If Daniel and Rupert were honest

[MrsKingfisher]

Would they themselves have an intimate relationship with a trans woman? I mean because as far as they are concerned they are who they say they are trans woman ARE women.

[quote PeaceCheese]@TheCrowAndThePitcher it does, because the two can look the same to someone who doesn't know much about trans or intersex people. Also some intersex people are trans.

So when you say that a woman can't have a penis, it can alienate people who are biologically female and may not be trans[/quote]
One is a biological reality. One isn’t. Big difference.

If someone is female but has male anatomy and doesn’t wish for that to change, I’m pretty sure they’d feel alienated if you called them a woman! Haven’t quite a few of those with DSD said they don’t want to be part of the trans community and don’t like being used as’proof’?

If I said: I want to black. I feel I am black because I just have this feeling and I really like watermelon or whatever offensive outdated stereotype you like. Hang on, someone over there has African and white European parents, yay now I’m black too. Some people have mixed ethnicity, so I can too! Nought to do with my makeup but look it happens! Now, give me your awards, your support groups, let me have my natal-white crimes recorded as black crimes, let black lives matter defend me in court. How would you feel about that argument? I feel it’s shit, offensive and racist. Feel the same way about how some people are intersex so therefore I can change my sex. Except sexist instead of racist, obviously.

chromosomes are complicated, and don't relate in a linear fashion to gender,

That is because biology is unrelated to gender. People who are missing a human gamete and have only one X chromosome have Turner Syndrome, their ovarian function is compromised, but they are not male.

Where are cases of people having a Y chromosome that has been partially deleted having fully functioning female reproductive organs, when those who have only one X have Turner Syndrome and do not have fully functioning ovaries?

Because who are XXX (or above) or XYY (or above) are meta-females or meta-males, the definition being encoded in the extra X or Y.

Biology is not gender.

this is about safety, dignity and fairness for women and girls. So some het bloke from HP says he would have sex with a tw. So what?

Yes exactly. It might serve to expose their own hypocrisy, but the degree to which DR or RG live out their belief that TWAW doesn't have any bearing on whether TW actually AW.

It just confirms what they believe.

All DR and RG have to do to avoid looking bad is say 'yes, if course I'd date a transwoman, if I were single and there was a mutual attraction, etc', and then go about their lives while that actual scenario curiously never arises.

The generally male scientists that have been trying to work out how to grow babies in bags have that view of pregnancy etc, yes.

Otherwise they would think hold on, there's more to this than just growing one.

They have been started with sheep.

I stand corrected, Swyer Sydrome, startlingly rare and again, has nothing to do with gender but with biology. Gender is a human construct.

You said it was fairly common for people not to have typical xx or XY chromosomes.

Interestingly the word typical kind of means that is what happens most of the time. If it was fairly common to have other combinations, then the word typical wouldn't be used to describe xx or XY as you did.

The point with the boko haram girls is that they were taken because they were female, they were raped because they were female, most of them got pregnant.

The men didn't need to check their chromosomes.

'As I stated in that post, it's more than possible to get pregnant and have a baby if your chromosomes aren't XX'

What about XY?

And what about the fact that plenty of intersex groups have asked to be left out of this whole thing?

Why should men be the arbiters of what it means to be a woman?

^ This

They always have been.

Nothing changes.

'As I stated in that post, it's more than possible to get pregnant and have a baby if your chromosomes aren't XX'

From what I have learned, no. In such cases, Turner Syndrome, Swyer Syndrome and the like, the ovaries are not fully functional and cannot become pregnant without assisted conception of donated egg or embryo, but not spontaneously.

Why are we back to people with DSDs again? Intersex conditions have precisely fuck all to do with transgender.

The point with the boko haram girls is that they were taken because they were female, they were raped because they were female, most of them got pregnant.

Precisely. When it's important (ie. Knowing who to rape, deny an abortion to, deny maternity rights to etc etc etc), men have never had any trouble knowing who the females are.

++

Get a woman to use as a surrogate

@wrongsideofhistorymyarse that’s so good 😂 And probably true.

Why are we back to people with DSDs again? Intersex conditions have precisely fuck all to do with transgender

It never did but the trans community have so little substance they have no option to jump on a band wagon.

Not to mention those with dsd's being 0,018 per cent of the population.

It has nothing to do with trans.
Sex is not a spectrum.

yes science welcomes women equally these days and they get the same level of opportunity, funding for projects etc etc

yes it's definitely not men who have a longstanding preoccupation with the irritating fact that only women can make babies

You seem to be giving out pretty glib answers without thinking about things in much depth

Not just scientific, there is reams of literature about this topic, and of course the fact that paternity anxiety has led to the oppression of women and girls all over the world in the most terrible of ways and for a very very long time.

I fully support JKR and dislike this pair of twerps
However, I don’t really have an issue with them spouting their woke pile of crap views as long as they also used their profile to condemn the violence that JKR has been threatened with.
They could have said that we believe TWAW etc etc AND we also utterly condemn the language used in certain quarters in reaction to what JKR said

The irony is that you just know she'd have gone to bat for any of them if they had needed her.

Look at how caring she was with Evanna - she literally helped her to rebuild her life.

Would anyone here have sex with a transwoman?

Potentially, yes. A transwoman is male: I'm attracted to males

Get a woman to use as a surrogate

A couple of years ago there was a blue tick on Twitter, a gay guy, but I can't remember his name now? He was very 'TWAW, awful TERFs' etc and it really pissed me off because he and his partner had used a surrogate to have a baby and I thought the utter shittery of using a woman's biology when it suits you, and then later in denying it and calling women who stand up for that biology bigots etc was just bloody awful.

A couple of years ago there was a blue tick on Twitter, a gay guy, but I can't remember his name now? He was very 'TWAW, awful TERFs' etc and it really pissed me off because he and his partner had used a surrogate to have a baby and I thought the utter shittery of using a woman's biology when it suits you, and then later in denying it and calling women who stand up for that biology bigots etc was just bloody awful.

Tom Daley?

I mean, he's the first who came to mind, but there are plenty of men who will rent a womb.

No, I did think of Tom Daley, as he is the same, but I don't think it was him that time. It was someone more voiceferous against women, I'm sure. I remember feeling so cross about it!