Drag Queen fuming after being told to leave the ladies loo.

[McPeaked]

Drag Queen (Flowjob again!) is fuming on twitter after being removed from the ladies toilets at Glasgow’s Grovenor Casino.

I’m so sick of this.

If the male bouncer could easily peer over the top of the stall, that highlights perfectly why men shouldn't be in women's loos.

I'm a male bouncer and have dealt with this exact issue at work.

Female comes to us to say that there is a man in the female toilets. No legal issue with us entering and dealing with it, although ideally I would want to be accompanied by a female member of staff to provide reassurance to any other females present.

If the person is obviously male and just avoiding the Male toilets, then they would be ejected from any venue I worked at.

If the person "presents" as female (we do have a couple of trans MTF customers at a regular venue of mine) then it is down to the management of the venue to make the decision if they can use the female toilets.

We also often get females using the male toilets (including squatting over the urinals) when the female toilets are busy, and they would also be ejected (by male and female security staff).

How the heck do you squat over a urinal without frankly making a mess of yourself.

I never liked the panto.

The Dames were always horrible and took the mickey out of women, and the principle girl thing really bothered me - they always 'got the girl' - but wasn't the girl in for an awful shock when they walked off into the sunset? I was confused...

I am not making any judgement over the rights and wrongs, simply stating the facts where I work.

@justasking111 they do usually make a mess over themselves, but not always!

Squatting over the urinal? That makes me feel even more inadequate than the advanced Pilates class I once attended by accident

This should all happen automatically, but nowadays there has been so much intimidation by TRAs, I think a lot of women have been scared into silence

I think that is a really interesting point. Things which people considered uncontroversial five years ago have become impossible to say. Like the dictionary definition of women. Like the fact most women do not want to share a public toilet with random anatomical males. Irrespective of how they identify. Like the fact drag queens might find their day gig as primary school story time raconteur at odds with their night time gig .....

We also often get females using the male toilets (including squatting over the urinals)

I've often wondered how men would take to women routinely squatting over urinals (leaving aside the obvious mess).

It's not something that many women will do, I don't think.

But as a protest? I wonder how it would go down. Pretty poorly, I should imagine.

I expect the bouncer had thought that a bloke only goes in the ladies to take coke (much cleaner in there) and that's why he peeked over. Seeing the penis peeing meant that the bouncer could be pretty certain that the person having a pee was a bloke and told him to get out, quite rightly.

Thanks for the bouncer’s perspective.

@Datun most of the blokes usually find it amusing, but if its not acceptable behaviour from men, why would we accept it from women?

Off on a slight tangent, a male colleague of mine ejected a female who deliberately stroked his genitals over his clothes. She seriously could not understand the issue, until he asked her what she would want us to do, if a random male had done the same to her.

No problem @Winesalot.

Its a subject I am interested in, as we are increasingly dealing with these kind of issues at work. Personally I do not buy into much, if any of the whole trans issue. I dont believe that anyone can change sex, and that biology/science cannot simply be overwritten by a change of clothing/hairstyle etc or a piece of paper. However, at work we have to deal with people in the fairest way we can, and its something we will come across more and more.

So Willoughby is now a ciswoman ffs. First we are told we have to make the trans women feel included and validated by accepting that we are just a subset of woman, called ciswoman. But they are not satisfied with that - now they want to appropriate cis too.

Given the amount of fuss that trans activists made about cis being not an insult because it just means your gender identity matches your biological sex - but now you can be cis when your gender identity is opposite to your biological sex.

They truly don’t want women to have any identity at all, do they?

Maybe we should just start calling ourselves men. sigh.

Every possible word, real or invented, that distinguishes female people from male people is fair game.
The game is - actual female people must not be recognised as different from male people.

Don't get me started on 'transwomen periods' and 'ovary-sacks'

I would like to pee in a bathroom I feel safe in

I’m a woman and I would too!

I've worked in bars, including some pretty grotty ones, and sometimes you do need bouncers to go into women's toilets. Normally because people are taking drugs in the cubicle. If it was a male bouncer they would always go with a female staff member who would knock on the door. I can't ever imagine a situation where a male bouncer would peer over a toilet cubicle in the women's toilets. If that happened then that's really not on but it seems highly unlikely to me.

If the bouncer really was able to just "peer" over the cubicle, there's no way those toilets are suitable for mixed sex use.

@definitelygc sorry should have clarified, it would be a very rare situation that we would peer over a cubicle without knocking or calling out first. We would only look over if there was no reply, or noise from inside.

Don't get me started on 'transwomen periods' and 'ovary-sacks'

I thought I'd heard it all but ovary sacks is a new one for me. Christ.

And in an ideal world, a female staff member would enter the toilets first, with us following, but it does depend what we are going to deal with. I can only speak for myself, but I would feel uncomfortable with just going into a female toilet without at least giving some prior warning.

Why should a female member of staff have to deal with a gobby and potentially violent man? They don't get paid enough for that nonsense.

DeltaAlphaDelta

@Datun most of the blokes usually find it amusing, but if its not acceptable behaviour from men, why would we accept it from women?

I don't think you should accept it from women. At all. I'm seeing it as a means to make men understand that, if they feel uncomfortable because a woman is in their bathroom, imagine how much greater discomfort a woman will feel when it's the other way round.

A lot of men don't seem bothered by this at all, because they're not in the slightest inconvenienced themselves.

I’m going to look for a thread about the Equality Act, because I know they’re wrong, but I don’t know enough about the law to say where it says it.

I'm not sure that toilets are actually covered by the equality act. I think it's more of a cultural convention thing. I'm pretty certain though that the owner of an establishment such as a casino can ask anyone to leave their premises or any part of their premises for pretty much any reason at any time. So my understanding is that someone refusing to leave the ladies toilets when asked would be the one breaking the law.

So while transactivists incorrectly throw around lots of distracting claims about what is and isn't legal, the real war, the culture war, over what is culturally acceptable is being obscured. My point being, as long as women don't want people who are obviously men in their toilets, cultural conventions (and bouncers keen to keep patrons happy) will keep them out, but the minute people start (erroneously) believing they have some sort of "right" to be there the culture war will be lost.