I made a gross and vile comment, please can someone explain why I was gross and vile?

[Mammatino]

Hi, am a bit nonplussed. I've commented on a current post about the trend for vcso girls. It's young girls who are very minimal make up, beachy and save the planet types. (ish). My comment was that I thought it was a better trend than the current trend for overblown, over made up, trashy sex dolls that many young girls seem to follow. Was I vile and gross because it sounded like I was attacking a young woman's right to choose? When teens are finding an identity I would be much happier with minimum make up, planet savers, photographing sunsets than girls just highlighting (through make up and surgery) their breasts, bums and big lips. I just want to know what I've done that is gross and vile, incase it is a lack of education on my part. I've posted on feminist chat as I think it's a bit of a female identity thread and that's where I've crossed boundaries? Maybe the posters I offended like this look and I've been personal calling them trash bags (so not well thought out on my part). The thread is still active in current aibu if you want to check my context and I have posted there asking why.

Because calling another woman trashy or a sex doll isn't really on?

Because women can dress however they feel and however they choose to? And judging them for their looks alone, or what clothes they decide to wear IS gross and vile.

I think your right. It was my wording and I think I fucked up with that. I was definately being snarky although really genuinely unintentional. I think the look is trashy and unpleasant but that doesn't mean the person wearing it is. I really feel quite angry at myself for doing this.

Wording could have been better but I totally understand where you're coming from and agree with you.

Because (if you’re quoting yourself accurately) you were describing actual human women as “sex dolls”. If you’d said, eg, “celebrities who are made up to look more like a sex doll than a person” then you’d have been fine.

Of course everyone should be able to dress how they like but sadly society judges people.

And also because if a woman decides to wear a short skirt, heels, injected lips, boob job etc....
She’s still not "asking for it" or trying to look like a sex doll. Style can emerge from all sorts of influences. I’d hate to think if my daughter goes out dressed like a love islander (the influences she’s exposed to whether I like it or not!) then people would assume she would deserve to be assaulted or raped.

I agree with you as well op.

What neighbour said

I do understand where you’re coming from too Op

I'm actually surprised that you aren't already aware of why it was out of order, OP. People explained to you on the thread in question, repeatedly.

Describing someone as an aspiring trash bag is pretty vile in my book....

I think I did know what I had said that was wrong but was abit upset at myself for saying it. I didn't see that it had been explained repeatedly to me on the other thread. I was reading abit blindly tbh. I don't think that dressing in a short skirt asks for a rape, I really really don't. I do really dislike the look but I don't dislike anyone on the basis of them wearing it. I've really learnt something this morning, it was such a lazy comment and has shown me up to be a nasty judgy bitch. Sorry again for any offence.

I think the language used was unfortunate. I also think you were talking about children not adult women and that parents have a responsibility to guide them through their teenage years such that dressing how they like isn’t without limits until they reach the age of majority.

Little girls of thirteen wearing overtly sexualised clothing places them at risk. That’s not their fault. It’s not right but sadly, it’s true. I dislike little girls looking like they are touting for business. I understand they might want to explore their sexuality but time enough for that when they’re older and a bit more able to deal with inappropriate behaviour from others.

Probably the term ‘trash bag’. I mean this is just a stab in the dark here.... So many more tactful ways you could make that point.

At the same time I think there are too many people who think that feminism equals a woman’s right to do what the fuck she likes without criticism, which is why we have prostitution, stripping, plastic surgery etc defended as ‘feminism’. Feminism sooooo isn’t that. Although maybe liberal feminism is.

I saw your comment on the other thread. I was taken aback by it. Because we were talking about children. I was a teenage girl who enjoyed wearing full make up and tight clothes. I enjoyed expressing myself this way. I did not do it to become sexually active or to please men. I actually chose to have sex with my first boyfriend at age 18.

If an individual wants to look a certain way then that's up to them. We should not shame them because we feel that it's wrong by our standards. My asian friend used to change her clothes when she got to town and apply make up before shopping in town. She had to get changed back into her Asian clothing and wipe off her make up before returning home. She said that if anyone from her community saw her bare arms and legs with make up, that they would label her a slut. I felt sorry for her repression and was thankful I wasn't judged in the same way. Which is another reason why your comment didn't lie well with me.

