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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What constitutes modern day feminism

635 replies

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 10:45

What does it mean to be a feminist in the 21st century? When I and indeed the members of my family who I would consider to be feminist were growing up it was about fighting for equal rights for women such as equal pay and better representation of women in high powered jobs and given that the Labour Party has yet again elected a male leader says to me that there is still along way to go. However I and my family members find ourselves becoming more and more uncomfortable with what some might call the more extreme side of feminism.

I fear that certain views of feminism are allowing a rather unhealthy and quite hateful form especially in relation to trans rights. As a member of the lgbt community and although I’m not trans myself I do have friends who are and I also volunteer for a local charity who support and offer counselling to trans teenagers. I see first hand the damage done by the attitudes promoted and supported by some sections of the feminist community dressed up under the guise of ‘free speech’. The trans right issue is a complex one. I don’t think children should be allowed to transition or be given hormone blockers to prevent puberty because I’m not convinced a child has the maturity to make those kind of life changing decisions although that doesn’t mean I don’t believe that children can’t be trans because I see it everyday through my work with the charity and it’s a fact of great shame that at least 70% of young trans have self harmed or tried to commit suicide because of the prejudice they face.

The biggest contentious issue appears to be that of self indentification. I fail to see how it erodes my rights as a women if a trans person chooses to self identify and personally I find the notion that people chose to self identify because they want to harm others somewhat far fetched. Yes I accept that there are some sick indivuals that do this but the fact is the majority of sex offenders offend as men not men who are self identifying as female or the other wan around. I remember mixed sex changing rooms when I was growing up and I don’t remember a vast increase in sexual assay because of it.

Now despite being accused of it on here several times by people who hide behind the guise of feminism to attack anyone who dares to defend trans rights as someone who condones sexual assault I do not in fact as a surviour of sexual assault I find that extremely offensive. Anyone trans or otherwise who commits any kind of sexual assault deserves to be castrated and strung up. Maybe one way around the shared changing room or toilet issue would be to have single cubicles or toilets as we do at our charity so it doesn’t matter who uses them because there’s only u on there. As a parent and someone who works with children who have been absued I can totally understand the argument for parents wanting to know who the child is sharing a changing room with. Personally I wouldn’t allow my son or my nieces who I regularly look after our without a grown up until they were of teenager age and then allow in groups of friends.

I’ve no doubt that this post will either be ignored or removed as mums net seems to remove anything that resembles some who supports the rights of trans people but just as the people who use feminism to try and erode or stand Agasint trans rights I to have the right to express my opinion.

The debate of feminism and trans issues needs to be less toxic and more about open discussion and tolerance of others opinions will allowing healthy debate because trans people are people and have the same right to be heard and to be given the same freedoms as any other member of society. Do I think that all feminists are transphobic absolutely not and neither do I believe that all of the trans community min are good people. There’s good and bad in everyone and every group of society but since when is that a justification for the discrimination of a whole part of society

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scotsheather · 05/04/2020 14:42

The people I work with are some of the most rationale people I have ever met and they believe that sex can change

My friend knows someone who has several friends who thinks people can't change sex and the people she knows think she is irrational but they all know rational people with friends who know biological reality.

DixieFlatline · 05/04/2020 14:43

I’m not sure starting a thread and then putting your 13-year-old in charge of the replies counts as useful homeschooling.

MrsSnippyPants · 05/04/2020 14:44

In my opinion you are neither a woman or a teacher. So there you go 'pet'.

Justhadathought · 05/04/2020 14:44

I believe that trans women are women and should be treated as such equally the same with trans men

Obviously in a plural individualistic society you are entitled to your beliefs, but for most people, and for science, the sexed body is what makes a man or a woman. Nothing else.

Personal expression of individuality is quite a different thing altogether...and that is the precise goal of most liberation movements. Being free to be and express your self, regardless of your sex. Only in more primitive/repressive cultures are people now restricted to only certain rigid roles on account of their sex.

You cannot change sex though. Sex is real and has real implications on many levels.

1Micem0use · 05/04/2020 14:44

I'm a labour party member. I voted for Keir Starmer based on merit, not gender. I believe in gender equality, I'm a feminist. I felt he was the best candidate. A male being elected is not in and of itself sexism.

