Feminism and breastfeeding

[SnuggyBuggy]

Just curious as to people's opinions here as I haven't seen these two things discussed a lot. Is promoting breastfeeding compatible with being a feminist?

I do also think the current situation of preaching how breast is best but not providing real support or looking at the barriers to breastfeeding can do more harm than good, especially for women who don't continue to breastfeed.

How does the “preaching breast is best” manifest itself?

There’s the other side, the pressure to breastfeed and the way women can be made to feel if they can’t/won’t. My eldest and I both had problems that forced me to stop breastfeeding her in the first few weeks and I was

-pulled and prodded around by HVs etc, eager to show me what I was doing wrong, without even asking my permission to grab a boob

-encouraged to push through the legitimate issues and disbelieved until it became clear that trying to breastfeed was causing my child to plummet through the centiles (75th to below 2nd in a few weeks)

-ignored when I complained about excruciating pain ‘it’s going to hurt, just deal with it, you have to do it. There was the sense of ‘good mothers don’t complain’

It was the first time in my life I felt my bodily autonomy being called into question and somehow it felt heartbreaking. I felt gaslighted, disbelieved and objectified- mostly by other women, sadly.

I get that women should be supported and encouraged to keep going- if they wish- through any hurdles. I also feel strongly that our culture does little to normalise breastfeeding. I feel rage when I hear the daily mail type comments about being discreet and not having a poo in public . It’s all very ‘women, know your place’

But on the other hand, I’ve done extended breastfeeding since and felt only supported and encouraged. Never had a negative comment, lots of supportive ones, people falling over themselves to accommodate me. I never felt as alone as I did with my first.

It just felt like being guilt tripped when vulnerable. I don't doubt that as a substance breast milk is superior to any formula or doubt the benefits but when I was struggling to get her to latch properly and struggling with pain the pushing of this just made it all harder.

I'd rather see women better prepared for the reality of breastfeeding. I and none of my peers were really prepared for cluster feeding and I can easily see how an unprepared mother would interpret it as them not having enough milk to satisfy the baby. This even more so for women with family members reinforcing this by advising them to move on to formula as the baby will be so much happier.

I'd rather see a campaign to educate the whole family on the reality of breastfeeding, how a normal BF infant typically behaves and how much time goes into it. I was criticised by my MIL for doing almost no housework, cooking or laundry for months on end because I was BF on demand whereas her FF babies slept most of the time between feeds.

I think BF is good but the way it's regarded in the society that takes its norms from FF is really bad for mothers.

snuggybuggy - the Association of Breastfeeding Mothers has a course called Team Baby that aims to educate the mother and her family on what normal breastfeeding looks like, including many common problems.

“I felt victimised when due to medical reasons I had to stop and the anti-formula rules meant that feeding her was really expensive. Apparently doing anything to reduce the cost was against the law in the first six months.” - look at how much formula companies spend on marketing and ask if it’s really the law that keeps prices high. The WHO code (which is what means no promotions on first formulas) is a global initiative that has been shown to protect babies.

I think the absence of breastfeeding support is a feminist issue - I am a volunteer in this area and the demands (in terms of training and time) on volunteers is completely absurd. If it was an area that had such an impact on men’s health and well-being these would be paid positions.

I do hope this thread can focus on the “political” discussion about breastfeeding and motherhood and feminism. Usually any thread about baby feeding ends up with bfers feeling that they have to say how lucky they are, and to reinforce the narrative that bf is something that most women struggle with and many women can’t do. As I said earlier-score 1 to the marketing guys in the formula industry.

One thing I as a scientist would love to know is "what percentage of the variance does BF explain?"

Yes, breast is best, but how does it rate against other factors?

BF has a small but measurable impact on gastrointestinal diseases. But how does that compare in importance with other known factors like making up formula correctly (something a lot of women report they're not told about by HCPs because HCPs don't want to do anything that could be construed as undermining the breast is best message)?

It has a tiny but measurable impact on IQ. But again, how does this rank in importance against, say, reading to your child every night, or getting down on the floor with them and engaging in imaginative play (NB, not either/or choices obviously)?

