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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Scotland's last single sex state school to admit boys

76 replies

scotsheather · 01/12/2019 17:32

Not seen a thread on this. Its been rumbling on for years but personally I think it was inevitable. I don't buy the arguments girls are making to keep it single sex but admire them for standing up for what they believe in against the majority. It is an outstanding school but there many equally good or better mixed schools in Glasgow and beyond. Is single sex schooling really needed? Is it really "unfair" on boys in the catchment area?

www.glasgowlive.co.uk/news/glasgow-news/notre-dame-high-school-boys-17329912

OP posts:
Poissonpoison · 01/12/2019 17:33

It's a shame to see it go, but ultimately it isnt fair, is it.

skql · 01/12/2019 17:41

imo single sex school are good.
boy and girl both need that option.

but ...looks like inevitable.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 01/12/2019 17:47

I remember reading about some research that said that, while boys do better in mixed-sex schools, girls do better in single-sex schools. I think the gist of it was that the girls are more likely to speak up and participate in class if there are no boys there.

So the boys will benefit at the expense of the girls.

jellyfrizz · 01/12/2019 17:51

I remember reading about some research that said that, while boys do better in mixed-sex schools, girls do better in single-sex schools.

<a class="break-all" href="https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/education-35419284#click=t.co/VKJatSFNEs" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.bbc.com/news/amp/education-35419284#click=t.co/VKJatSFNEs

AndNoneForGretchenWieners · 01/12/2019 17:51

Most single sex schools where I live have ceased to exist because pupil uptake decreased, making them financially unviable. The boys and girls schools already shared sixth form provision but were on the verge of closure because of low numbers in the rest of the school. The only exception is the Muslim ethos girls school which is both oversubscribed and outstanding. Most of the girls from Muslim backgrounds who would have gone to the existing girls' school switched to the new free school when it opened 4 years ago.

ChateauMyself · 01/12/2019 17:55

I’ve also seen pieces about subject choice re single sex v co-Ed.

Larger uptake of science and maths for girls, larger uptake of languages for boys.

^^

Isitme13 · 01/12/2019 17:55

what were the arguments for it being unfair? I really don’t see how it could be seen as unfair.

My dd is at a single sex school. She absolutely loves it. She was at a mixed sex primary, and finds it so much better now.

CareOfPunts · 01/12/2019 17:57

I think it’s a shame, I’ve had no dog in the race at all but Notre Dame has always been special, girls from all backgrounds including very poor came from all over the city to go, it was their chance to get a better education than that on offer in their catchment school. It has given opportunities to so many girls that wouldn’t otherwise have had them. It’s now just going to become A N Other leafy suburban high school largely attended by the privileged who are lucky that their parents can afford a house in catchment. Which I know makes it the same as every where else but as I said ND was always special

MakeMineALargeProsecco · 01/12/2019 17:58

To be honest, if you want single-sex education, you should pay for it privately.

I'm from Glasgow & am pretty horrified we still have separate state-funded education - essentially Catholic or non-denomination.

Hopefully in years to come, religion will be taken out of education.

NovemberDays · 01/12/2019 17:58

CareofPunts agree entirely, I think it is a shame

BarbaraStrozzi · 01/12/2019 18:08

I have fond memories of my single sex comprehensive. I think they are bloody brilliant - they give girls the chance to try out a range of subjects without pressure around sex stereotyping (loads of girls did maths, physics, chemistry), and they provide an environment free from the threat, or indeed for all too many, the reality of sexual harassment.

Original poster
scotsheather · 01/12/2019 18:09

I definitely see the benefit of pupils from all over the city who consider it a better school than in their low SMID catchment area. I'm not convinced girls only is the answer. Maybe Glasgow could consider allowing placing requests for excellent schools from boys and girls, reserving some spaces for deprived areas perhaps, or.....improve schools in deprived areas.

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CareOfPunts · 01/12/2019 18:14

Yes @scotsheather maybe the city council will use any money saved in making ND Co Ed towards trying to close the attainment gap between privileged and deprived areas. Maybe in years to come these bloody awful “league tables” won’t be crammed full of schools at the top where only kids of parents who can afford a half a million pound house in catchment can get in. I won’t hold my breath though. Hmm

WeDieAndSeeBeautyReign · 01/12/2019 18:15

To be honest, if you want single-sex education, you should pay for it privately

I'm from Glasgow & am pretty horrified we still have separate state-funded education - essentially Catholic or non-denomination

I'm not from Glasgow but I agree. I don't think any religious school should be state funded.

WeDieAndSeeBeautyReign · 01/12/2019 18:17

Maybe Sturgeon could actually do something about the state of Scottish education so that children are not dependent on private schools or a post code lottery. Education is within her purview- she can't blame Westminster for that.

SeasonalVag · 01/12/2019 18:22

We actually left Glasgow because ND was never going to admit boys and we would have had to ship our boys to the male school which is crap, far away and has a poor reputation or did at the time.

Just want to point out that many spaces are are taken up by girls from the south side, which is a fair distance. Meanwhile after yearsof being educated together the boys are basically removed from their immediate surroundings and classmates and bussed off. It's v unfair.

I don't think single sex education actually helps anybody, you need to learn to live alongside each other. I don't want to raise mysogynistic arseholes and a single sex school would be out of the question for my kids who don't even have female cousins.. They need to see girls and women for what we are and this cannot happen with social segregation like this.

MitziK · 01/12/2019 18:24

Having attended a mixed school, worked in a mixed school and worked in a single sex one, I'd say that single sex provision is still a good idea. I don't think people realise just how relentless the harassment, toxic attitudes and domination of male children's needs to the detriment of girls' is.

A large number of girls from the mixed school I worked at made a point of applying to single sex schools for sixth form - and it wasn't the parents pushing for it, it was them. It wouldn't have suited me, but then again, maybe I would have actually got into higher education if I had?

But hey, how dare those uppity females from poorer families want the opportunity to have a space for education without boys present?

SeasonalVag · 01/12/2019 18:32

But maybe parents teachers educators and policy makers need to actually work with the toxic domineering boys....and address the problem. I know its a problem, boys behaviour and attitudes in school..

Mine are quite timid. They too would suffer from an excess of toxic.domineering males.

Birdsfoottrefoil · 01/12/2019 19:42

use any money saved in making ND Co Ed

I believe it will cost £750,000 to make it co ed.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 01/12/2019 19:52

” But maybe parents teachers educators and policy makers need to actually work with the toxic domineering boys....and address the problem. I know its a problem, boys behaviour and attitudes in school..”

I agree 100%, @SeasonalVag.

Birdsfoottrefoil · 01/12/2019 20:01

lionheart once again distorting the Equality Act according to Stonewall Law. The Equality Act is clear about allowing single sex schools.

CareOfPunts · 01/12/2019 20:03

I believe it will cost £750,000 to make it co ed.

Yeah, to get toilets, changing rooms etc it will but I don’t know after that.

SonEtLumiere · 01/12/2019 20:08

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
scotsheather · 01/12/2019 20:32

There is currently no provision in law for a child to be anything other than their birth sex (biological sex) at least until 18. I'm not sure what argument is making schools cave in to that, its crystal clear. No parliament is proposing to bring such provisions for children, but lowering to 16 was suggested here which would affect upper years.

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