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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Gender Critical to do list

48 replies

RepealTheGRA · 07/04/2019 08:13

I haven’t seen one of these for a while so hope it’s OK to start another one?

What are we all supposed to be doing atm?

Write to MP.

Write to women’s aid and ask them wtf they’re doing not providing single sex spaces to vulnerable women.

Check policies at your employer, local council, local schools and ensure they’re listing the protected characteristic of sex.

Check your GP has your sex on file not your gender.

Please post here any actions/petitions/surveys. There must be new lurkers all the time that could do with a steer?

Lurkers please sign in, we need you! Smile

OP posts:
endofthelinefinally · 07/04/2019 17:14

XXcstatic
Are GPs happy with that, or are they complaining?

I am really concerned about the blood forms because some parameters are different according to sex and I think it is dangerous to pander to a small pressure group when people's health might be compromised.

XXcstatic · 07/04/2019 17:32

endof TBH I doubt many have noticed, because it would usually be admin staff entering patients' registration data.

But GPs definitely are aware that patients are allowed to self-ID, even if they don't have a GRC. There has been a lot of guidance from the GMC and RCGP on this. It is all going to end messily.

I have had trans-identifying patients for 15 years and there were no issues at all until recently. Everyone: patients and GPs, accepted that we would record their actual sex, but respect their chosen gender identity. But being forced to lie now, and being threatened with being criminalised if we inadvertently disclose someone's bio sex, thanks to the GRA, is crazy.

YouveGotAxes · 07/04/2019 18:02

@singinglily Just watched the ad, which is clearly intended to play with preconceptions.

Thing is: I don’t have a problem at all with how this person is presented, the inclusion, the attire, or the assumed use of products traditionally marketed at woman. As long as I don’t have to pretend that this person is actually female, with no biological difference to myself. Hmm

Lettera · 07/04/2019 20:01

Have watched the ad Hmm.

Totally agree with Axes. I don't care if makeup ads are peopled exclusively by men, as long as we're not expected to pretend otherwise.

RepealTheGRA · 07/04/2019 20:14

Is this the black bloke with the blue eyeliner? The boots ad? I saw it on Facebook. I didn’t think they were trying to say he was a woman, but it wasn’t well received. Comments along the lines of ‘sick of this shit being rammed down our throats’

OP posts:
YouveGotAxes · 07/04/2019 20:30

@repealthegra You mean - other people assumed this person was trans and there was hostility to that? I’m not sure if I think that’s good or bad in the current climate: the snowflake liberal in me who doesn’t care what you do as long as you don’t frighten the horses, tends to think it is ultimately going to be a bad thing for LGBT and completely counter-productive.

I was mostly thinking: those are quite nice legs... Grin

RepealTheGRA · 07/04/2019 20:39

@YouveGotAxes

It was just a face shot in the Facebook ad iirc

Yes, although I interpreted it as boots doing gender non conforming ‘man in make up’ other people clearly interpreted it as boots ‘pushing the trans agenda’ and reacted badly to that.

I totally agree that it’s ultimately going to be a bad thing for LGBT and completely counter-productive

Online comments are starting to react to rainbows with ‘sick of this shit’

That’s one of my major concerns that the inevitable public backlash will take out gay rights along with trans. Which is why we have to try and separate them and be incredibly clear with policy makers why we are concerned.

OP posts:
YouveGotAxes · 07/04/2019 21:33

@repealthegra I remember thinking, when LGB evolved to include the T, that it was a bit odd because their agendas were not the same (although with some overlap) - but I kind of thought they knew what they were doing. Now we see people reacting against sex ed in schools (religious groups currently) and gay men (including close friends of mine) are feeling ‘triggered’ because of memories of Section 28. I can’t help feeling this is just the start: at the moment, conservative groups - but if / when wider groups complain about any potential flat earthism schools may choose to include in the new syllabus, the L, the G and the B are going to be standing too close not to get any fall out. You are right that we need to be clear about separating the two in our complaints and actions.

It occurred to me today that the TR lobby has tried to harness some of the fear and mortality of the gay rights movement in the 80s and early 90s, when HIV was a death sentance - and gay men were literally dropping like flies. I don’t doubt that bullying and suicide are issues, but ones with more than one humane response.

theOtherPamAyres · 07/04/2019 21:39

Support

There is a need to demonstrate to politicians, sportspeople and others that they have more to gain than lose by speaking out. I will send cards rather than just 'like' a tweet.

Challenge
There is a terrible, terrible headline in a newspaper about a 'lovesick builder' murdering his ex. (As though his lovesickness was a good reason for the brutal things that he inflicted on someone who had a name and a bereaved family). I won't let it pass without a complaint.

Lobby
Get my MP to ask Penny Mordaunt about what happened to the Enquiry into the spike in numbers of children referred to Gender specialists.

Do a Celebratory Dance
The Green party threw a ton of money and energy into the by-election In Newport to get Amelia Womack, their deputy leader, elected. Womack played a key role in driving the Trans and so-called 'sex worker' agendas. Newport weren't impressed. Lost deposit.

