"Delay to self-ID puts trans people’s sexual health at risk, charities warn"

[Igneococcus]

Times Scotland today:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/delay-to-self-id-puts-trans-people-s-sexual-health-at-risk-charities-warn-rxw9k7kf0?shareToken=7c1270ec050747101d90804f49f17056

The entire article is one scandalous utterance after another.

“Jazz as a medical case is really a conundrum because her puberty was blocked so well that she didn’t get growth of her genitals in a way that allows us as a surgeon to use a conventional approach,” said Dr. Bowers,

I don't even know where to start. It's the doctors own fucking fault that as the genitalia didn't grow, jazz never had an orgasm and never will. And they are now telling Jazz that intimacy during sex is important. When they have deprived jazz of any fucking chance of having any.

Jazz appears to be pinning all their hopes on having a deep vagina. Presumably thinking that the sex they will have will be meaningful? How will it be? And as for the doctor archly admonishing Jazz with 'we women don't talk about the depth of our vaginas, you know'.

Ugh.

Sorry. Probably a bit of a derail. But jazz is the living proof of the catastrophic effect of everything they are pushing for. It's unconscionable and indefensible.

Turboteddy

Heartbreakingly true, I'm so angry at all the people supporting this.

Datun

It’s not a derail. It’s very relevant to point out the horrendous hypocrisy regarding sexual health. I can’t go on too much about this for Jazz as I find it utterly heartbreaking.

Of course sex workers in South America - female, male, trans whatever - shouldn’t be dying of HIV which is now a liveable almost curable disease. And equally western children shouldn’t be committed to a life of zero sexual dysfunction on the utterly false and evidence-devoid premise that it will be the fix for their mental health.

Jazz appears to be pinning all their hopes on having a deep vagina. Presumably thinking that the sex they will have will be meaningful? How will it be? And as for the doctor archly admonishing Jazz with 'we women don't talk about the depth of our vaginas, you know'.

From what I've read Jazz appears to have no concept of what a vagina actually is.

This is a common theme amongst adult trans ideologists who all too often seem to view a vagina as nothing more than a fuck hole, but it is unconscionable to push children into these procedures without ever explaining to them that they will NEVER have a vagina (or penis) in any meaningful sense.

No surgeon can make a vagina. No surgeon can make a penis. No responsible surgeon would lie about these facts.

"fear of misgendering and a lack of compassionate support prevents them from accessing basic sexual health services, including contraception and STI prevention"

Oh fgs. Try being a middle aged woman (the old fashioned boring cunty kind) wanting to access hrt and then come back to me and talk about lack of compassoinate support.

I can understand (a bit) if someone was so dysphoric about their body that they wanted to remove their penis but I don’t understand the need for a “deep vagina” It can’t provide that person with pleasure. The person could have a vulva of sorts fashioned, but you’re right, a “deep vagina” is actually just a lifetime of dilatation, infection, smell, washing, all so someone can put their cock in it and pleasure themselves somehow. 🤢

Yet I bet when these charities talk about sexual health, they never discuss THAT

Globally trans women are 49 times more likely to have HIV than the general population, the World Health Organisation has said.

lets unpick that sentence, might it be because of underlying undiagnosed mental health problems-unless those are addressed, some transwomen will engage in risky sexual activity, for a multitude of reasons.

Isn't that because globally transwomen are often sex workers in countries not known for their modern approaches to sexual health?

What’s happened to Jazz makes me simultaneously sad and angry. In one episode Jazz asked whether an orgasm was like a sneeze, and yet it’s apparently important for this young adult with such a lack of libido that they have NO tangible understanding of sexual desire to have their penis inverted at great risk and pain. The only reason is to be penetrated to please a possible future partner, one who will apparently have so little concern for Jazz’s well being that it won’t bother them that Jazz is getting nothing out of the experience at all. And this is a future that Jazz’s parents and doctors all think is the best possible outcome. It’s fucked up on every possible level.

Isn't that because globally transwomen are often sex workers in countries not known for their modern approaches to sexual health?

Or equality legislation that might allow transwomen the opportunity to make a living in a less dangerous and exploitative "profession" (inverted commas to avoid ligitamising paid sexual exploitation as work).

And this is a future that Jazz’s parents and doctors all think is the best possible outcome.

I get the impression that jazz thinks the actual sex will be a meaningful experience. Even though they may not have an orgasm. They would've been told that many women enjoy sex without orgasming.

