Does MN have a problem with trans people? **MNHQ edited title as OP has apologised for 'accusatory' tone**

[tryandempathise]

Seem to be threads constantly on the issue of trans.

Why?

Is it because it conflicts with the idea of sex as a construct?

Is it an age thing?

There must be mums on here with trans kids - do you just stay out of it?

Why the obsession with the idea of being attacked by trans women? Is it not the modern equivalent of homophobic blokes all thinking gay men want to rape them?

”I'm not sure if it's the Government as such but definitely those in power. That doesn't have to mean the current government. Civil servants generally don't change in this country.”

Yes, could equally be an eminence grise.

”The Beaumont Society certainly seems to have re-invented itself, in recent times,”

This was almost exactly the point I was making on Twitter. I recall trying to search online for history and it was as if the past had been whitewashed.

It's certainly worth noting, there is definitely a subject somewhere that when we get close to it discussion shuts down.

There's also this:

archive.org/details/transgendertapes7419unse

This was almost exactly the point I was making on Twitter. I recall trying to search online for history and it was as if the past had been whitewashed

I get a bit of a 'funny tummy' feeling......I once sat in on a meeting of PIE ( yes, true!)...I was living in a large communal squat in the Elephant and Castle in the early 1980's...... with young very boyish looking gay friend......

I scrolled down for what felt like hours. But it was worth it. LLTP.

Is your husband a member?

I'm divorced. Not sure what you mean?

@Justhadathought
You seem to have some intimate knowledge? Is your husband a member
Trans widows threads ???

Ah LangCleg - I do believe that text is in Americana - a much missed font of the late 20th century.

I just keep hoping that Eyes is fairly junior and is limited to blow drys. Imagine if someone with that level of understanding of risk did a cut and colour?! Baldness can result I believe

Trans widows threads ???

If the question is, was my ex husband a member? I don't know, but he directed me towards the "Women of the Beaumont Society" support group, which was a nightmare.

Are we supposed to love people who behave like this: tinyurl.com/t7el4et, like this: www.peaktrans.org/crime/
and like this: www.peaktrans.org/sports/ and yet who still claim to be women exactly like we are?

I appreciate and admire those trans-identifying males who are brave enough to stand with and support women but there are so few of them compared to those who target us with vile misogynistic abuse, promote and celebrate violence against us.

Well, I guess someone has to (hold dicks)

.
Presumably they have to leave it in some sort of penis beaker

It's certainly worth noting, there is definitely a subject somewhere that when we get close to it discussion shuts down

We have to send either @Michaelmumsnet or @andyoldlabour* in under cover

Plus: discussing prams and baby wipes.

I can't tell you how proud I am that it is MOTHERS and/or unfuckable old hags who are on the front line in this battle and you do it with such humour, eloquence, and insight.
I'm bouncing between tears of laughter and eureka! moments.
I'm so proud it is us and not academics, politicians or students leading this battle. Thank you!

PS I'd never heard of the Beaumont Society before this thread. Off to google.

There is/was a Manchester based version of Beaumont, Northern Concord www.northernconcord.org.uk/index.html

There is still has some old stuff online on the NC site, inc contemporary stuff about the GRA and a dissertation that appears to have been written around the time the language began to change from TV and TS to transgender. www.northernconcord.org.uk/moreinfo.htm

Stephen Whittle was one of the founders of the Manchester club (it started out as an unnamed group, then became official as Northern Concord). At some point there was a split and NC carried on with occasional weekend events and Manchester Concord took over the weekly meetings on Canal St.

Manchester Concord was recently wound up after the death of ‘Mary’ who had kept it running for years and years. I feel quite sad about the death of Mary (despite me being terven) as I realise Mary actually helped quite a lot of men keep a lid on their cross dressing/AGP so as to not completely fuck over their wives and children. I wish Mary was still around as I feel we could’ve had a productive and respectful dialogue. I enjoyed Mary’s company on the few occasions we met.

manchesterconcord.wordpress.com/category/mblog/

I sometimes wonder how the old cross dresser lot feel about ‘transgender’ and the Internet age. I notice lots of the old language has gone. Not woke enough. Too much humour too. I never minded being called ‘Argie’ or ‘GiGi’ (RG= real girl GG= genetic girl) but I bloody hate ‘cis’!

