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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Tavistock’s Experimentation with Puberty Blockers: Scrutinizing the Evidence

405 replies

Pimmsnlemonade · 05/03/2019 22:51

www.transgendertrend.com/tavistock-experiment-puberty-blockers/

"To summarize, GIDS launched a study to administer experimental drugs to children suffering from gender dysphoria. Between 2010 and 2014, puberty blockers were given to 50 children. This study yielded only one published scientific article on outcomes. It showed no evidence for the effectiveness of GnRHa: there was no statistically significant difference in psychosocial functioning between the group given blockers and the group given only psychological support. In addition, there is unpublished evidence that after a year on GnRHa children reported greater self-harm, and that girls experienced more behavioural and emotional problems and expressed greater dissatisfaction with their body—so puberty blockers exacerbated gender dysphoria. Yet the study has been used to justify rolling out this drug regime to several hundred children aged under 16. Almost five years after the last patient was enrolled in the experiment, there is no evidence to substantiate Carmichael’s claim ‘that the results thus far have been positive’."

OP posts:
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hipsterfun · 06/03/2019 02:05

If that’s an autocorrect, it’s a humdinger.

DoctoressPlague · 06/03/2019 02:08

Now I definitely won't sleep.

Mermaids and GIRES should be shut down immediately until their role in this has been investigated. They have not acted in the best interests of the children they claim to represent by putting pressure on GIDS.
I want to see this on all front pages, but more than that, I want to see someone from the NHS and government show some leadership. This has to stop.

Sunshineofleith · 06/03/2019 02:09

This is why parents can trust no one. The professionals that we are told to go to when we have a trans identifying child are experimenting on our kids. Thank f**k this is now being exposed. We can’t trust anyone. The TRA brigade and the NHS sheep are all complicit in child abuse.

Who will be our saviour?
Posie, Dr nic, transgendertrend, The resisters, Glinner, etc.

A year and a half ago, there was only transgender tend, 4th wave now, lily maynard, gender critical dad and gender critical parent website that I could access. I found mumsnet by chance and couldn’t believe the amount of information that people like the bewilderness, Lang cleg, Datun, Fermats , bowl of fish were impacting this debate. There are actually many many more names to add to this. Indeed all you amazing posters have kept me semi sane. The influence you all have is not to be under estimated. Yes, we can thank all our big names and celebrities but let’s face it, without all you mumsnetters , we would not be where we are now and we would not be exposing the cult of transgender. I do understand the parents who have accepted that their child is trans though. I understand that most of these parents are doing it from the view that this is what they have been told thus they go with the given narrative.
I can’t and won’t do this makes it really difficult as I am in conflict with my child and the narrative.
Now that this narrative is being debated I am hopeful that other parents will become more critical. I wonder if some of those parents who listened to the professionals and the lobbyists are now feeling betrayed, embittered and gaslighted? But what do those parents do? They believed in the ‘experts’ and have to follow through.
Puberty blockers were missold. I hope they sue the NHS.

scotsheather · 06/03/2019 02:11

The modern Wakefield scandal, acceptable drug abuse, self harm cult. At least eyes are opening now.

NeurotrashWarrior · 06/03/2019 06:41

Yy Wakefield.

Ffs the impact on the young developing brain must be obvious. My local area basic safeguarding training for anyone working in schools, even the cleaners, included a section on how the brain develops; two key big organisations and reorganisations being 0-3 and then puberty.

butteryellow · 06/03/2019 06:53

Jesus Fucking Christ - Imagine if you were one of the parents of these children - how you're going to feel hearing this, finding out what's been done to your children! I think the vehemence of some of these mermaid parents becomes much more understandable when you consider what the alternative feelings are - doubling down on it rather than let even a slight doubt into your mind is self-preservation here!

AnyOldPrion · 06/03/2019 07:03

Why though? Why roll it out when it's not helpful? I don't get it.

It is strange isn’t it. Even if there’s a political agenda towards the transitioning of children, it’s a huge step for doctors to continue with a treatment on children where there is no clear evidence.

Who benefits? I’d guess, given the reach, this is somehow really all about middle-aged men.

Is it really down to the insistence that we must all accept that “being trans” is an actual thing, as opposed to transitioning being a treatment for a mental health condition?

Or is there some fascination with creating adults who haven’t gone through puberty?

And if it’s the latter, is it people who are close at hand to take advantage?

As I was typing that, I remembered how small and intertwined the trans community is. So that is a viable answer.

Katvonfelttipeyebrows · 06/03/2019 07:23

The BBC took down it's page that said puberty blockers were not harmful.

They are all tiptoeing around going shhhhhhh and hoping no one will notice.

WE NOTICE

Society has been bullied into accepting child abuse. This is monstrous.

I'm so fucking angry

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 06/03/2019 07:29

That really needs to be picked up by the press! That is a really excellent piece of analysis and it needs to be more widely seen and acknowledged.

I am Shock though, I genuinely believed that the Tavistock was a voice of reason in this, taking things slowly and cautiously under terrible pressure from TRAs. But to cover up the results of their own study is dodgy as fuck Shock

PerryPerryThePlatypus · 06/03/2019 07:34

My dd is autistic and now an older teen. She is very aware of the trend of girls both diagnosed and undiagnosed wanting to transition. Some here might remember me as part of a very concerned group of parents of autistic children. We have been banging our drum about the use of very powerful drugs on our children. It is well documented that people on the spectrum tend to react and suffer side effects in greater numbers than the NT population.

