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Original poster

Different expectations of male and female politicians?

68 replies

BitOfFun · 05/04/2020 17:24

I was struck watching the excoriating self-abasement of the Scottish Chief Medical Officer- it was about ten minutes of grovelling. Then I thought of Boris and how he would get away with mumbling something and a sheepish chuckle.

Why?

OP posts:
Bluebell246 · 05/04/2020 17:33

The CMO is not a politician and she has every reason to apologise. She is the face of a campaign urging others to stay at home and she has chosen to ignore her own advice by travelling to her second home. Not once but twice. This was no mistake. It was a choice. An utterly arrogant hypocritical choice. It has nothing to do with her sex and everything to do with her lack of judgement.

Ohdeariedear · 05/04/2020 17:38

She’s not a politician though. She is the face of all the messaging here about staying at home - tv and radio ads, as well as daily televised briefings. She was found out going to her second home this weekend, the Scottish gov issued a statement about it this morning, then this afternoon she said she’d actually been twice. She deserves everything she’s getting to be honest and it’s completely right that she has been removed from all media and briefings now as she has no credibility.

I’m more annoyed that she was a woman doing a great job in a very important and visible role and now she’s reduced to a joke by her idiotic choices. Gives a certain section of society another reason to to take senior women less seriously.

butterpuffed · 05/04/2020 17:43

It's a bit of a non point, OP, because Boris hasn't done it as far as we know, ridiculous to assume he'd get away with it.

DidoLamenting · 05/04/2020 20:36

You are scraping the barrel and then some OP. Firstly as others have said she is a very senior Civil Servant, not an MP.

Her behaviour has been disgraceful. She did not make a mistake. A mistake would have been not knowing she was supposed to practice social distancing. Difficult to see how she could not know that.

The alternative is she thinks these rules only apply to the little people, not important people like her.

PositiveVibez · 05/04/2020 20:40

This is not a feminist issue.

This is a 'I am an arrogant twat' issue.

Goosefoot · 05/04/2020 21:00

I think you have to be careful with this kind of comparison. Notwithstanding she is a civil servant, she is one person. Boris is another person. The way people respond to each is only partly about their sex, it's also about a lot of other things in their personalities.

DidoLamenting · 05/04/2020 22:23

Calderwood has just resigned. It's the right thing to do. She hadn't been open about breaching the rules on 2 occasions. Sturgeon should not have defended her when that came out.

MoleSmokes · 06/04/2020 05:06

BitOfFun - A better comparison would be the male politician given a formal warning by the police for "a 'suspected breach of coronavirus restrictions' after attending a funeral with up to 100 mourners"

He has not been on telly every day telling people to stay at home and not to attend a series of funerals with up to 100 mourners each, so I don't expect we will see Tahir Ali MP apologising on TV - we can but hope!

Another one who apparently thinks they are so important that they are above the law.

"Police issue warning to MP Tahir Ali after he attends funeral with 'up to 100 mourners' "

www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/police-issue-warning-mp-tahir-18038507

TheBewildernessisWeetabix · 06/04/2020 05:15

Boris was going round shaking hands at hospitals while the death toll mounted but somehow that wasn't as big a deal as a medical officer traveling to her second home. OK.

Reginabambina · 06/04/2020 05:35

I really don’t think this has anything to do with being female and I really don’t think that BJ would get away with muttering something sheepishly.

TheBewildernessisWeetabix · 06/04/2020 05:49

Some of us have been in isolation since February because we were paying attention.
Others, not so much.

marcopront · 06/04/2020 05:57

Going to a funeral and shaking people in hospital hands are both positive things to do for the community and were not hidden. They may not be the most sensible things to do but it is different to sneaking off to your second home.

DidoLamenting · 06/04/2020 06:36

Boris was going round shaking hands at hospitals while the death toll mounted but somehow that wasn't as big a deal as a medical officer traveling to her second home. OK

She isn't just a "medical officer" . She is the Chief Medical Officer in Scotland- . Calderwood appeared in television advert breaks telling people in Scotland to stay at home and to avoid all unnecessary trips. These have been pulled now.

She has been publicly at Sturgeon's side throughout this.

She was economical with the actuality about these trips leading Sturgeon to make an embarrassingly inaccurate statement attempting to excuse her. Calderwood then had to own up she'd had 2 weekend stays at her holiday home.

Yeah, no big deal.

NonnyMouse1337 · 06/04/2020 07:45

While I do think there are times where male and female politicians are treated differently, this is not it. For a start, as others have said she is not a politician.

