We Can't Consent to this - choking research

[WomanDaresTo]

Hello you excellent lot.

Fiona from We Can't Consent To This here.

We're appalled by [[https://www.theguardian.com/society/2019/jul/25/fatal-hateful-rise-of-choking-during-sex
the rise of choking]] and other unbidden violence and abuse of women in sex. We're keen to hear women's stories so we can start to show the scale of the problem - if you'd be prepared to share your story in writing or recording, or know women who would, you can use our contact form at the bottom of wecantconsenttothis.uk/aboutus or on twitter DM twitter.com/Wecantconsentto?s=09

(Or on here)

We think this has become an appallingly common experience, particularly (but not only) for young women.

Thank you in advance

I perhaps have a useful perspective here as I had a group of sexual partners in 1987-1992 aged around 20-25 at the time, and then another group aged 27- 56 in 2019.

In that lot, have had choking suggested as something really enjoyable only by 2 men in their 30s now. I would say all the men I encountered more recently are heavy porn users, but I was meeting them via a hookup site so a self selecting group.

Ugh this is not normal and I’m disgusted that it’s being presented as such.
In my 40s here and never had that sort of thing suggested

I am over 60 and it is only since joining this forum a year ago, that I was made aware of this.
It would seem that you are never too old to be shocked by things

Middle aged and only ever heard of it with the demise of people like Michael Hutchence, David Carradine, Steven Milliagn - all men and all alone when they died.

Yes, I'm in my 20s, I'm in my 30s now. I had a one night stand and he choked me and held me so hard I had red marks all over my neck,it just happened so fast, I was drinking, couldn't react. In work i had to wear my blouse buttoned all the way up and wear a neck tie for 2 weeks, in summer. I hated it, felt ashamed.If it was now I wouldn't stand for it. Maybe it's more prevalent in these kind of one night stand situations?

Early 40s, with two separate younger men I have experienced having my head forced so I was forced to swallow, and have been slapped violently and completely unexpectedly across the face. With the first guy I was covered in bruises for a week after how rough he was. Another guy who was being rough I told him to stop what he was doing but he said 'you want it'. With other younger men I've met who I haven't slept with because of their pornfed attitudes, they seem to equate all sex with S&M. The internet tells them all women are masochists and they believe it. They conclude that 'no' means 'yes', so if you tell them you're not into that they just say 'yes you are' because porn tells them so. With men my own age they've suggested anal but haven't forced it. Casual sex is honestly not worth the gamble for me any more, nor is it satisfying.

Choking isn’t what these men are doing, it’s strangulation. The latter word underlines the murderous intent. It’s a real hate crime.

Sexually active - various partners - from mid-late 1980s nope, nothing like that ever suggested/contemplated. Always fun, respectful, mutual.

Various partners again in mid 2000s - felt there was a change - mostly respectful - ie nothing without prior discussion - but yes, an interest in - hair pulling, anal, hair-free, and one guy did ask if I was up for hands around the throat.

Reader, I did not marry him.

Early 40s, never encountered strangulation during sex.

Only aware of it after Michael Hutchence died and Yates made the suggestion that it was that. But obviously he died so not something anyone in my peer group seemed to think was remotely sexy.

No one ever suggested anal till one brief fling a few months before I met dh in my late 20s (around 2005). He was mid 20s and french and did tend live life dangerously (no idea if relevant!) I've never been keen on it.

I blame porn.

There's nothing playful about strangulation. That term B** play needs calling out wherever we see it.

So sorry for all of you who have suffered horrible experiences. Thank you for contributing. This is going to be very important research I am sure.

Late 40s. Not come across this personally and I think the death of Michael Hutchence was the first I'd heard of it being a thing.

I worry for my teenage DD and whether this kind of thing is the norm with young men.

