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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

No Female toilets!

60 replies

EmmaGrundyForPM · 25/12/2019 05:12

I was in Kings College in Cambridge earlier and needed the loo. I followed the sign to "toilets" to find two doors, one saying "Males" and the other saying "Cubicles". In the "cubicles" room were 4 cubicles and a sink area. Dh used the Male toilets and said there were 3/4 cubicles and about 6 urinals.

So men can use either set of loos - their own segregated ones or the mixed cubicles. Women have no segregated loos and have to share with men.

I've never come across this IRL. Apart from.the logistical aspect of men having access to 8 cubicles and 6 urinals where women can only access 4 cubicles, there is the marginalisation of women and denying us a space of our own.

I am very taken aback that this has been allowed. I'm alo surprised that students htbe not protested about this as it seems crazy.

OP posts:
YouJustDoYou · 25/12/2019 05:49

It's been allowed because transwomen have demanded access and got it because if people don't give them.the spaces they demand, they get sued for discrimination, transphobia etc. Womenare not permiitted to want their own privacy - thats transphobic. There were probably a few students who demanded this and of course no one is allowed to request for male.bodied people not to be allowed access (because they're labelled transphobic ter fs).

Milanimilani · 25/12/2019 07:01

Ooh. I have a sneaky urge to wander around with “female” door stickers now.

flowery · 25/12/2019 07:39

I would have asked where the female toilets are, and if told there aren’t any I would have said that’s sex discrimination. Clear as a bell- males get dedicated toilets but females don’t?!

Mintjulia · 25/12/2019 07:44

same at Oxford. Male loos and gender neutral loos.
I work there occasionally and have to walk up the road to John Lewis to find a ladies loo.
I’ll not be renewing our contract if I can avoid it. Just gross.

Dolorabelle · 25/12/2019 08:20

yYANBU.

THis is the current woke madness. And academics who question it are in danger of disciplinary action via complaints aimed at getting them sacked (well, that was my experience anyway).

LizzieSiddal · 25/12/2019 08:36

I would have asked where the female toilets are, and if told there aren’t any I would have said that’s sex discrimination. Clear as a bell- males get dedicated toilets but females don’t?!

This- it is discriminatory and should be challenged.

My 26 year old dd and her friend were out last week in a bar in London and they had the same set up. They were too scared to go to the loo on their own so had to go together. They were so angry that they’re put in this position. I’ve told her to send an email to management but they should bloody well have too!

I think we need a legal test case to sort this out once and for all.

Original poster
EmmaGrundyForPM · 25/12/2019 09:47

I was so taken aback that I didn't click straight away and walked along a bit expecting t find the "Females" toilet before it dawned on me.. .

I was at the Carol service and had queued overnight for tickets so was very sleep deprived and didn't feel.like raising it the time. Especially as the only staff near the loos were stewards trying to herd 1200 people into the Chapel.

I will write to the Master of Kings to raise the issue. But I feel like this is some sort of parallel universe and I don't like it.

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MermaidUnicorn · 25/12/2019 09:47

Tbh I'm hoping that this shit has been sorted by the time my kids get to uni. Otherwise it will be grim for my DD.

OhHolyJesus · 25/12/2019 09:56

If this shit hasn't been sorted out by the time my DS gets to Uni I'm not sure I'll want him to go. It's not just the toilets, it's the indoctrination in all higher education, as we saw with Jonathan Best, the toilets are only a symptom of the underlying ideology.

TBF, my DS is young so we have time but if it hasn't been eradicated it will be worse, far worse, even more like 1984, so we have to challenge it at every turn, every time we see it.

Original poster
EmmaGrundyForPM · 25/12/2019 09:57

My ds is at another Uni and in the public areas .the loos are gender neutral. But they arent in rooms, it's more an area off the main rooms. So you go into cubicles (no urinals) but the handwashing is at sinks which can be seen from everywhere. Difficult to explain but it feels ok. Whereas at Kings it was separate rooms, ie like the vast majority of toilets in non-residenti buildings, but with the segregation of men only.

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TheTinselrati · 25/12/2019 10:06

This segregation of men only makes me think they have kept the male only loos as these are traditionally & to this day very important place for gay men to meet & have casual sex.

flowery · 25/12/2019 11:02

”This is the current woke madness.”

