You know what? I hope you're all wrong

[TerfTalk]

Yes, I hope that you and I are all wrong about our concerns.

I hope that the other side are correct. I hope that there is a "lady" brain, and a "blue" brain, and a "non-binary" brain. I hope that sterilizing children is the right thing to do. I hope that telling gay and autistic children that they were born in the wrong body was the right thing to do. I hope that gaslighting women was correct. I hope that telling lesbians they were "bigots" was right.

No really, I mean it.

Because if we aren't wrong, if gender is bullshit, there's been a lot of lives lost.

I want to be wrong, and I say this to TRAs all the time.

We're not wrong tho. You know it, I know it, most of them know it.

I hear you op.

It's bad enough that so many lives are being ruined. There will be major lawsuits in the decades to come. Once the full extent of all of this becomes known to the general public, there will also be a big swing towards far-right political groups in the name of protecting children by rolling back rights for LGBT and women.

@nonny

at least that woman means woman.

Just a thought. Has genderism taken off so quickly and aggressively because at some level people are looking for a new religion? They want something fantastical to believe in, something that gives them meaning and status as 'believers'. Maybe there's even a part of the human mind that's drawn to irrational, mystical beliefs (like the 'gendered soul').

I want it all to be a massive, sick 'joke'. I've only known about this for two April Fool's days now and on both I was really hoping there'd be a 'fooled you all! Ha ha!' But there wasn't. Nor will there be.

This is real.

there will also be a big swing towards far-right political groups in the name of protecting children

That's a really interesting thought. What gender critical feminists are arguing for is that your body doesn't dictate your clothing or your interests or your career.

So the girl who says "I am a boy" gets told, no, you are a girl, but you can be a train driver if you want.

Will we end up with "no, you are a girl, why don't you put a pretty dress on?"

We're not wrong.

Concur that the fall out from this will open space for the actual far right and not the fever dream of leftist-feminists-as-the-far-right of the Woke catechism.

testing987654321 it will be a case of 'we've let the LGBT degenerates and the man-hating feminists get too far. We need to restore our values and protect our families.'

Returning to 'family values' is a big theme even now with the gaining popularity of far-right groups in Europe. They say feminism has destroyed the family.
It's a message that will appeal to many. Who can blame them? Especially when they read the news about their daughters being forced to share private spaces with boys in schools, pride marches full of fetish gear and men dressed as little girls, with (lib)fems cheering them on as 'progress' and saying penises are female organs.

I think Nonny is right.

We always dressed DD1 in fairly gender neutral, practical stuff - lots of navy rompers/ sailor suits.

She started getting bullied at nursery at the age of 3 for 'looking like a boy'

She now exclusively, and I mean exclusively, wears dresses. I make sure they are brightly coloured cotton dresses that are practical for play, and she wears shorts underneath so she can go down the slide, but yeah...... I think these norms are getting deeply ingrained in kids and it's really scary.

It would be great wouldnt it.

But theres no way all you articulate ,intelligent well informed women are wrong. And all those activists with nothing more than stereotypes homophobia and their derogatory names and cries of transphobia are the ones in the right .

No way.

Has genderism taken off so quickly and aggressively because at some level people are looking for a new religion?

It pains me to say this as an atheist, but old school organised religion did serve some useful purpose. I don't think some people are capable of living their lives without a form of superstition and mystical thinking. And these types need an ideology to cling to feel a sense of purpose or to stop them from going off the rails.

Since organised religion has gradually lost its power, people are turning to things like fetishing eastern beliefs - chakras, tantra.... I've seen people around me slide towards homeopathy, healing stones, energy healing and all other kinds of guff. Seems predominantly women getting into these beliefs.

I think the queer theory stuff appeals to some folk. The idea that mere words and performative actions can transform and allow you to change genders. There's no objective truth and fact only how you feel .... They read the word salad that passes for queer theory and think because it seems complicated and incomprehensible therefore it must be profound and true, the way some folk read the Bible or Qur'an and find it difficult to understand that it must be evidence of divine inspiration.

There's also the woke / social justice warrior aspect that appeals to others, again predominantly women. They seem to get very worked up and emotional about the 'oppressive hetero-patriarchy' and how their queer identities are being assaulted and denied (even though they are in a straight relationship for example). Their posts on social media have an element of smug superiority - lecturing folk how if they aren't willing to have sex with a trans person then they are transphobic and clearly unevolved.

Whoever is wrong, some individuals have a tougher row to hoe in the immediate future. But if it’s us that’s wrong, the pace of change is slower, there’s more time to get things right going forward, change will eventually come. Whereas if it’s them that’s wrong, the whole of society takes a grim detour in utterly the wrong direction.

