Kramer, who is a registered sex offender in the State of Wisconsin.

B4U-Act, like Prostasia, classifies pedophilia as a sexuality or sexual orientation, and does not seek to change or discourage a pedophile’s sexual feelings towards children. It is listed on Prostasia’s site as one helpful resource for pedophiles.

The organization also has campaigned to change and ultimately eliminate the Diagnostic and Statistics Manual entry on pedophilia. At one point, a newsletter was issued which was excitedly uploaded to BoyChat discussing changes in the DSM-5 which moved pedophilia slightly closer to homosexuality, and “acknowledged that the sexual attraction to children did not constitute a disorder.” As B4U-Act currently seeks primarily to inform therapists, this is particularly dangerous. In its Guide for Therapists, B4U-Act encourages those counselling pedophiles to take an “LGBT affirmative psychotherapy approach,” and treat “minor-attracted person’s sexuality” as “innate, unchangeable, and subject to personal acceptance.”

Perhaps the most shocking and most blatant organization found during the course of this investigation was the Pedophile Associates of America Ltd, which was granted full IRS tax-exempt status in 2018

The organization’s address was listed to a quaint home in Bumpass, Virginia, which realty searches revealed just recently sold for over $400,000. The home belonged to an elderly woman, her grandson, Ian Andrew Zearley, was using the address as a registration point for the IRS filings. In 2010, Zearley had been convicted of two counts of child pornography possession, landing him 6 years in prison"

merrymouse · 17/08/2020 10:34

Oh dear God. Paedophilia is not a kink.

But this is exactly what 'MAPs' are claiming, and people are actively trying to remove the boundaries that protect children from adult sexual activity.

They are pushing on the door marked 'inclusivity' and 'diversity'.

highame · 17/08/2020 10:35

LGBT has expanded enormously over recent years and there doesn't seem to have been a check on what's going on. There is always the chance that, once a ball is rolling, it becomes very difficult to tell where it's going.

These people will do everything they can to find a way to be recognised or at least infiltrate a group to give themselves legitimacy. At some point, the LGBT+ community are going to have to deal with this. I think grey areas are a real threat and 'inclusive' for everyone has weaknesses to be exploited.

In no way should groups representing the gay community be tarnished because everyone wants to be included.

merrymouse · 17/08/2020 10:43

In no way should groups representing the gay community be tarnished because everyone wants to be included.

It's just as possible to have family friendly Pride events as it is to have family friendly National Trust events, and many of the people who are pushing for the inclusion of kinks in LGBT+ are heterosexual.

The problem is the orthodoxy that everyone must be included.

FemaleAndLearning · 17/08/2020 10:53

I couldn't find cummie cutie on twitter just some thread about the whole MAP thing bring a hoax by right wingers!
twitter.com/ElwoodPolly/status/1288504813815304198?s=19

Imnobody4 · 17/08/2020 10:53

While the gay community shouldn't be held accountable for the kink model of inclusion, they can be held accountable for not condemning what's happening.

Why 'MAP'?
Why 'MAP'?
Imnobody4 · 17/08/2020 11:00

The MAP idea is another Trojan horse. It's enabled by Twitter under freedom of speech but gives paedophiles a platform from which to build allies and networks in plain sight as a normal part of social interaction.

JellySlice · 17/08/2020 11:14

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Soontobe60 · 17/08/2020 11:16

@RCBadger

Paedophile and MAP are not necessarily the same thing. A paedophile is sexually attracted to prepubescent children. An MAP is sexually attracted to people who are minors. If the minor is considered under the age of consent, then having sex with them if you an adult is a crime. But it's not the same as paedophilia.
Says anyone who claims to be a MAP. Anyone who wants to rape a child is equally as perverted.
ThePurported · 17/08/2020 11:21

just some thread about the whole MAP thing bring a hoax by right wingers

Someone better tell Dr James Cantor and the Silicon Valley lawyer who are steering one of these MAP advocacy orgs.

ErrolTheDragon · 17/08/2020 11:29

[quote FemaleAndLearning]I couldn't find cummie cutie on twitter just some thread about the whole MAP thing bring a hoax by right wingers!
twitter.com/ElwoodPolly/status/1288504813815304198?s=19[/quote]
That piece is saying 'cummie cutie' and the attempt to add P to the alphabet soup were a hoax, not that "the whole MAP" thing is a hoax.

Dervel · 17/08/2020 11:45

Actually the word pedophile slightly annoys me from an etymological perspective. We get the phile bit of some words from Classical Greek, as they had multiple words for love e.g. agape, storge, philia and eros. Philia means the love between friends, it’s Eros that represents sexual lust and attraction. We actually have a lesser used word in old psychological literature: Pederast. I often wonder if the world pedophile itself was some earlier historical attempt to rebrand the sexual attraction towards children to something more palatable. I fear they’ve been at this for awhile...

JellySlice · 17/08/2020 11:52

Unfortunately pederast became a highly pejorative word for homosexual, so is now unusable as it would be perceived as homophobic.

OP posts:
NiceGerbil · 17/08/2020 11:54

MAP on MN still means morning after pill to the vast majority of women I'd have thought.

That's what it was used for on a thread the other day.

I've seen paedophile used loads I don't think MAP is common use at all.

ErrolTheDragon · 17/08/2020 11:55

We actually have a lesser used word in old psychological literature: Pederast

Afaik that specifically relates to homoerotic paedo/hebe/ephebe behaviours.

The Greek origins were possibly in part the result of the societal control of women and the guarding of paternity. Boys were the alternative 'non man'. (I've heard that for similar reasons lesbian relationships might have been more common).

But yes, the "-Philia" is so wrong. These people don't love children, and certainly not as friends.

So yes, let's ditch those '-philias' and stick to more accurate, non euphemistic terms along the lines of my previous post.

FlamingoAndJohn · 17/08/2020 12:02

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