I actually dont think its helpful to label people. Its only acceptable If people label themselves, however people do not ask for judgements. However its a good sign that you have recognised the impact of your poor comments. Life is a journey of learning.

“it was such a lazy comment and has shown me up to be a nasty judgy bitch. Sorry again for any offence.”
No. It’s shown you to be someone who hasn’t in the past thought very much about the language you use. Stop worrying about it- just read over your posts before you press send.

Of course everyone should be able to dress how they like but sadly society judges people.

We all choose what we wear. We have a huge range of choice. So, yes, people will form opinions about you as a result of those choices, because they are aware that this is something you have chosen yourself. And I don’t think that’s unreasonable; you’re not forming an opinion of me based on something over which I have no control (eg my height, or the colour of my skin), but based on the way I have decided to present myself. I can honestly say that I put little thought into today’s ensemble and pulled a dress off the washing line. But - ultimately - I still bought it and decided to wear it. If I stop to think about it, you’d probably think “middle class Mummy” if you saw me, which is pretty accurate....and in turn, probably influenced why I bought it in the first place. You get the drift....

Now - take the short skirt example. In no way is any woman wearing one less deserving of courtesy/legal protections etc etc than anyone else. And she absolutely has the right to go about her business without fear of assault. But, as an adult, if you choose clothing that reveals a larger proportion of your legs than is the norm, presumably you are aware that others will notice this and assume that you are drawing attention to your legs/will notice your legs/may think you shouldn’t be showing so much of your legs. If you’re an adult, that’s your informed choice to make and up to others what they privately think of it.

Where it’s difficult is with children. They see celebrities wearing skimpy clothing and imitate that....but often without fully understanding the implications of it. A grown up woman wants to wear a short skirt and a boob tube? Presumably she’s aware that she will attract male attention and all power to her elbow if that’s her choice. But kids don’t always fully understand and, as a pp says, this can unfortunately put them at risk or lead them to give an impression of themselves that they in no way intended to give.

Good plan to post on Feminist Chat OP!

So far I see, ooh.... two board regulars replying!

As I'm old and had no clue what VSCO meant, kept thinking voluntary service overseas then wondering what the C was, I went a read the AIBU thread.

There was one comment there about teen trends, how they've been around for a long time, how in the past we had mods and rockers, goths and punks, and I just realised what I find troubling about teen trends in the internet age.

It isn't what the look of the moment is, it's that there seems to be only the look. The look doesn't seem to be attached to something. The older trends the poster listed weren't just looks, they were genres of music. Genres that many of us enjoyed without getting into the look particularly.

I'm not sure what point I'm trying to make here, it just feels like the internet and constant photographing of ourselves has shifted something, that image has become not just important, which it always was, but inescapable, all encompassing.

As you've realised by now, Mammatino, there was a better way to express yourself, but you're not a terrible person for not choosing your words more carefully in a throwaway comment on an internet forum.

And I share your preference for a less sexualised look for early and mid teen girls, I'm actually delighted to see that there is still (or once again) such a thing as tribes based on a variety of trends.

For years now, coinciding with the Justin Bieber haircut for boys, the teen girls in my kids' high school have looked like Stepford children. Perfectly groomed, all with long straight hair, sophisticated make-up, often too adult clothing and with little apparent individuality in their appearance.

VSCO girls seem like a nice change from that. Even if it is just another trend.

What's "vile" and "gross" is the sexualization of young girls and women.

You called young girls "sex dolls"
For real?

YANBU for not liking the overmade up look but girls who do like it shouldn't be put off. They aren't thick or trashy or anything like that. Everyone can look how they like without other people making assumptions about them.

The problem is though, that young girls in full makeup and tight clothing gives men a hard on. It doesn't matter if you're going out intending to give men a hard on or not but surely any person with an ounce of common sense would not encourage that sort of attention unless you want it
Fucks sake. It's down to the fucking men to control themselves not women and girls to hide in veils and sack.cloths.

Men cant help it?

Getting a stiffy over children is paedo behaviour regardless of whT they wear.

Did that women in a coma who was raoed by the nurse and made pregnant give a man a hard on by being all still and easy pickings? Perhaps she should have been.less comary?

Fucks sake