It has a small but measurable impact on rates of asthma - but again, is it a major factor, or a second order effect compared to smoking within the home/proximity to a main road?

These are scientific questions, but I think they also have a feminist aspect in that it's easy to latch onto BF because it's a single, identifiable thing women do (or don't), ignoring the fact that there are much more important causal factors in the mix, but ones (air pollution, early years provision) which would require a society wide response. Much easier to focus disproportionately on the very marginal impacts of BF and guilt trip individual women.

However, it does work both ways. Women who simply don’t want to should be able to say “I didn’t want to-thank fuck for a safe alternative” rather than having to say that they tried and couldn’t. That is bad for the individual- and, incidentally, bad for breastfeeding, and good for the industry. Create a narrative where bf is seen as something most women can’t do- and there you are.

I think that it depends how you feel feminism should work. If you think that feminism is about women being treated as equally as possible in the world we have (a patriarchy) then breast-feeding could be viewed as anti-feminist as you're tied to the baby.

If you think that the world needs to change, that the world needs to acknowledge women as equal but not the same (I think a more radical viewpoint) then breastfeeding absolutely is feminist, if you then force the world to accommodate you doing it.

I definitely fall into the second group. I fed both mine (and yes, the manhandling, the disbelieving the pain was parr for the course and made me very angry - pushing me more toward feminism). I think that if I've grown the baby, and I'm feeding the baby that needs to be acknowledged and worked around. I'm no less valuable an employee because I'm responsible for the life of a small human, and rather than me hiding away, I made my work work around me. I was lucky I could do that though. Most people aren't in jobs where they can be so obstinate.

Actually, this is a perfect proxy for liberal/radical feminism.........

**Nonsense. There is nothing "anti-feminist" about being the primary caregiver. Feminism is about valuing women, valuing their experiences and capacities, and giving them equal opportunities and choices. I think that as feminists it's important for us to recognise and value the biological reality of pregnancy, childbirth and breastfeeding.

What this all boils down to is that I think a SAHM is just as "valuable" as a mother who does paid work, feminism and society should value both.** (don't know how to do bold)

Yes, I think that too.

But in the real world breastfeeding made returning to work a wrench, my baby at 8 months still barely ate solids and wouldn't drink water. She would only suck sweetened yoghurt from these ghastly little pouches. Meanwhile at work my breasts hurt and were ready to explode. My partner struggled to soothe a baby who was used to being fed to sleep. I only worked 3 days a week but the other 4 became about getting her used to not being able to rely on breastfeeding the way she was used to. It was shit. So I quit work. But now I am completely dependent on a male provider. It doesn't feel very feminist.

I made my work work around me. I was lucky I could do that though. Most people aren't in jobs where they can be so obstinate.

Yes. It's the work which is or isn't compatible with childbirth, breastfeeding etc which is or isn't 'feminist', not those normal female functions.

"I think the absence of breastfeeding support is a feminist issue - I am a volunteer in this area and the demands (in terms of training and time) on volunteers is completely absurd. If it was an area that had such an impact on men’s health and well-being these would be paid positions."

Exactly! This is the biggest issue IMO. It's a political and economic one.

Duplo
I breastfed and went back to work 3 days/week when my DS was 9 months old. I expressed milk at work so that was fine, a bit uncomfortable as I adjusted but not too bad. My employer was accommodating (although legally they have to be!) We had already been giving DS an occasional bottle of ebm and he adjusted fine to bottles while I was at work. So I continued to work and breastfeed and was happy doing so.
I'm sorry it didn't work out for you and I'm not trying to make you feel worse, just to say that it can and does work for some women.

As far as socialism also wanting to get the mother back to "real" work by having the state provide childcare: yes. There is a reason people say capitalism and socialism are just two sides of the same coin.

Much easier to focus disproportionately on the very marginal impacts of BF and guilt trip individual women

I can't remember exactly how long I put up with bf. It was the closest I've ever been to depression in my whole life. I don't think any "support" would have helped me. I found it revolting and unpleasant and the hormone let down made me feel sick (that was mentioned in passing but no one ever mentioned that it doesn't always stop after the first few days)

Given my and my baby's other socio-economic, cultural and health status and privileges I do wonder about the advantages. The last time my son saw a doctor about anything was his MMR jab. He is 29.