Yes nonny I too think some people seem to need an outlet for their mysticism gene or whatever it is.

But I also think that the concept of trans is a splendid vehicle for certain men to get fetishes normalised and/or erode uppity women's rights with no cost to themselves at this time. It's no coincidence that men are calling themselves women at this point in time when women have, in theory anyway, equal rights. No way would they be bothering if it meant: having no vote, not being allowed to own property, no career opportunities, no representation in the higher echelons of business and politics.

Antibles oh absolutely there have always been men looking for ways to get their paraphilias and sexual appetites catered to. It's no surprise most of those 'holy gurus' in India usually turn out to be rapists and running extensive sex rings .. they manage to convince some of the women that having sex with them is part of the spiritual path or whatever. Or pedophiles worming their way into positions where they can access children.

Trans ideology is another convenient route for these kinds of men to flout norms of safety and decency under the cover of being something progressive.

Has genderism taken off so quickly and aggressively because at some level people are looking for a new religion?

I agree with you Nonny, but I do also think that it is a way for mediocre people to feel special.

Has genderism taken off so quickly and aggressively because at some level people are looking for a new religion?

And the voice said, "Daady, there's a million pigeons
Ready to be hooked on new religions.
Hit the road, Daddy. Leave your ciswoman wife.
Spread the religion of the Rhythm of Life!"

I do also think that it is a way for mediocre people to feel special. Absolutely this. I sometimes think the best way to squash it is for us all to get on board. Once middle aged women start identifying as something special the whole thing will implode.

I know we joke about identifying as a teapot etc but using Stonewall criteria, we pretty much all identify as non binary, and plenty of women have a ‘girl crush’ (hate that phrase!) on some female celebrity or have had a sexual experience in the past with a woman, so we’re pretty much all bisexual too.

Let’s all get the fucking badges and flags and start owning this shit!

It's no coincidence that men are calling themselves women at this point in time when women have, in theory anyway, equal rights. No way would they be bothering if it meant: having no vote, not being allowed to own property, no career opportunities, no representation in the higher echelons of business and politics

This is also spot on.

I do also think that it is a way for mediocre people to feel special.

That too. You're right, FilthyBiscuit. :(

Has genderism taken off so quickly and aggressively because at some level people are looking for a new religion?**

I've read that there is a US billionaire who has a cross dressing fetish who threw a lot of money at major LGBT groups around the world in order to get trans theory on their agenda. Then there's the clinics and companies that benefit from the industry - a lifetime of taking hormones has to be making someone a lot of money, especially if it's paid for by NHS. I generally say "follow the money" but like you say, its so quick and aggressive, I think that goes double.

So the girl who says "I am a boy" gets told, no, you are a girl, but you can be a train driver if you want.

Will we end up with "no, you are a girl, why don't you put a pretty dress on?"

Sadly, I think it will. I think when the left gives the appearance of being more interested in silly gestures than people's lives more people are tempted by the right because 'at least they are competent' or 'at least none of their policies are completely batshit'.

Of course are current PM is working hard to solve that issue- the first vaguely sensible party leader who can drag her party along with her will look like a fucking Messiah by comparison to the current choices.

Once middle aged women start identifying as something special the whole thing will implode.

Yup, I'd say you're right, to judge from the expression on my kids' faces when they earnestly told me there were 72 genders, and I asked for the list so I could work out exactly which I was.

'You don't understand Trans things because you're Cis, Mum.'
'No, I'd say from your list I'm probably either agender, bigender, nonconforming or a panromantic demiboi, don't you think? Only they never told us about all these genders so I didn't know it before.'
'You still don't understaaaand, Mum!'

yes nonny under cover of being progressive

I too think it's also taken off as quickly as it has because males, some exceedingly rich, are pushing this agenda. In the case of the AGPs they are also pursuing their sexual kicks, so that is a highly toxic combination male societal power and male sexual urge.

I am pretty sure some of the most unsavoury characters riding on the trans juggernaut are also sociopaths, who are estimated to be 1/100 of us. Sociopaths 1) lack empathy (in this case for for women's rights and safety), 2) in the absence of the ability to truly love people they live to win, dominate, manipulate and control people instead, and get a kick out of causing hurt, 3) don't experience guilt and shame (explains why the sports cheats have no shame at what they do) 4) are all narcissistic, hence narcissistic rage when we lowly pawns on the chessboard resist them.

DodoPatrol I love that!