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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

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Original poster

Does anyone worry about being sacked over Trans debate?

94 replies

clairemcnam · 10/05/2019 01:44

Just wondered if any of the feminists here worry they could be sacked for talking on social media about transgender issues? And can women do anything to mitigate against this happening?

OP posts:

ArcheryAnnie · 10/05/2019 08:53

And to add, one of the things that gives me courage is all the other women who have been openly gender-crit way, way before me. There's a certain amount of safety in numbers, so the more of us come out, the safer it is for everyone.

(But I know this isn't possible for a lot of women.)

Joisanofthedales · 10/05/2019 08:59

Archeryannie
I am in awe of your bravery.

AlwaysComingHome · 10/05/2019 09:03

Yep. Public sector.

WeepingWillowWeepingWino · 10/05/2019 09:04

Yes, possibly. Creative industry which has a lot of liberal lefty woke young things. But also old farts like me who understand the meaning of words.

ArcheryAnnie · 10/05/2019 09:05

Thank you, Joisan, but at this point it's more desperation than actual bravery!

I really am at the "fuck it, fuck them all" point over this.

MrsFogi · 10/05/2019 09:06

Yes but if my company started on that road I would put up one hell of a fight (with the threat of the publicity that would bring with it). Also it would be quite an own goal for the trans lobby because at the moment I am limited to assisting #StickerWoman, posting here and on twitter and having conversations in RL. If I got sacked of this I would no longer be constrained and I would dedicate the time and energy that I put into my job into the GC movement.

S1naidSucks · 10/05/2019 09:07

I hope the fact that Maya has 63040 ‘shows of support’ on that thing which can not be mentioned, gives some women on here comfort that the worm (no matter what it identifies as) is turning. Truth will out.

ChattyLion · 10/05/2019 09:10

Yes. I am also wondering that if Maya’s legal case succeeds, whether this will provide us with precedent which can be used to invoke an option of something like legal conscientious objection, to some of the things that woke workplaces may be considering like enforcing pronouns declarations at work and making women share toilets with male-bodied people who self-ID as a woman or have a GRC. (Which is a certificate that you can’t legally ask to see so we might as well have legal sex selfID in the UK..)
Genderism is provably a belief system only. A set of political beliefs not based in material reality. That is all fine of course, people can believe what they like. I don’t share the belief.

Nobody would expect us to go along with religious practices and customs we didn’t share within a secular space like our workplace. I don’t see why this is different.

The law provides that you can opt out of various things on the basis of religious belief. So I think you should be able to opt out of what is essentially workplaces enforcing a religious observance, if you don’t share that belief, with no penalty attached. That would respect the freedom of everyone and it would penalise nobody at all.

ArgyMargy · 10/05/2019 09:14

@isabellerossignol sorry to be ignorant but what do you think would happen in the toilets if you were in there at the same time as your transgender colleague?

AudacityOfHope · 10/05/2019 09:15

Yes. That's all I'm saying.

MenstruatorExtraordinaire · 10/05/2019 09:16

No. I'm a lawyer in a fairly old school firm. All my colleagues are completely on board and in fact encouraging when I do any activism. They all think the situation is bonkers.

ludog · 10/05/2019 09:21

I'm self-employed but my industry is getting woker by the day so my professional membership could be at risk.

Genderfreelass · 10/05/2019 09:23

I agree Maya's case is so important and hopefully will allow us all to express our lack of belief in gender.

weebarra · 10/05/2019 09:25

Yes. I work in a public sector organisation which is well and truly dosed up on kool aid. I was swithering last night about a policy which has conflated sex and gender and I still haven't decided whether to broach the subject or not.

ArcheryAnnie · 10/05/2019 09:25

ArgyMargy what's the point of your question? Do you really think that she should chill out about sharing intimate space with a male-bodied person she experiences as "frankly intimidating"? Why don't her feelings matter?

Alltheprettyseahorses · 10/05/2019 09:26

No, not at all. In fact my current 'employer' (I'm a carer) is herself very vocal on the subject of women's rights.

I was a student until last year and there was obviously a degree (no pun intended ) of wokeness but if the subject came up, I was openly GC because I'm not being told that women's rights, safety, privacy and dignity are transphobic. I was always pretty straightforward in asserting that women must matter equally and I was pleasantly surprised at how many students agreed with me.

Lumene · 10/05/2019 09:32

No, and if anyone tried to fire anyone for their views on reality and women’s rights I would fight it tooth and nail and win.

hipsterfun · 10/05/2019 09:34

Yes. It would bring a storm down on my organisation, too.

I am trying to find an exit strategy because the feeling of being gagged, dishonest and the loss of free speech is disturbing my mental health.

I feel the same. I wonder if we are in the same workplace...

AudacityOfHope · 10/05/2019 09:36

Although I will say that I'm the Social Media Manager so when my company started getting tweets about me I was able to deal with it without anyone seeing them.

isabellerossignol · 10/05/2019 09:38

@isabellerossignol sorry to be ignorant but what do you think would happen in the toilets if you were in there at the same time as your transgender colleague?

He is intimidating. He stands too close. He is also a male with a fetish and a history of domestic violence. He is not the person he pretends to be. He won't touch me, he's not stupid. But he doesn't have to touch me to intimidate me. And he knows that. As do all men.

OldCrone · 10/05/2019 10:15

sorry to be ignorant but what do you think would happen in the toilets if you were in there at the same time as your transgender colleague?

ArgyMargy What do you think would happen in the toilets if you were in there at the same time as a male colleague? How is a man who identifies as a woman different from any other man? Why should a man who identifies as a woman be allowed in the women's toilets if other men are excluded? What do you think would happen if a man who identifies as a woman was told they had to use the male toilets?

Daughterofmabel · 10/05/2019 10:35

mrsfogi
If I got sacked of this I would no longer be constrained and I would dedicate the time and energy that I put into my job into the GC movement
Thats a great point actually. I hadnt looked at it like that! On the one hand I am worried as I work in a very woke college and have said several gc things to my team colleagues although not to managers. Managed to swerve the LGBTS training twice now. On the other hand I intend to retire in a couple of years so may yet go out in a blaze of glory!

Original poster

clairemcnam · 10/05/2019 10:49

I work in an industry that is not at all woke. Although we have some younger employees who are woke. A colleague was advised that - you can't say that to Millenials - about a different issue.

OP posts:

ThePurportedDoctoress · 10/05/2019 10:52

I'm a contractor and not dependent on a single employer or sector so I'm not worried personally, but I am very, very concerned for other women and will give what I can to help anyone who loses their job unfairly.
And even in this thread women are being asked to explain why they don't want males in single-sex spaces in the workplace. Does it really need explaining? Why does single-sex provision exist in the first place?

slug · 10/05/2019 10:55

I also work in Higher Education, but I'm in one of the very WOKE universities. I worry about my job. This does not, however, stop me from putting Women=Adult Human Female stickers in the women's toilets They do tend to get ripped down fairly quickly though.

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