Dominos and the offer to "Karens"

[hilaryhughes]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-53589897

So Dominos has cancelled its offer of free pizza to "Karens" that it made on social media a few days back. The reason for this cancellation is the backlash it received from the wokies, who aren't very happy that white women are being rewarded with free pizza (lol), because they're entitled, privileged, and use their skin colour in nefarious ways.

For example, twitter.com/aramreyess/status/1288314493085179904

I'm absolutely sick of this anti-woman, anti-white bullsh*t that's spreading through society.. I just have to say. Why is this happening?

@Ereshkigalangcleg

What's jaw-dropping though is the arrogance and ethnocentricity of so many US voices on social media who assume that the world, its language and norms, revolves around their country and their culture.

I find it really annoying. Karen is not in any way a middle class name in the UK.

Yes, it's the complete opposite.

Names like Tracey, Karen, and Sharon are stereotypically working-class in the UK - and have been duly wheeled out by posh comedians skitting 'common' people.

Can't tell that to Americans, though (or other Anglophone nationals who think they're American).

Might as well tell them what a Karen is in Myanmar - the outside world is just a murky backwater of California.

I've never thought of Karen as a working class name in the UK. It's not the same as Sharon or Tracey. Until this awful meme Karen wasn't used in the same way as Sharon and Tracey.

I was at school with a few Karens- one was the daughter of a farmer who owned hundreds of acres and a beautiful rambling 18th century farmhouse.

Karen is not in any way a middle class name in the UK.

Just on my experience I agree, very much working class. I also have a friend called Karen who is not white, she must have been lying about her name all of these years . When I worked in retail I would say that men were on the whole much ruder and petty in their complaints, but then they're allowed to be, they are men. Women are always judged more heavily for daring to stick up for themselves or speak up (basing that on the UKs alleged version rather than the US where it's taken on a whole new level). I think dominos heart was in the right place.

Retail is an equal opportunity 'get shat on' profession. I have had rude and entitled customers from all demographics. The worst people, male or female, were those who would kick off about wine offers because they refused to believe, despite the many posters and leaflets telling them that exclusions applied, that exclusions did indeed apply.

So basically, alcohol is the devil here, not white women's tears.

And yes, most Karens I have known have been working class, with the exception of one Scottish woman I knew about 20 years ago, so maybe there's a distinction in English and Scottish usage.

It's used on MN by women.

It is, I'm not saying women don't use it at all.

I was at school with a few Karens- one was the daughter of a farmer who owned hundreds of acres and a beautiful rambling 18th century farmhouse.

I wasn't at school with anyone who lived in a beautiful rambling 18th century farmhouse. I was at school with quite a few Karens though, and they weren't middle class.

i wasn't at school with anyone who lived in a beautiful rambling 18th century farmhouse

No, I didn’t know anyone who lived in a detached house

I’m obviously positive they existed...like myth or legend

Or does that mean they didnt exist 🤔

Anyway...someone in our school must have lived in a detached house...just not in my friendship group

DidoLamenting Thu 30-Jul-20 21:02:56
Ereshkigalangcleg

What's jaw-dropping though is the arrogance and ethnocentricity of so many US voices on social media who assume that the world, its language and norms, revolves around their country and their culture.

I find it really annoying. Karen is not in any way a middle class name in the UK.

Eh? Not a middle class name? Even allowing for what does "working class " even mean, all the Karens I know are definitely middle class including
an art teacher at a fee paying school; several partners in law and accountancy firms who very clearly
did not come from working class backgrounds;
and one double- barreled Karen who is a member of the Scottish aristocracy and has a tomb and statue of a 16th century ancestor in a major Scottish abbey.
....
Maybe but I can assure you the name became very popular/fashionable in the late 1970s for people from the upper working to lower middle classes to call their daughters, 'Karen'. Hairdressers, typists, etc; it's up there with the Joannes, Samanthas and Kellys.

Nothing wrong with the name itself but it should not be used as a label, it is hardly fair to people who are called, 'Karen'.

In this country, where that has caught on, it refers to rather brash, vulgar women who have are not without money, maybe 'Essex types', who complain loudly to and about people trying to serve them, eg in shops. In America you add 'white' to the equation.

