Reddit: Very Helpful individual wants women punished at work for avoiding ladies' room now used by trans woman

[Durgasarrow]

www.reddit.com/r/asktransgender/comments/eq1iia/at_work_someone_has_came_out_a
On the "AskTransgender" subreddit.
"At work someone has came out as a female (formerly male). All the female employees are now using the unisex disabled toilet (which up until now, was only used by me), or toilets on other floors. What can I do to make her feel better?"

From the "Ask Transgender" subreddit. Discuss.

www.reddit.com/r/asktransgender/comments/eq1iia/at_work_someone_has_came_out_as_a_female_formerly/

Oops, sorry, looks a bit messy there.

I saw this thread. Clearly the women at this workplace aren't happy sharing a bathroom with this individual. It makes you wonder if there's more to it.

Erm not use the female loos?!

Considering it’s Reddit the responses are more measured and less “what horrible t**fs, get them all sacked” than I would have thought (only scrolled threw a few responses though).

Through*

Punished how exactly?

If those women are within their rights to use the disabled toilet then what would this "extremely helpful" person wish to happen to them?

Maybe he's pissing on the seat/floor in the ladies toilet.

The story reads to me like the author IS the transwoman and is upset because women aren't buying into the TWAW rhetoric. You can't legislate feelings. If they feel unsafe in the ladies toilet are they meant to be forced to use that space?

So yet again all women in this office have to agree to feel unsafe (because why else would they be trailing off en masse to less easily reached toilets) so as not to hurt the delicate 'lady feelz' of the transwoman. And all because the transwoman says they can't use their former lavatory because it's unsafe due to the presence of men. What precisely is stopping the men welcoming a fellow penis owner into their toilet facilities? Or a neo 'vagina' owner come to that? Has anyone ever explained that satisfactorily? Why aren't men being taught to 'be kind'?!!

How can the so-called rights of one transwoman take precedence over every natal born female in this office? I am so glad to be self-employed ...

However, I dont know if its worthwhile to go and complain to HR about this type of passive resistance.

So even women's passive resistance is not to be tolerated. Just wow.

You can go into female spaces without caring about the impact on the females. You can't force the females to stay in the space and use it with you. Even if you deprive those females of any space where they can get away from you, some will not drink/ go out to another building at break times/ find ways around this because your presence excludes them from that space. Some females need female only spaces.

I understand this is hurtful for the person who wished to be welcomed into female spaces and surrounded by other females, and to have their identity accepted, but this is the reality boundary that has to be faced. Other people have needs and feelings too.

And that poor HR team. imagine that meeting. Ve haf vays of making you pee Mrs Bond...

(was reading articles on culturally appropriation about wigs - thinks... cultural appropriation, hmm, gender presentation is considered social/cultural - so...)

Other people have needs and feelings too.

That's the part quislings like this woman don't care about.

It is a sick microagression that the cis women in your office refuse to use the womens bathroom now.

Well, crikey.

Waa! Waa! Waa! They don't believe what I believe! No fair!

That's right, dear, and we don't believe in Father Christmas or the Tooth Fairy, either. Now go and play nicely with the other boys.

If they've been Stonewalled and offered the koolaid, there's a very good chance these ladies know they can't ask for the TW to not use the ladies loo because they would risk getting reprimanded or fired. What the hell else are they meant to do? Hold it in all day out of fear?

The post didn't seem to mention how many women work at this place, but it's interesting that ALL of the women have apparently decided not to use that restroom. (Although I'm unclear how the OP of the thread knows this, given the she apparently uses only the unisex disabled toilet. )

Another thread today about trans women in the women's toilets kind of demonstrated that some women will speak up in favour of the trans women, and seem to have no concerns about sharing.

So it seems curious to me that suddenly all of the women stopped using that toilet. Unless the trans woman in this case is particularly objectionable or threatening. Or, ya know, it's a big pile of bullshit.

I think the employment site in question is in the US — in which case there are likely large gaps between the door and the cubicle walls, possibly as much as 2 inches on each side of the door, large gaps at the bottom, and the walls and door are likely quite short.

In American loos, it’s very easy to peer right in at the person on the toilet. One doesn’t even have to peer really — it can be hard NOT to see, especially in facilities not remodeled in the past 20 years or so.

My guess is these women would rather not be so easily observed by a male colleague while they’re tending to private bodily needs.

The feelings of one person are more important than the feelings of the many?

Why does that seem wrong? Hmmmm.

I thought the suggestion that each woman be called in separately to have HR demand why she didn't use the bathroom on that floor was particularly repellent and invasive.

@Michelleoftheresistance

It isn't validating if natal women don't use it. Hence the whinging. It isn't enough that they are using a loo with a little silhouette of a woman on the door. Without the presence of natal women it's just a room.

I feel like I predicted this just a day or two ago. I wonder where our very keen to punish women for failing to provide validation friend lives? Depending on how woke the area is HR may well take it seriously.

It's our jobs to be there for men 24/7 in case they need a hankie, some lipgloss, a friendly chat, or a tampon.

Women exist to validate the beliefs and feelings of men.

Of course someone wants consequences for passive resistance.

Terrifyingly not only may they actually succeed in having the women punished in some way for avoiding the toilet, but it's also clear that the person who is causing them to go elsewhere is not able to empathise with the women who have been displaced.

This is the second reason why women's rights are at so much risk; women who throw their own rights away for a chance to turn on other women.

Without the presence of natal women it's just a room.

Precisely. Which when you reach this level, confirms that this is at heart not about a safe space, or a non dysphoric triggering space, this is about a requirement to be with natal women. Whether or not they wish to be consent is irrelevant, and that makes it inevitably a case of wishing to use those women. But not use any part of them such as their minds... feelings... lived experience... thoughts... all of those bits are wholly surplus to requirement. So what bit of natal women is required?

And yes, it's a very ugly thought but when it becomes clear that compulsion to provide physical presence has become a relevant issue, it can't be skated over for the sake of niceness any more. Natal females know about this business of having certain aspects of them seen as property and their consent being irrelevant to the process, it's at the heart of why natal females have sex based rights.