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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Johnson to pitch TRA backlash as part of GE campaign?

117 replies

RedToothBrush · 02/09/2019 19:49

Faisal Islam@faisalislam
“Number 10 has been polling “culture war” issues, such as transgender rights, to see whether they can be weaponised against Labour in northern working-class constituencies” says the Times’ ⁦*@RSylvesterTimes*⁩

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/e654014e-cd99-11e9-bfe0-b5ac4ce6ca95
Boris Johnson’s luck might be about to run out

Didn't see that coming a mile off...

OP posts:
RiotAndAlarum · 04/09/2019 11:39

Stop forcing people to pretend that people can actually change sex. Trans people exist but no-one changes sex and anything on the school curriculum should reflect this message.
Unweaponise the police on this issue. You can't arrest or caution someone for saying a man is a man. Harassment is of course a different issue. Trans people should not be harassed and should be allowed to live their lives in peace like everyone else.
Walk back all the erroneous 'guidance' that confuses people and leaves children vulnerable. Create more unisex or gender neutral spaces alongside single sex ones.
Support the enforcement of the EA2010 esp in relation to same sex spaces
Moritarium on puberty blockers and properly funded counselling services for young people with gender identity issues. Watchful waiting encouraged for those with gender dysphoria. Drugs and surgery delayed until adulthood.

I'm with you on all of that, NappyValley.

but also this from SonicVersus : I want this pushed out into the mainstream consciousness, but I don't trust Boris and Cummings to do it effectively in a way that protects women and children.

Until all this recent Brexit brinkmanship from Boris, I would have voted conservative, for them to knock back self-ID and reinforce the Equality Act. However, Boris has got himself into a position - either unwittingly or deliberately - to play the hard man, removing the whip from, and threatening to deselect, MPs (By the way... 21 MPs??! The UK government only expelled 23 Russian diplomats over the near-fatal poisonings in Salisbury - the lady who died came later), and I'm not casting a vote which could be taken as a vote for all of that.

stumbledin · 04/09/2019 14:07

Soory didn't see this thread and started another one on this "story" as reported by Pink News www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3683150-Number-10-accused-of-trying-to-weaponise-transgender-rights-in-an-upcoming-election

RedToothBrush · 05/09/2019 10:01

Well here's a zinging counter argument about Johnson and his inner circles lack of regard and respect for women.

amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/sep/05/does-boris-johnsons-government-have-a-women-problem?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other&__twitter_impression=true
Does Boris Johnson’s government have a women problem?
With a resolutely male inner circle and the sacking of four female aides, it’s no surprise that accusations of misogyny have been levelled by the opposition. The question is whether it makes a difference at the ballot box

OP posts:
Nappyvalley15 · 05/09/2019 10:55

I've no doubt that he doesn't value women. I don't think that would rule right wing Tories out of upholding sex exemptions in the EA 2010 for the privacy and dignity of women. In addition a huge part of the TRA agenda is damaging to children and young people. Especially those on the autistic spectrum and abuse victims. You don't have to care deeply about women's issues to do something about that.
I am not a Tory. I wish the left would see the damage being done by the TRAs but they are wilfully blind.

Nappyvalley15 · 05/09/2019 10:57

I meant to add that I am horrified by what I have seen in parliament in the last few days. The withdrawal of the whip from Tory 'moderates' was very wrong.

nettie434 · 05/09/2019 11:32

Especially those on the autistic spectrum and abuse victims.

I have learned a lot from this board about the over representation of girls on the spectrum and abuse victims in gender identity services. I wonder if there is a type of collusion with other parts of the health service because their services are already stretched and it is easier to channel young people in distress into gender identity services.

I personally do believe that gender dysphoria can exist. I also think there are other people who choose to be transgender or non binary without feeling any sense of being in the ‘wrong body’. I know lots of other contributors to this board don’t but I think we do all agree that the increase in the number of girls referred to GIDS is not explained by better awareness and acceptance of transgender identities.

My big regret about Penny Mordaunt’s sacking is that it is now much harder for us to hold the government to account for the delay in this promised inquiry as they will simply blame Theresa May’s administration.