Watching Euphoria on Sky Atlantic recently, a boy tried choking his girlfriend during sex and she at first told him to stop and was horrified, but then it seemed, not wanting to put him off when he says he thought she might like it, she says something along the lines of, she does like it but only when she asks him to. It bothered me a lot because although this girl takes control of the situation, it's like she still felt pressured not to dismiss choking as part of normal sex. And it shouldn't be normalised because it's so dangerous.

A lot of what is being described is assault, men attacking their partners out of the blue. It’s almost as if the they having sex with a woman awards them rights over her body....

I'm over 60 and have had a few requests for anal, refusals accepted (although one was boringly persistent) and one man wanted to enact rape fantasies (creep).
No strangulation interest at the time when I was putting it about, some years ago.
I think that the normalisation of this, and the way that the killings are being minimalised, is extremely sinister and another manifestation of hatred against women.

I'm 37, and been with DH since I was 18 so have not been dating my entire adult life. But prior to meeting him, I never had a boy try and strangle me (and DH has never even suggested we try it).

...sorry pressed send too soon! Reading about the choking thing is one of the many, many reasons I'd never date if my relationship with DH ends. Just sign me up for a spot on Hag Island instead.

Look at this psycho on twitter and all the likes its getting: 'Women want to be grabbed by the neck'. Absolutely fucking awful.

twitter.com/buck_tulson/status/1191408478440558593

Driechdrizzle for me yes, it was assault. I froze in shock. I only processed what had happened later. That's the problem with casual encounters, men can hide their hatred of women on a date up to the point when you're at your most cognitively and physically vulnerable and can be overpowered. The idea of 'sex positivity' and women owning their own sexuality is all wishful thinking if sexual violence is normalised - choosing casual sex isn't much of a liberating experience if all that's on offer is abuse. It gaslights women into thinking they need to be the 'cool girl' who's OK with being assaulted. I'm signing up for Hag island too.

Early 30s and double digits partners. Never had any of them try to choke me or suggest it.

Early 30s and a lot of sexual partners. Mostly nice men who at least tried to make sure I was having a good time, one or two creeps who didn’t get a second shag date because they set my spidey senses off and then, these fucking horrors below.

First proper boyfriend watched porn a fair bit and wanted anal. I was ambivalent really and had nothing to compare to and drink was taken so we tried it. I couldn’t have been less bothered but it became something he almost expected every once in a while.

I turned up at a friend of a friends party at some godforsaken hour and was liberally plied with drink and drugs, which I thought was a fine state of affairs until it became clear there was a core group who felt they ought to be paid back in kind for all their largesse. I’m ashamed now to say that I was so busy being a cool girl lib fem that I didn’t even consider the fact that I could say no. I want not to be ashamed, because men who are 5 years plus older than a late teenage girl, who ply that girl with all sorts, are not men who should have excuses made for them. I don’t know why I feel so ashamed, but it would have been lovely for teenage me to have a healthy dose of radical feminism and given the language to say no and the tools to get out safely.

Thankfully, thankfully, despite almost a decade of not being overly choosy about sexual partners I have never been strangled. I’ve been hit, once, by an ex and I’ve had my head forced down roughly during oral sex a lot of times. Hair pulled, a lot. Men only wanting to do it in porny positions, a lot. I’ve been filmed without my consent, although I was able to recover the footage. Men who seem to think “the money shot” type ejaculations are also sexy for women. Men who can only ejaculate “doggy style”.

Although that’s a fairly grim litany, I genuinely think I’m probably just a tiny bit older than the cohort who are having to cope with the strangulation shite. My younger sister (late 20s) has been dating for about 3 years off and on, just dating, nobody has ever passed her rigorous standards for sex. The disgusting misogynist bastards she meets, as a successful, attractive woman, make me about 90% sure that if DH and I come to an end I’m done with men.

On the flip side, radical feminism plus past experience is helping me bring my son up beautifully. Over my dead body is he becoming another porn sick beast.

Oh and I asked my sister to put in writing that she doesn’t consent to being killed and she thought it was weird for 30 seconds and then did it