It is so horrible, I can't believe Mumsnet posters are buying in to this stereotype.

I also don't know any posh Karens.

In my experience, far from being a shop assistant's worst nightmare, British Karen works in retail herself and has plenty of tales to tell you about customers from hell.

My name is Karen. You can imagine some of the things that have been said to me on Twitter. I hate it; their lazy, misogynistic, cowardly, sexist, ageist & unintelligent inability to hold a sensible conversation can still be quite soul destroying.
My name now seems to be a substitute slur for the ill-educated woke types.

And yes, most Karens I have known have been working class, with the exception of one Scottish woman I knew about 20 years ago, so maybe there's a distinction in English and Scottish usage

I'm in Scotland- almost all the Karens I've known were middle class. My school was a large rural comprehensive with a wide catchment area. Every one went to the same school. "Karens" were not one social class any more than Margarets, Susans, Lauras or Jennifers.

@Bella2020

My name is Karen. You can imagine some of the things that have been said to me on Twitter. I hate it; their lazy, misogynistic, cowardly, sexist, ageist & unintelligent inability to hold a sensible conversation can still be quite soul destroying. My name now seems to be a substitute slur for the ill-educated woke types.

Which is precisely why we should try to stop it right now.

How many people is a mob anyway?

Just one. Or is that just my dc? sounds like a whole mob going along the landing or upstairs, and if there is a meltdown...

Domino’s makes a light-hearted and rather kind gesture to the women being insulted for nothing other than their name. Insults soaked in misogyny, ageism and hypocrisy. So the abuse gets hurled at Domino’s too and they have to grovel apologies for their friendly gesture. Sad world.

I'm almost tempted to buy a Domino's pizza. I agree- it was a nice gesture.

All these people on Twitter complaining and asking for the manager are, ironically, acting like the “Karens” they so despise ...

You misunderstand. They are not acting like Karen's. Acting like Karen means misunderstanding your place in the hierarchy and thinking you are allowed to have an opinion,

Perhaps don a tshirt saying " I am Karen. Where's my free Pizza? Get me the manager!"

I wonder if Nandos had done the same gesture? Would the wokies try and stop black Karens from getting a free Nandos???

My t-shirt is going to say

Karen's are Kool

Solidarity here with all women. Sex is the divider, not a name

thinkingaboutLangCleg: Domino’s makes a light-hearted and rather kind gesture to the women being insulted for nothing other than their name. Insults soaked in misogyny, ageism and hypocrisy. So the abuse gets hurled at Domino’s too and they have to grovel apologies for their friendly gesture. Sad world.

Yeah exactly @thinkingaboutLangCleg. It's madness.

re class: according to the ONS, Karen was number 3 for girls' baby names in 1964 and number 10 in 1974. So it is a very common name for middle-aged women in the UK.

Even if 'common' names aren't always avoided by the well-to-do, given the class makeup of the UK 1964-74 - and given that 'working class' as a cultural indicator means being born and raised in a working class household - it's fair to assume that, like its fellow top-10ers in 1964 Sharon, Tracy and Tracey, a British "Karen" is typically working class.

Many of us will obviously know exceptions, but I am inclined to agree with Julie Bindel that the mindless transposition of this American meme into UK parlance is ageist and classist as well as misogynistic.

When she tweeted to this effect, the immediate stateside responses assumed a US milieu: white people calling it a slur...weaponising their privilege, created by Black women to talk about white women’s violence against us, upper middle class, peak Karen, Karen etc.

They do genuinely think the USA is the world. US ethnocentricity and parochialism has caused significant damage outside of its borders - from Vietnam to Libya - and should be challenged more.

This is the person who started the Dominos campaign in the first place;

au.linkedin.com/in/allan-collins-cmo

White, privileged, wealthy male doing something kind and beneficial for women in general. Good for him.

I have know many Karens over the years. It's just a name that was popular in 60s-70s
Most I know are working class or lower middle class so where has this idea of priveliged white woman come from
It's just pure misogyny

My comprehensive school in a working class area in the 80s had plenty of Karens. It might not be an exclusively working class name but it was certainly widely used by the working classes in the 60s/70s. With no other clues I would assume someone called Karen was a woman like me - middle-aged and working class.