I'm really angry and disappointed in Calderwood. Most people know politicians can't really be trusted etc, but we still hold doctors and scientists in high regard. In recent years, as a society we've had issues around not wanting to listen to experts, and although Covid-19 is unfortunate, it seems like for the first time in a while people were starting to respect scientific authority as exemplified by daily briefings by CMOs around the world.
I was also really happy to see three women leading Scotland in this crisis as it's so rare in any country.

And she's made a complete fuck up of herself as a scientific authority as well as a woman in one of the highest positions of civil service. It is right that she has resigned, but she has completely undermined herself and the public service messages that have been telling people to stay indoors, not make unnecessary trips and so on.

Her actions were absolutely disgraceful and inexcusable. And she should rightly take all the blame for it. I really dislike the idea that no woman can do wrong - EVERYTHING is always the fault of the 'patriarchy'. Women should be held accountable for their actions too. And in this case she absolutely understood what she was doing, but did it anyway.

HorseRadishFemish · 06/04/2020 07:54

I really dislike the idea that no woman can do wrong...

Who says that?

Everyone loved Mrs Thatcher, agreed, but apart from that....?

NonnyMouse1337 · 06/04/2020 08:33

It's never explicitly said, but implied a lot by some people in certain contexts (not FWR necessarily, but general feminist chat in all sorts of areas) - maybe they subscribe to the notion of the oppression matrix or whatever it's called. That when women or minorities make really big mistakes, any harsh criticism or opposition is viewed as an automatic prejudice, sexism, racism, any ism. A (straight, white) man wouldn't get the same treatment. Yes it does happen, but looking at everything as a 'but when men....' ultimately undermines women because we aren't seemingly allowed to face the consequences of our actions as individuals. It's the same with minorities. When problematic issues are pointed out, it's turned into 'but when white people...'.

There's already talk by some about how it's awful that Labour didn't elect a female leader. Yes it's an issue that needs to be addressed, but there are those who genuinely think a woman should be elected or put into a position of authority simply because she is a woman, nevermind that she might come across as unsuited for leadership - and believing things like biological sex is irrelevant or isn't something to be considered is a pretty worrying sign.

There's many other types of examples and I find it frustrating at times, as I think it doesn't help women in general.

HorseRadishFemish · 06/04/2020 08:36

I wonder if any straight, white men have ever been treated the same way as Diane Abbott?

HorseRadishFemish · 06/04/2020 08:39

.. but there are those who genuinely think a woman should be elected or put into a position of authority simply because she is a woman..

Again, who says this? I don't remember anyone on these boards expressing such a bonkers view.

I've only been here about a year tho...

aliasundercover · 06/04/2020 10:13

I wonder if any straight, white men have ever been treated the same way as Diane Abbott?
That's a really interesting question.
Maybe John Prescott got a similar amount of criticism for the way he looked? Like Abbott he sometimes didn't help himself with the things he said, but minor mistakes he made were blown out of all proportion. A lot of that came because he was chubby and working class.

Dances · 06/04/2020 10:22

I thought the same OP. While she was most certainly in the wrong, and needed to resign, the public self flagellation is not something you see men doing.

Hearhoovesthinkzebras · 06/04/2020 10:33

While she was most certainly in the wrong, and needed to resign, the public self flagellation is not something you see men doing.

But that's about her isn't it? Maybe some male politicians would have brazened it out, no doubt Boris would have tried to - whether they would be successful in that approach who knows? She could have done the same but she didn't. She chose to make the tone of statement that she made. Really not sure how that proves that the public have treated her differently because she's a woman. She chose to answer the accusations in the way that she did. Ultimately she messed up big time and has now faced the consequences.

SerendipityJane · 06/04/2020 10:37

I wonder if any straight, white men have ever been treated the same way as Diane Abbott?

Jeremy Corbyn hardly got an easy ride ....

HorseRadishFemish · 06/04/2020 10:40

Maybe John Prescott got a similar amount of criticism for the way he looked?

I remember how when he announced in the house that he had suffered with bulimia he was laughed at by some of the MPs.

Fucking disgusting behaviour.

DidoLamenting · 06/04/2020 11:04

While she was most certainly in the wrong, and needed to resign, the public self flagellation is not something you see men doing

What is the point of this thread?

She held a major position in the fight against CV. In her personal capacity the only thing expected of her in relation to social distancing was to do what was expected of everyone else- i.e to follow her own advice.

The behaviour by her and her husband was stupidly arrogant. She chose to decide the rules don't apply to important people like her-despite constant appearances on television telling the public about the rules.

She then chose "self flagellation" - presumably in a misguided attempt to show she was really sorry (she had been found out breaking the rules)

Dances · 06/04/2020 11:04

Ok, what I'm saying is that you wouldn't get a man answering like that. She did 'choose' to obviously, but men don't choose to gave this level of mea culpa.

I'm not saying she was right, I think I was clear in that

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