Protest
Can't say too much: it's a project in planning.

applestrudels · 07/04/2019 21:47

I bought some information postcards from the fairplay for women website and I've been leaving them in public toilets wherever I go - I usually stick one on the back of the door of the cubicle I'm using and then leave a few by the sinks. If I was less shy I would go and hand them out in town, but baby steps... The postcards are the ideal size to keep in your handbag.

fairplayforwomen.com/product/think_cards/

fairplayforwomen.com/share-information/

HIVpos · 08/04/2019 10:16

YouveGotAxes “It occurred to me today that the TR lobby has tried to harness some of the fear and mortality of the gay rights movement in the 80s and early 90s, when HIV was a death sentance - and gay men were literally dropping like flies”

Out of interest, why do you think that? Whilst it is true that both trans people and gay men are and have always been disproportionally affected by HIV, it is no longer a death sentence so what fear is there to harness? I don’t really get your point Confused

YouveGotAxes · 08/04/2019 11:37

@hivpos I was just thinking aloud really. Although I’ve been aware of these issues for some time, I’ve really only picked them up seriously very recently (having spent the last few years using available time and effort campaigning for a pro-EU group). Some of the overlaps in language are interesting to me, being a bit of a language and linguistics geek. The common ground between the green froggie men on the far right and some of the language of TRAs, for instance.

It just occurred to me that during the AIDS crisis, there was a sense initially that gay men were dying in silence while everyone turned away. That silence, fear and homophobia were actively contributing to the death toll, as well as being a humanitarian failing in its own right. I just meant that it is this message which resounds with me in some of the trans messaging: that transphobia is literally killing young people. (Not in relation to the actual levels of HIV in the trans community) Any actual statistics, or other contributory factors, seem less important than that message being marketed, intelligently.

That’s not to say that I don’t believe that there aren’t issues of bullying of and suicide by young people questioning their identity (as there are rising levels of self-harm in young women and suicide in young men), but pitching the ‘rights’ issue in this way makes it quite difficult to push back (such as when asserting womens’ rights) because the sympathy is already flowing one way.

I don’t know if I’ve explained that very well. It was more of an academic mulling of language - and may come across as quite cynical.

HIVpos · 08/04/2019 11:57

YouveGotAxes, ah ok, I think I understand - in the sense that some people are being transphobic today in the same way as others were homophobic in the 80s. I’ve now seen films and lots of info from that era which is incredibly sad. Yet I was personally so unaffected by it at the time.

A very interesting point. The thing is, post diagnosis, I’ve known (mostly in a virtual sense) and lot of trans folk who are simply trying to get on with their lives and have been so adversely affected and stigmatised by this. Add in HIV...makes the whole debate so difficult.

YouveGotAxes · 08/04/2019 12:27

@hivpos I wasn’t really adding in actual HIV, if you see what I mean. It’s more that it feels like what’s called transphobia now, is being linked to 80s homophobia - when there are different issues at play.

I’m sorry for your diagnosis. I do remember coming of age under the shadow of the iceberg and being intensely worried that sex meant death, before I’d actually had any. My long-standing gay friends are all fine - but I remember a lot of funerals in the early 90s. Sad

YouveGotAxes · 08/04/2019 12:57

Sorry for the derailment. Blush

R0wantrees · 08/04/2019 15:26

The four articles in today's Times which raise serious Safeguarding & Duty of Care concerns of medical professionals about the treatment of children at Tavistock GIDS & the role played by trans lobby organisations including Mermaids, Gendered Intelligence & GIRES need to be shared.

MPs & professionals involved in supporting young people (health, education, social care etc) should be aware of the issues being raised.

This will potentially impact all children & young people, especially those especially vulnerable & questioning of their 'gender identity'

Dismissing out of hand whistle-blowers' Safeguarding & Child Protection concerns should be regarded as a red flag.

I wonder if paper copies might be less easily ignored?

thread (with sharetokens to articles)
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3553935-Times-article-calls-to-end-transgender-experiment-on-children

flintyminty · 08/04/2019 21:44

This is very clever. Would make an awesome leaflet

twitter.com/planetAC12/status/1114973925803462657

jamrollyolly · 14/04/2019 12:51

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Policeanddcrimecommissioner#Electorallsystem

Thanks to Lang for this link. Looks like we need to check into our police commissioners and see who they are allowing to carry out training on trans matters.

JackyHolyoake · 14/04/2019 17:51

Maybe also draw everyone's attention to established legal precedent as explained in this letter from lawyers:

forwomen.scot/30/03/2019/tie-letter-legal-response/

Here are the links to the relevant cases that establish that precedent:

www.casemine.com/judgement/uk/5b46f1fa2c94e0775e7ef4e3 [see para 70 onward]

and more recent case law that relied on the above judgement:

www.casemine.com/judgement/uk/5a8ff7bb60d03e7f57eb1a1f [see paras 63 - 68]

Further, that law has defined sex as a combination of chromosomes, gonads and genitals: swarb.co.uk/corbett-v-corbett-otherwise-ashley-fd-1-feb-1970/

In addition, the Equality Act 2010, in Section 212, defines the sexes as:

man = male of any age
woman = female of any age

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/section/212

2010Equality · 14/04/2019 18:23

If one of these is your council write to the head of children's services Leicester City, Leicestershire, Barnsley Metropolitan Borough Council, Birmingham City Council, Derbyshire County Council, Doncaster Metropolitan Borough Council, Kent County Council, Lincolnshire County Council, Nottinghamshire County Council, Sheffield City Council...

... Write to them about the awful Transgender Toolkit. Get a few local parents. Get a story in your local paper, building on the momentum of Oxfordshire and Warwickshire to review the guidance

whambamIamaman · 15/04/2019 17:33

Council elections coming up in some places and in some places the outcome will be strategically very important. Email all candidates to ask them if they support single-sex spaces and make it clear that your vote depends on that. This has two benefits: one is obviously getting them to think about it but the other one is making it impossible for them to claim that 'no one ever raises this'. Possibly follow up by contacting them on social media and thanking them for their response. Make them engage.

Angryresister · 15/04/2019 17:44

If you live in Leeds especially important to tell local party reps what we think about self ID.

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