Women’s toilets now gender neutral in Northampton Park

[bloodyhamabeads]

I noticed this today while walking in Abington Park in Northampton. Only the women’s has changed, the men’s is still labelled ‘gentlemen’.

Is this actually legal? I’ve heard the equality act mentioned and had a quick google but I wondered whether anyone can point me in the right direction of some legislation I can quote when I write to the council.

I think the blokes are still open - when I went to take the photo it was evening so they had both been locked up. The Covid sign talking about distancing I think.

I know this park well, and those toilets are already pretty "notorious". My children are older now, but when they were little we went to Abby park all the time, and always used the cafe toilets rather than these. I wonder if NCC have chosen these toilets as they are not well used, and are hoping nobody will notice, all whilst giving themselves a big pat on the back for being "inclusive" 🙄🙄🙄

If you get any joy from the chron let me know, I will happily put my opinion across.

That was my reaction too Molten, scary for women

I will let you know mcdog
That’s what I was thinking... put a new sign up and hope no one will notice. We usually go to the cafe too but it’s closed due to Covid.

I'd like to see them make the men's toilet unisex instead of the womens it would be interesting to see the reaction from the male population.
And how fast they changed it back.

Have they done an Equality Assessment? That’s the question to ask.

nzborn

I'd like to see them make the men's toilet unisex instead of the womens it would be interesting to see the reaction from the male population.
And how fast they changed it back.

Any local Mumsnetters.

Tell the local council/councillors to do just that. And get back to us on chat and AIBU with their recorded answers.

If they continue with their illegal activity, let the authorities know.

And in no particular order.

The Guardian newspaper.
The Sun.
The Mirror.
The Times.
The Telegraph *
The Sport
Metro

All local newspapers.

mcdog Thank you for your post

Update
I’ve had a reply from the new Chief Executive of the Council who said she is in the process of drafting a fuller response to me and also to the local newspaper who have contacted her.

Apparently the men’s toilets is currently closed due to Covid so they have opened the women’s up as mixed sex also as a trial.

I expressed concern that surely fewer toilets available would mean greater potential for crowding and therefore an increased covid risk. I have also asked what steps are being put into place to prevent voyerism and also which toilets are available for women who cannot share a space with men due to religious or cultural reasons.

Bravo OP.

Yes, it is infuriating that what females want and what a whole sex class forming half the human race should deserve to be allowed in a world supposedly past sexist disadvantage based on biology - but the fact is that it's the threat of legal action that puts enough fear up an authority to think.

They cannot exclude females from female provision, particularly based on vulnerable characteristics with legal protection, in a half assed attempt to right the perceived wrongs of males. That isn't going to stand up in court.

Awesome news and please keep us updated l note with concern the words " also as a trial "
l have noticed my local council using COVID 19 as a reason to remove services and then not reinstating them when contacted, don't intend reinstating them with excuses.

Fantastic work, OP - it's these local acts of clarity which will keep things equitable & fair, and stop the creep of loss of women's rights.

We really need to do a big collaborative crowd-sourced MN project on the history of public toilets for women and the ways in which they enabled women to go out in public safely. 150 years ago, this wasn't the case.

And I am old enough to remember when "Not enough Ladies' toilets" was seen as a reasonable excuse for not employing women in some areas of work.

You only have to look at older public buildings and the provision of Ladies lavatories to see how little public space women were allowed to occupy.

This is a 2007/2008 UK Parliamentary report on the provision of public toilets. It advises that there should be more female toilets than male toilets because of the specific needs of the female sex. I cannot see it mentioning unisex or communal toilets. Pity it refers to gender instead of sex though.

publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200708/cmselect/cmcomloc/636/636.pdf

"46.Women take longer to go to the toilet because of “a range of sartorial, biological and functional reasons...Women have more functions than men [and] at any time about a quarter of all women of childbearing age will be menstruating, whereas pregnant women, those at menopause and those with diabetes...will need to use the toilet more often.”81 The Government’s Strategic Guide states that women make up more than half the UK population, with a higher proportion of older people being women, yet women are catered for on a 50:50 basis, and sometimes on a 70:30 basis in favour of men.82 There is more provision for men, primarily because of the smaller space that urinals take83 and also, according to the BTA, “Britain’s public toilets were established in an age when men walked, cycled or caught a bus to work and women stayed at home to raise the family.”8447.British Standard BS6465 Part 1 2006 is the Code of Practice for the design of sanitary facilities and scales of provision of sanitary and associated appliances. It has been updated to correct the historical position of women having fewer appliances in toilets than men and is being further updated to comply with requirements in the Gender Equality Duty.85 Clara Greed compares the current British Standard BS6465 with those in the Far East: Japan is at the centre of the restroom revolution. Standards as to geographical distribution of toilet provision are very high, and ratios of 2:1 in favour of women are to be found in terms of numbers of places to pee.8648.The BTA is involved in the update of BS6465 Part 1 2006 and recommends a ratio of provision of 2 female to 1 male facilities. Most people compare cubicle numbers only but the male urinals have to be added to male cubicles to ascertain the total male provision. Hence, when a toilet has three male urinals and two male cubicles – i.e. a total of five male facilities, the female toilet should have ten cubicles to achieve the 2:1 ratio."

Apparently the men’s toilets is currently closed due to Covid so they have opened the women’s up as mixed sex

This makes no sense and I struggle to believe it. And the Equality Act 2010 must be in the dustiest law book on the shelf.

Fantastic work OP.

Covid? Are they saying that gents might otherwise get a bit too close in the gents and that's why they've closed it?? That's why women have to share their space at this time?? I also noted the 'also as a trial' bit too. Sod that.

Wow - not much privacy, regardless of whether they are gender neutral or single sex!

No, I agree theres not much privacy. The only toilet I’d use if desperate. Lots of people don’t have that same luxury though do they 😞

Bullshit. If there are a row of urinals they could install screens between them. There are ways to deal with it. Trial my arse.

I blinking knew that c19 would be used as a reason OP.

I am a woman on a mission looking for these things now, now that I've emailed all the MPs.
Also looking for the email address to send off my email to JKR

Is there a way we could contact this council to ask if they can add ourselves to the email chain awaiting the reply and therefore draw attention to the number of women interested,

That would be fantastic nzborn - the more voices the better! The new chief exec is Marion Goodman - [email protected]

I’m also planning to ask her, as she mentioned it’s a trial, how will they measure it/know if it’s been a success.

midwestsummer yes it’s such a cop out isn’t it. I’m going to have a wander past and see whether the men’s is actually open in the day. When I went it was early evening and they were both locked.