“But now I am completely dependent on a male provider. It doesn't feel very feminist.”

But surely he is equally dependent on you to look after his children so he can go out to work?

It's complicated. I didn't have a great experience with it. I felt quite a lot of pressure from many fronts to breast feed, one of which was my own need to be the 'perfect mother'.

DS1 public hospital. I'd made clear my intention to breast feed. The daytime nurses where great. Incredibly helpful and supportive as I was having difficulty with attachment and DS was raring to go he was making sucking motions in the womb. Night time nurses not so much just came and informed me they'd given him a bottle at two days old. Yeah that worked out well. I struggled for 6 months.

DS2 private hospital was born with a medical condition requiring antibiotics from practically birth and surgery at 8 months. He wouldn't take the breast. I would express and feed him via a syringe. A small baby he began to lose weight as he had difficulty keeping even supplemental formula feeds down. I was given one on one assistance to help encourage him to feed naturally and also have the extra bottle feeds required. I managed for about four months. Formula with thickener worked best for him to keep it down and thrive.

I had undiagnosed PND until one day I just curled up in the corner in the fetal position and balled my eyes out for hours.

It probably does come down to radical vs liberal feminism. I'm finding myself increasingly leading towards radical these days on lots of issues.

I think a feminist position could be demanding more support for postpartum women trying to breastfeed and questioning why knowledge of breastfeeding is so poor in the HCPs responsible for looking after women and babies. I mean we are told that everyone breastfeeding would save the NHS money.

While I think it would be hard to persuade all prospective grandparents to learn about breastfeeding behaviour I guess a feminist position could challenge some attitudes that harm breastfeeding. I'm thinking things like expecting mum to be back at her best too quickly after the birth.

It probably does come down to radical vs liberal feminism. I'm finding myself increasingly leading towards radical these days on lots of issues

Does it ? I would have assumed that liberal feminism is far more likely to support the idea that Women who simply don’t want to should be able to say “I didn’t want to-thank fuck for a safe alternative”

I think so long as all women are able to make an informed decision about how to feed and the means to do so. Given that our statistics seem to show a lot of people falsely believe formula is as good as breast milk and that many women stop breastfeeding before they want to I'm not sure we are doing well on this as a society.

Give women a source of accurate factual information and any and all support they ask for then butt out. Promoting sounds too much like 'pushing' to me.

I found breast feeding easy and enjoyed it.
My friend's baby would have starved if she hadn't switched to formula.
And there are many reasons women can't or don't want to.

Hmm. Depends what you mean by informed decision. I was given no information on anything other than bf because that's what is expected of nice, healthy, middle class mummies like me.

FermatsTheorem has already set out that there are other factors at play, especially where mummy is a nice, healthy, non- smoking, non- drinking middle class mummy like me. I wish I'd had the nerve to say I don't want to do this.

Great topic, OP.

I'm another one who felt breastfeeding to be an actively feminist act, partly because it's anti-capitalist in its own right not to buy formula, but mostly because it was what made me understand most clearly the rad fem position that it's the structure of society that needs to change to accommodate women's physical reality, rather than expecting women's bodies to fit around society.

I ebf and went back to work after 6 months with both DC. I pumped milk at work for the next 6 months or so, which was hassle but ok for the limited period involved, and then continued to breastfeed at home until age 2. I had some real difficulties feeding DS1, and didn't get appropriate help despite asking repeatedly from a range of sources, so it felt like a real achievement when I figured out how to make things work by myself and he fed until he was 2. With DS2, I knew what I was doing and we had few problems by comparison, so I was able to enjoy the experience more. DH took shared parental leave for a few months when I went back to work after DS2, including covering most night wakings (I still fed at night for a while) and that felt like a really good compromise of sharing primary childcare responsibilities.

As a scientist, I ended up reading loads of journal papers about breastfeeding physiology in order to understand my own body better. It was fascinating, and I developed a whole new level of respect for how awesome the female body really is. At the same time, I was taken aback by the patchy coverage and often poor quality of the research - there is still a huge amount we don't understand about how human females make milk because most lactation research is in cows! I wonder why that is