Use of trans identified male as opposed to transwoman No2.

[happydappy2]

MNHQ There has been much written recently about how the controlling of the words we use, is very misleading. Many women reject the word transwoman as it can be misunderstood. In light of this, would you reconsider yr guidelines that Trans Identified Male can not be used? It would seem a more factually accurate description of a human male who presents in a stereotypically female way. Thank you.

That one I find laughable though, as..those who use it seem to think getting a lot of replies to a minority opinion they post is 'being shouted down'.

No, that's not what we mean at all. It's nothing to do with getting a lot of replies to a minority opinion.
There's more usual minority views on this thread, but it still happens - you get insinuated you're an abuser or a man or whatever, it's on the thread if you care to look. That's what we're talking about.
That's not DARVO either, it's literally what happens.
It's played out across the thread for you to see if you want to see it that is.

Nope, I prefer no banned terms, despite hating being called cis, finding terf to be nothing more than a misogynistoc slur, and also using transwoman anyway rather than trans identified male when talking about actual transsexual male people. When discussing the males who for whatever reason claim they are women, I use male.

lime, sorry but for someone who has apparently been shouted down, you have possibly posted in here more than anyone? Yes, again a couple of posters have suggested you might be male, but again, this is a couple of posters v 2000 posts!

Pretty sure most here understand that freedom to define terms would apply to all

Yep, I do too. I was just sayin'
If one comes back I'd want them all to come back

Good morning.
Still of the opinion that "transwoman/transwomen" is a lie, designed to confuse, conceal, obfuscate. These men are not women. They are men.
We should not be forced to use such terminology.

If one comes back I'd want them all to come back - then despite some differences with others as to which words you would personally choose, & which no one has suggested you should be stopped or even discouraged from using - you actually agree with the OP, LimeKiwi?

Good to know. Bit early for the pub, I guess.

If one comes back I'd want them all to come back

No one has suggested otherwise. As far as I can tell everyone in this thread is united in believing that this board should revert to being moderated in the same way as the rest of the site (although many have fairly robust views on what terminology they would use). I don't think I've seen anyone argue for keeping the ban?

LimeKiwi my post from 55 mins ago, copied below. Care to answer?

Point of thread - should all terms be allowed (under MN usual modding rules) yes / no

Not point of thread - what words are we allowed to use? What do these words mean? Why are you all so mean.

So again - should all terms be allowed (under MN usual modding rules) yes / no. It's a yes from me

you actually agree with the OP, LimeKiwi?

I don't agree with saying t*m at all, I personally would still use trans woman.
I'm just saying that if words were to come back so to speak, I'd want them all to as it shouldn't be one rule for set of words and one for another.

one rule for one set of words that should read

I'm just saying that if words were to come back so to speak, I'd want them all to as it shouldn't be one rule for set of words and one for another.

Which is what everyone else is saying.

The question is: do you think words should come back. Yes or no?

I'd want them all to as it shouldn't be one rule for set of words and one for another.

Agree. Luckily I don't think anyone has suggested this anyway? But yes, that would indeed be unfair, if it happened.

The question is: do you think words should come back. Yes or no?

I'll go for no only because I don't think default going to offensive words and it's better without them.
That goes not just for tm, it goes for cs and T**f too, really don't like them either and the board's better off without people being called them too.

We should allow all terms grounded in scientific fact, disallow those based on conjecture.

If one comes back I'd want them all to come back
So people would have the chance to correctly identify males and other people would get the chance to incorrectly CIS women or abuse them by using TERF.

So the price for correctly identifying men is insults and abuse?

Interesting.

should all terms be allowed (under MN usual modding rules) yes / no

It's a yes from me.

I'm saying exactly the same as a few others you agree with, that if one comes back, they all should, so why is that "interesting?"

I'm saying exactly the same as a few others you agree with, that if one comes back, they all should

But should they come back? In your opinion?

Yay or nay?

But should they come back? In your opinion?

I have literally just answered that.

My post at 09.26 in case you missed it

Oops. Apols.

No probs

I've not yet caught up with this whole thread, but wanted to make an observation before the thread fills up.

The titles of health care professionals, and indeed many other professions, are regulated for public protection. People are not allowed to describe themselves as Drs or Physios unless they meet the regulatory standards.

Where there is ambiguity for example "nutritionist" or "therapist" there is less protection. This allows those who have limited (or no) qualifications to confuse the public.

I happen to think the term Transwomen is problematic for similar reasons of ambiguity and it is important to be clear that TW are male.

The term women should only be used by those who are biologically female.

To protect women's spaces we need to use language that identifies males as males.

Hmmm, this thread is specifically about the terminology that we can use to describe men who wish to be perceived as women.

Interesting that some posters think we can ONLY use fact based language for that, if we also accept the slurs cs and terf.

For complete clarity I personally am not suggesting the latter 2 insults are ok to be used on here, a chat forum for friendly, helpful, female chat (though of course friendly men are also welcome to contribute.) those that argue we must accept the latter 2 are going slightly off topic IMHO.

Why interesting? If Tm is an offensive word, but you're (general you're) OK with using that even knowing it's offensive, you'd surely be OK with being called cs too by someone who would be like "no it's not, so I'll keep saying it?"
Shouldn't be keep some offensive words but not the ones I personally find offensive.