The difference is that jazz doesn't appear to have erotic feelings. Or erotic sensations.

Unsurprisingly.

My fear is that jazz will realise the futility of the entire thing, when they find all this out during 'sex'.

Is anyone actually sitting down with this kid and saying look, sex might just be something that is off the table for you, personally. Giving them the possibility in order for them to process the implications.

What loving partner is going to want to have sex with someone who can't feel anything and never has?

I think that’s what I find heartbreaking. All of us here can see what’s happened to Jazz. But Jazz still needs to get there (publicly at least). Still needs to process it. Needs to understand, if possible, what has been taken, and I don’t mean testes, I mean possibilities. THAT is the sort of sexual health issues I want to see funded. Helping people like Jazz deal with the trauma.

What loving partner is going to want to have sex with someone who can't feel anything and never has?

This is the part that worries me the most tbh. And Jazz has been groomed by parents and doctors into not seeing it for what it is.

And Jazz has been groomed by parents and doctors into not seeing it for what it is.

I'd add TV companies to the list of groomers. That all of this has been broadcast across the world makes me sick.

How can a child ever gain space to question and consider when their every move is subject to the scrutiny of millions?

How can a child ever gain space to question and consider when their every move is subject to the scrutiny of millions?

With the possibility that the drugs have stunted their mental maturation to the point where they are still addressing the issue with the mind of a child.

The only reason is to be penetrated to please a possible future partner, one who will apparently have so little concern for Jazz’s well being that it won’t bother them that Jazz is getting nothing out of the experience at all.

This.

And what kind of male partner is going to be attracted to this kind of relationship, where their partner's pleasure is not relevant and sex is about one body being helped to use another to meet their own needs? And where the body being used holds a number of pre pubescent features and responses?

I know there is the naiive and optimistic hope of the white knight who will be the exceptional partner that this poor person deserves. And even then, it's inevitable that Jazz is going to come to realise and grieve the losses within that relationship. But any basically world-wise adult would see the predators and abusers to whom this kind of relationship would be the stuff of dreams. And you'd think those adults would have thought before they helped a child into this terrible position.

Does anyone know if there’s a reason they haven’t they just started using Transwoman and transman on people’s medical records? That way professionals can address things relating to biological sex without misgendering?

Erm, the only answer I have ever heard to this is 'because its transphobic' or it may be 'outing'..because you know, noone can tell a male is male if he wears a dress, and women of course are misaken for men constantly when they wear trousers Plus, ontop of that, its impossible really to get someone elses medical notes, its not like..birth certificates, which can be accessed by anyone.

Also genuinely no clue how selfID would help any of this. Using the global numbers, I wold suspect their is a very high percentage of transwomen in, say Brazil, with stds and such, given so many work in prostitution. Using worldwide stats ad making out its about Scotland is ridiculous. Like how the murder rates are brought up by TRAs, failing to mention that actually, in USA/UK and such, its actually safer to be a transwoman than a man/woman. Bu the global murder rates trying to be used to make out transwomen are so unsafe in western countries is wrong. Anything to do with stats when TRA types bring them up is likely to be twisted beyond all recognition anyway.

Waverley Care, Scottish Drugs Forum, the Terrence Higgins Trust, HIV Scotland and LGBT Health and Wellbeing

That's a handy list to add to the long list of "captured" organisations.

no concept of what a vagina actually is

Mind, reading the JY thread and having inadvertently learned that some people posit that a tomato puree/juice frozen popsicle can be inserted to melt and simulate a menstrual flow, I'm beginning to suspect that profound ignorance of certain matters is widespread.

My heart goes out to these children. Yet I know that any committee that is asked to consider these issues will be policy/lobby captured and effectively compelled to take evidence only from the 'brave and stunning' such as JB or AC and ultimately consent to some remarkable and unevidenced interventions.

hmmm no comments showing on that article yet.

“It's hard for me to talk about boys with my friends sometimes,” Jazz said. “All they have to do is stuck their butt out and then a boy's like, ‘Text me.’ For me, it's not like that.”

This is from a very disingenuous article about Jazz at the age of 14.

Jazz has been raised to assume the world (including male peers) will accept JJ as a girl. But - surprise surprise - “I’m not sure if people are going to be fully accepting,” she said. “I’ve noticed that boys are less accepting than girls.”.

For doctors and parents to assure a male child undergoing extreme cosmetic surgery that boys will be sexually attracted to them "just like other girls" is grossly negligent imo.