Utterly depressing that direct and obvious sex discrimination is seen as the woke, best practice, forward-thinking place to be. It’s like a hundred years of women’s liberation is being undone and this is seen as a good thing. Including by many women!

I was on a thread on social media elsewhere the other day, not on Twitter, in a Facebook group normally full of sensible, intelligent, rational and inclusive people, where Maya Forstater was being described as “deluded”. I queried the description and was told that she was deluded for believing that changing biological sex was not possible. There is not an emoticon available to demonstrate my WTAF face upon reading that.

Dolorabelle · 25/12/2019 11:11

I belong to a feminist academic group on FB where any whisper that you don’t believe TWAW gets you excommunicated. I hang in there as I have lots of experience and I can help with advice. But I just had to scroll on by their discussion of Ms Forstatter’s ruling. I once mildly commented that T*rf was a lazy slur and got several responses along the lines of no it’s an accurate description. And these are academics who preach kindness and sisterhood. Hmm

Original poster
EmmaGrundyForPM · 25/12/2019 11:20

@deplorable and this was in one of the worlds finest academic institutions. Total madness.

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Original poster
EmmaGrundyForPM · 25/12/2019 11:21

That should have said @dolorabelle !

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Thelnebriati · 25/12/2019 12:44

This discriminates against women and is a breach of The Equality Act.

YouJustDoYou · 25/12/2019 12:46

This segregation of men only makes me think they have kept the male only loos as these are traditionally & to this day very important place for gay men to meet & have casual sex

Yup. Also apparently the poor trans get beaten up by all these vile aggressive males, hence needing us to budge up and let them in....because no woman would ever dare stand up to a TW using their toilet so they know they're perfectly "safe" in there.

jay55 · 25/12/2019 13:09

Same at the playhouse theatre, first door had a man and woman on, second door just a man.
So men getting down the stairs faster than women at the interval filled the cubicles in the unisex toilets, until they were queued out the door when they started using the men's. So women had an even longer wait than usual and had to deal with piss everywhere.

There were a lot of annoyed women coming out as I waited for a friend.

flowery · 25/12/2019 16:14

”Same at the playhouse theatre, first door had a man and woman on, second door just a man.”

I would seriously have complained. I can understand the logic of unisex toilets, although I don’t like them. But on what on earth planet does any public building think it’s not unlawful discrimination to give their own toilets to men but not to women.

Used to be women had to put pressure on to get it acknowledged that they need more toilets than men. Now apparently we have to put pressure on to get any toilets at all. Positively Victorian.

MangoesAreMyFavourite · 25/12/2019 17:03

Except they make the women's mixed sex , so any vile aggressive male wanting to beat any TW up would just follow them in. So what problem is being solved exactly?

Original poster
EmmaGrundyForPM · 25/12/2019 17:07

good point @Mangoesaremyfavourite.

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Childrenofthestones · 25/12/2019 17:56

11Dolorabelle said..........

"I belong to a feminist academic group on FB where any whisper that you don’t believe TWAW gets you excommunicated. I hang in there as I have lots of experience and I can help with advice. But I just had to scroll on by their discussion of Ms Forstatter’s ruling. I once mildly commented that T*rf was a lazy slur and got several responses along the lines of no it’s an accurate description. And these are academics who preach kindness and sisterhood. hmm"

Can I ask you, as a feminist academic with experience both sides of the fence, what is your estimation of the percentage of all feminists that have drunk the cool aid on this.
I have yet to see a feminist group on any university that is remotely gender critical. They seem very much he opposite.

PlayerOneReady · 25/12/2019 19:28

I was in NYC earlier this year and saw the exact same thing in the toilets of a large department store. One ‘mens’ and one ‘gender neutral’ toilet. I mean WTAF. We should all be getting very angry about this. It’s outrageous.

flowery · 25/12/2019 19:31

” I was in NYC earlier this year and saw the exact same thing in the toilets of a large department store. One ‘mens’ and one ‘gender neutral’ toilet. I mean WTAF. We should all be getting very angry about this. It’s outrageous.”

I genuinely don’t know how anyone claiming to be woke could justify such unfair and unequal treatment, I really don’t.

TildaKauskumholm · 25/12/2019 19:37

Every one of us who experiences this should complain, there and then if possible. I haven't come across any but live in a small rural town.