By all means attack the argument, but allowing your members to treat me this way and have over 10 pages dedicated to mocking me is simply cyber bullying.

No. Cyber bullying is when the bullies go after a target on the internet. There is a different name for when one comes to FWR to court mockery for their own nefarious purposes.

I'm wondering if the influence of queer theory somehow hollows out people's ability to actually do empirical reasoning. Like the two modes of thinking trade off against each other.

But maybe it's just a Dunning-Kruger thing about the type of person who shows up here wanting to "educate" Mumsnet.

I had been wondering that too. Yesterday I read that some studies show that porn usage returns the brain to juvenile levels of function.
It will be interesting to see what further research shows.

They might be a subset of men but I think we have agreed that data about men cannot be extrapolated to trans women.

This is an incorrect statement.
Until recently the police recorded the sex of miscreants rather than their self ID.
The data indicates that transwomen offend at the same rate as other males. The only recorded difference was that transwomen were sex offenders at a much higher rate than the general male prison population.

The Beaumont Society is probably worthy of its own thread.

If the question is, was my ex husband a member? I don't know, but he directed me towards the "Women of the Beaumont Society" support group, which was a nightmare

Yes, that is what I meant.....

It does sound like a very orchestrated and tightly regulated 'business'.

It would be interesting, and telling in a way, to see if a thread on the Beaumont Society was allowed to stand. I suspect many older key players have been involved with it for a long time, both those whose names we know and those behind the scenes.

I sometimes wonder how the old cross dresser lot feel about ‘transgender’ and the Internet age. I notice lots of the old language has gone. Not woke enough. Too much humour too. I never minded being called ‘Argie’ or ‘GiGi’ (RG= real girl GG= genetic girl) but I bloody hate ‘cis’

Thanks for the insight, and for the links.

Yes, reading through some of the pages there definitely seemed to be the total recognition that their 'quirk' did not really make them female, just a mere approximation

How times have changed and boundaries have become eroded. In the 'queer world' boundaries are not perceived as the necessary and healthy defences of the organism, or as a way to maintain individual or group integrity - but as being totally fluid. However the fluidity is all one way - their way - they are expanding their boundaries as they see fit - but not recognising the boundaries of others.

Every time I have heard the BS spokesperson talking, it's been that ethereal little girl type voice and a whole bunch of "we're just a harmless little bunch of delicate things. We don't want any fuss and just want to bet left alone" type spiel.

It could be true of course.

The B Soc organise events and socials that allow the members to dress and shop in a safe environment.

I wondered if this is the group that the kind M&S volunteer met with, when they organised a bespoke group bra fitting and M&S lingerie buying day? See M&S thread for link to the volunteer writing about the wonderful session.

It may not be of course. But given that M&S have cemented their changing room policy and encourage self identified males (note, these reviews allow the reviewer to indicate clearly whether they are male or female) to leave multiple lingerie reviews and mutual likes on their website, these men who like to cross dress are clearly a group who know each other and have some influence.

I sometimes wonder how the old cross dresser lot feel about ‘transgender’ and the Internet age.

Some of them have embraced it. Eddie Izzard is one. Not that he's old, but he used to call himself a transvestite. I can't imagine he's the only cross-dresser who now calls himself transgender.
And Stonewall must have consulted groups like BS before including cross-dressers under their trans umbrella.

I liked RG and GG.

But I'm heartily sick of all the BS.

From the sounds of it, most of you can barely get your husbands to put their dick near you. I dont think some rando is going to be much more interested to be honest.

Well I never

Some of them have embraced it. Eddie Izzard is one. Not that he's old, but he used to call himself a transvestite. I can't imagine he's the only cross-dresser who now calls himself transgender.

I don't get it. He always told live audiences and so on that he was definitely a man, had not any tendency ever to be a woman, he considered himself a very masculine man, wanted everyone to see him as a man, but his cross dressing was just that - he enjoyed wearing women's clothing and didn't think they should only be worn by women.

Now he's saying he thinks he's a woman?