ChattyLion · 08/09/2019 07:01

Gah I just lost a post about this, but earlier this week, a week of absolute national political turmoil, The Sun had Kellie Maloney on the front page talking about A suicide attempt and great sadness post-transition (to a ‘medically-created woman’ ). We can all feel sorry for a suffering fellow human, but why is this front page news and especially in a week of unprecedented political crisis for the Boris Johnson government? The Sun will happily cover Westminster stories when they want to. Massive distraction exercise.

www.thesun.co.uk/tvandshowbiz/9842464/kellie-maloney-suicide-overdosed-cocktail-pills-doubting-transition-frank/

So I do think there’s something in this theory and while I don’t want to feel so tin foil hatted, we live in very strange times. The collapse of the political ecosystem in the middle and how this is being cheered on by sections of the media is something that should scare us all. Rudd was a pro-choice woman in the cabinet surrounded by rank misogynists. I shudder to think who will replace her. The Good Ruddance-type headlines are really appalling.

ChattyLion · 08/09/2019 07:34

Headline to go with the link below: ‘GOOD RUDDANCE Amber Rudd betrays Boris as she resigns from Cabinet and Tory party in protest at Brexit and rebel ‘purge’’

www.thesun.co.uk/news/9884767/amber-rudd-resigns-brexit-boris-johnson/

quixote9 · 09/09/2019 05:19

We've been through this in the US, where the left has such an open mind on trans topics their brains have fallen out. Here's the bad news.

Making trans people an issue made no dent in left wokeness. Obviously, if the right says something you just reject it wholesale. Nothing to see here.

But it worked very well on conservatives. My dear devout Catholic friend said her whole very right wing parish was very worried about men in women's toilets. They all turned out to vote, but they all do anyway, so I'm not sure how much difference it made that way.

Some of that is completely justified safeguarding concerns. But a lot of it is not remotely Gender Critical. It's Gender Straitjacket.

It's important to remember that BoJo types are not after limits on transpeople because they care about women's autonomy or rights. On the contrary. They're anything but Gender Critical. They believe in gender boxes (gender jails...) just as much as TRAs. The only difference is they want to limit who's in which one by sex. But the gender jails themselves are exactly the same.

So it would make sense never to label them GC, because that just leads to a false sense of being on the same side. They have an understanding of safeguarding, which may sometimes be useful, but what they hope to achieve is the opposite of liberation.

CountFosco · 09/09/2019 06:08

Please list Women's Rights laws that tories have brought in

The vote? There was a coalition after WW1 and it was the Liberals who were opposed to giving more women than men the vote which is why it was only given to women over 30 initially, once there was a majority Conservative party the franchise was extended to all women over 21 in 1928.

TimeLady · 09/09/2019 07:20

The withdrawal of the whip from Tory 'moderates' was very wrong.

I can assure you that many Tory grassroot members think otherwise. It's now becoming clear to see why May got nowhere with Brexit in the last three years; Remainers were in charge.

Endofthedays · 09/09/2019 08:01

Aren’t the main laws that maintain women’s rights the Equality Act, the existence of the NHS and the sex discrimination act?

They’re separate to EU law.

Ereshkigal · 09/09/2019 08:07

The sex discrimination act became the "sex" protected characteristic of the EA. It is no longer in force.

Endofthedays · 09/09/2019 08:12

Thanks Ereshkigal.

Sunkisses · 09/09/2019 10:52

What have the Tories done for women's rights? Theresa May was bringing in the Domestic Violence Bill (although Brexit may mean it won't now be passed sadly). We need to make sure that they also pledge additional resources to women's refuges. The Tories are also bringing in age verification on online porn, which is a feminist and safeguarding issue, as we have a generation of misogynistic porn-addicted boys with smartphones at the moment. The Labour Party don't even know what a woman is, and are willing to sacrifice all women's gains in the pursuit for the 'cause' of allowing males to identify as 'women'. I will never vote Labour again if they persist with their anti-women agenda

Endofthedays · 09/09/2019 12:09

Labour are supposed to be bringing us out of austerity, and that is the biggest problem for women right now.

EmpressLesbianInChair · 09/09/2019 13:33

The Labour Party don't even know what a woman is, and are willing to sacrifice all women's gains in the pursuit for the 'cause' of allowing males to identify as 'women'. I will never vote Labour again if they persist with their anti-women agenda

Exactly. In a way it's not so much what the Tories will do for women as what Labour will do to women. I don't actually want to vote for any of them.

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