Trans kids

[Macareaux]

This is an interesting article in a US publication about trans kids and rapid onset gender dysphoria.

After considering many aspects of the issue and anecdotal reports and data, the writer comes to the the conclusion that the distilled problem is that there is no way of determining which children are truly trans and which are not.

If we are to progress then sooner or later these mainstream writers are going to have to have the courage to say that there is no such thing as a transgender child.

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/11/andrew-sullivan-hard-questions-gender-transitions-for-young.html

Unhelpful in what way, Frack? Can you be more specific?

Not sure where the Russian trolls are in all this. Do you think that's what we are on here?

Unhelpfully one sided and not drawing on the international consensus on best practice

Russian trolls using this discourse to leverage discord

Don't know why you're on here. Again we are all different but have shared motivations

‘Internationally consensus’ by big specialist interest lobby groups such as WPATH, is not evidenced based research. BMJ publishes evidence based research. The fact that such research contradicts the international consensus shows that that consensus is wrong and what they claim is not best practice. Would you rather the medical community stuck their head in the sand and continue to offer trepanning, radium treatments, and mercury because, until research showed otherwise, these were thought best practice?

Lobotomy was once considered best practice for some mental illnesses.

4thwavenow.com/2017/02/10/lobotomy-the-rise-and-fall-of-a-miracle-cure/

FrackOff

You wrote:

Posting right wing US articles isn't really the feminist way. I'm really suspicious of these sorts of posts.

So I then pointed out how a publication like the BMJ has also raised concerns and asked if you thought it had a right wing agenda. You stated, erroneously, that you thought it had a transphobic editor.

Can you explain how the BMJ, in publishing a report highlighting the significant lack of evidence for the treatment for children with gender identity issues, hasn’t been helpful to trans people? Don’t trans people, and children, deserve the best healthcare?

The current international consensus is that it is ok to give children puberty blockers and cross sex hormones and render them without the ability to orgasm. Do you believe that it is acceptable, as an international consensus, to leave children without the ability to orgasm and that this should go unscrutinised?

2. Russian trolls are using the GC discourse to destablise liberationist movements

This is what's known as a reversal. In fact it's trans theory that's been used to destabilize all kinds of leftist movements. We were talking about this about a year ago, a journalist from America I believe even laid out the proof. And now, as predicted, comes the "no u", in much the same way some TRAs have started using the term DARVO because they noticed us using it.

I know imitation is supposed to be the most sincere form of flattery but honestly it's just tedious at this point.

You know what is transphobic?

Expecting transgender people to accept a lower standard of evidenced medical treatment than other people. Telling them experimental medicine is ok outside of a properly controlled research setting. Subjecting them to surgical mutilation, with up to 80% complication rate, that does nothing to improve their mental health. Sterilising them as a first line treatment. Denying research on ROGD or detransitioning. Using fraudulently presented data as an excuse to do this.

Yes, you wonder why transactivists would think this was reasonable.

Appropriately Inappropriate on Tumblr has a recent post with screenshots from Reddit of someone who had genital surgery talking about how unhappy they were with the results and how utterly both their doctor and trans forums had failed to prepare them for what the likely outcomes would be. I won't detail those outcomes because if I did it would no doubt cause a frenzy of reporting, as TRAs really don't want anyone talking about how poor surgical outcomes are, but if you look on AIAs Tumblr it should be in the most recent few pages. Reading it made me so angry, both how poor the quality of care is and is expected to be and how profoundly unprepared patients are for the likely outcomes. The medical system is basically treating those patients as test dummies and I really hope that some day everyone involved gets sued and has their license to practice medicine revoked.

Lol, @Birdsfoottrefoil WPATH draws on the equivalent of hundreds of BMJs from all over the world.

This podcast explains the right wing link far more effectively than I can on here pca.st/vzbdlq7j

And you're still going to have to provide a transcript if you expect anyone to bother.

I'm not going to listen to 50 minutes of waffle from a gender studies professor. Transcript or tell us which bit is relevant so we can skip to that part.

This thread is about kids, @FrackOff, and their health. Rather than derailing with your conspiracy theories, can you answer this question I’ve asked several times?

The current international consensus is that it is ok to give children puberty blockers and cross sex hormones and render them without the ability to orgasm. Do you believe that it is acceptable, as an international consensus, to leave children without the ability to orgasm and that this should go unscrutinised?

Please don't claim you know what we are unless you are one.

But also 'you must accept people with penises telling you what it means to be a woman'.

Lol, @Birdsfoottrefoil WPATH draws on the equivalent of hundreds of BMJs from all over the world.

Really? Let's see the evidence for that.

Sorry if I @ you again, Birds

I've just had a quick look at the WPATH Standards of Care.

I noticed that in the section about children and adolescents (starts on p10), that all the references were quite out of date (nothing later than 2010). Then I saw that the publication date of the document was 2012.

Just to repeat. WPATH 'best practice' has not been updated since 2012.

WPATH draws on the equivalent of hundreds of BMJs from all over the world.

But only old, out of date research (see my previous post).

WPATH produce quite a few of their own journals but they seem awfully fond of narrative reviews, opinion pieces, and self citations. Just to be clear WPATH is a special interest lobby group not a professional institution, and their publications reflect that.

However, Frackoff if you have an issue with one of BMJs papers then I am sure you will be able to produce high quality primary research to refute it? Or perhaps not...

Yes, it’s quite telling that since Heneghan and Biggs published their analyses of the evidence for puberty blockers, the number of refutations from reputable gender clinics and affirmative trans medical organisations around the world amounts to.......zero. Nada. Tumbleweed.

Not a single clinic like GIDS or similar has come out to say either of them are wrong.

Tumbleweed from FrackOff too.

I like posters like FrackOff. They come here with their intentions, whatever they are - starting controversial threads for example - don’t return and can’t answer questions. These sorts of threads are great for lurkers who see that when the questions are asked, there are never any answers forthcoming.

'WPATH would like to thank our sponsors for their generous support…'

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20170601073636/gendertrender.wordpress.com/2015/05/31/wpath-would-like-to-thank-our-sponsors-for-their-generous-support/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">web.archive.org/web/20170601073636/gendertrender.wordpress.com/2015/05/31/wpath-would-like-to-thank-our-sponsors-for-their-generous-support/

@NotBadConsidering you asked:

'The current international consensus is that it is ok to give children puberty blockers and cross sex hormones and render them without the ability to orgasm. Do you believe that it is acceptable, as an international consensus, to leave children without the ability to orgasm and that this should go unscrutinised?'

a. cross sex hormones are not available to children in the uk
b. cross sex hormones don't render people unable to orgasm
c. it is massively scrutinized

@WhatsInAName19 you said I said
'you must accept people with penises telling you what it means to be a woman'.

but I never said that

the WPATH standards have just been rewritten for implementation by 2023

Ok Frack. Whatevs.