BovaryX · 05/04/2020 14:45

I believe that trans people are murdered abused attack and discriminated agasint because who they are you

You think trans people are the most persecuted group, yet you fail to provide any statistical support for this. You stated a 12 year old child was 'trans' and when challenged to explain what precisely that means you are silent. Your contribution here has been a litany of unsubstantiated claims and baseless allegations of 'bigotry.' Sorry. No sale.

Helmetbymidnight · 05/04/2020 14:45

these type of posters all start off so self-righteous and self-regarding then it descends into dim and dimmer.

ByGrabtharsHammerWhatASavings · 05/04/2020 14:45

Glad I'm not the only one getting strong Bespin vibes from this!

OP, have you considered spending your time as a fictional teacher/nursery nurse/charity worker at this fictional charity/school/nursery to better learn about the basics of safeguarding so you can help the fictional teenagers/preschoolers in your care; instead of discussing in apparently minute detail the nature of you fictional trans colleagues genitals? Might be a more appropriate use of your time, don't you think? In fact, probably best not to ask any of your colleagues about their genitals at all really.

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:45

I think attitudes like this will die out there have been huge changes in the history of the lgbt plus community gay people can now get married and have kids something unheard of 10-20 years ago and in another 20 years this won’t be an issue especially now schools are introducing lgbt plus awareness in schools the next generation will be far more accepting and tolerant

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FloralBunting · 05/04/2020 14:45

So damn Bespin.

Like, textbook.

RedDogsBeg · 05/04/2020 14:46

I wonder if just for once we'll get an intelligent answer to this question:

What human rights do transwomen NOT have?

Would also be great if we could also get an equally intelligent thought out response to the how are transwomen women? question.

Judging on the OP's responses so far I won't hold my breath.

scotsheather · 05/04/2020 14:46

I think OP self identifies as a TRA but I hope material fact gets the better of him.

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:47

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

I0NA · 05/04/2020 14:47

Here’s some useful tips on writing a persuasive essay for your GCSE ( sorry too difficult to bold it all, but it’s all a quote )

www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/guides/zx7cmnb/revision/2

Persuasive techniques and examples of how they can be used:

Techniques and Examples

Flattery - complimenting your audience. A person of your intelligence deserves much better than this.

Opinion - a personal viewpoint often presented as if fact. In my view, this is the best thing to have ever happened.

Hyperbole - exaggerated language used for effect. It is simply out of this world – stunning!

Personal pronouns - ‘I’, ‘you’ and ‘we’. You are the key to this entire idea succeeding - we will be with you all the way. I can’t thank you enough!

Imperative command - instructional language. Get on board and join us!

Triples - three points to support an argument. Safer streets means comfort, reassurance and peace of mind for you, your family and your friends.

Emotive language - vocabulary to make the audience/reader feel a particular emotion. There are thousands of animals at the mercy of our selfishness and disregard for kindness.

Statistics and figures - factual data used in a persuasive way. 80% of people agreed that this would change their community for the better.

Rhetorical question - a question which implies its own answer. Who doesn’t want success?

1Micem0use · 05/04/2020 14:47

Otherwise a fantastic post though OP

FloralBunting · 05/04/2020 14:48

No one should be holding their breath. Even though AliasBespin is clearly not taking a breath given the lack of punctuation.

Everyone, I recommend breathing. It's highly beneficial.

koshkatt · 05/04/2020 14:48

You the twisted fuck obsessed with what is between peoples legs

And voila! The mask is off.

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:48

Sadly your wrong pet I’m a gay women and I don’t feel I was born into the wrong body and as such don’t identify as transgendered

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scotsheather · 05/04/2020 14:49

You the twisted fuck obsessed with what is between peoples legs

whoa thats the quickest escalation from your carefully couched, look like middle of the road, listen up ladies and do it my post I've seen. Have you other lockdown pastimes to do?

FloralBunting · 05/04/2020 14:49

Although, it does read as though AliasBespin has been on the gin. I won't judge, these are strange times for us all.

koshkatt · 05/04/2020 14:49

Another angry chap having a pop at disobedient women. Hmm

katienlisa552 · 05/04/2020 14:50

I can an a star in my English gcse mind u that was years ago not sure I would now

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BovaryX · 05/04/2020 14:50

And voila! The mask is off

Wink. Another dramatic unveiling which exposes the rage beneath....

R0wantrees · 05/04/2020 14:50

You the twisted fuck obsessed with what is between peoples legs

Hmm

False allegations can often be best understood as admissions/ projections within certain specific dynamics.

Helmetbymidnight · 05/04/2020 14:50

in what way are you a woman op?