Now I've sat on this thought for a while because its dark and almost mengele -esque. They are creating what are essentially adult aged children from vulnerable children. With childlike development. Those of us who remember PIE will know that its not just a few weirdos, its an overwhelming amount of people. I anticipate a deletion but there are the few suffering from genuine gender dysphoria being piggy backed and rail roaded for a far sinister cause in my opinion.

RepealTheGRA · 06/03/2019 07:48

They are creating what are essentially adult aged children from vulnerable children. With childlike development. Those of us who remember PIE will know that its not just a few weirdos, its an overwhelming amount of people. I anticipate a deletion but there are the few suffering from genuine gender dysphoria being piggy backed and rail roaded for a far sinister cause in my opinion.

Couldn’t agree more. Most of the damage is being perpetuated by well meaning but deluded individuals, but there is something very malignant pulling the strings Sad

MindTheMinotaur · 06/03/2019 07:50

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SoloClarinet · 06/03/2019 07:59

Sunshine - I completely agree with you about the FWR Mumsnetters!

Follow ups seem not very popular. There was a poster at last years WPATH that Susie Green tweeted where an adult UK Clinic showed 98% (or something like that) lack of desistance as proof of the success of physical and hormonal intervention.

Because anyone who desisted clearly wasn't followed up... That's not science.

Cloven · 06/03/2019 08:00

Also... transition itself is the kink, for many of them. I think it should be more widely known that many AGPs simply find it “gratifying” when others transition.

From that perspective, there is no agenda or deeper purpose, not even “validation.” It’s just a bunch of self-centred narcissists who aren’t being given boundaries or kept in check by wider society, responding to their own private incentives and rationalising that behaviour after the fact (like everyone does.)

SoloClarinet · 06/03/2019 08:02

Perry I am also v concerned about autistic children and young adults.
I think we will look back and see that vulnerable non conforming children and adults are being sterilised as a sort of state sponsored eugenics programme.

truthisarevolutionaryact · 06/03/2019 08:05

Terrifying. And over 1,000 children being prescribed these by the Tavistock. Well done Transgender Trend for such outstanding research.
Shame on the Tavistock for this . And shame on the NHS and the DfE for repeatedly funding organisations targeting children with their beliefs that hormone blockers are reversible and do no harm.

I am now off to (yet again) to write to my MP and the Secretaries of State for Education / NHS to share this with them and ask why they are still funding these organisations?

RepealTheGRA · 06/03/2019 08:07

I am now off to (yet again) to write to my MP and the Secretaries of State for Education / NHS to share this with them and ask why they are still funding these organisations?

Thank you

GerryblewuptheER · 06/03/2019 08:07

And yet Twitter Is full of people saying how accessing this treatment earlier sould have made life so much easier.

Why arent parents told this Angry

ChattyLion · 06/03/2019 08:08

We need to pressure MPs about this. We need a government public enquiry as to why-not just in the NHS but in private medicine too- dangerous drugs continue to be given to kids when no benefit has been shown by them and the risks are known.

YippeeKayakOtherBuckets · 06/03/2019 08:09

I think there is lots of evidence to suggest this is a eugenics programme.

If you sterilise all the autistic and homosexual children then the obvious outcome is...?

EweSurname · 06/03/2019 08:09

The BBC took down it's page that said puberty blockers were not harmful.

I hope this has been archived somewhere. It is shocking that children have been experimented on and any concerns about this framed as bigotry by the establishment and what are meant to be our trusted institutions.

ChattyLion · 06/03/2019 08:11

NHS information still does not mention risk of blockers

www.nhs.uk/live-well/healthy-body/think-your-child-might-be-trans-or-non-binary/

Janie143 · 06/03/2019 08:14

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ because it repeated a deleted message. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

clitherow · 06/03/2019 08:16

From that perspective, there is no agenda or deeper purpose, not even “validation.” It’s just a bunch of self-centred narcissists who aren’t being given boundaries or kept in check by wider society, responding to their own private incentives and rationalising that behaviour after the fact (like everyone does.)

On this subject, I copied the following from Wikipedia

The early history of the Tavistock Institute overlaps with that of the Tavistock Clinic because many of the staff from the Clinic worked on new, large-scale projects during World War II, and it was as a result of this work that the Institute was created.

During the war, staff from the Tavistock Clinic played key roles in British Army psychiatry.[3] Working with colleagues in the Royal Army Medical Corps and the British Army, they were responsible for innovations such as War Office Selection Boards (WOSBs) and Civil Resettlement Units (CRUs), and also worked on psychological warfare.[4][5][6][7] The group that formed around the WOSBs and CRUs were fascinated by this work with groups and organisations, and sought to continue research in this field after the war. Various influential figures had visited the WOSBs during the war, so there was scope for consultancy work, but the Clinic staff also planned to become a part of the National Health Service when it was established, and they had been warned that such consultancy and research would not be possible under the auspices of the NHS.[8] Because of this, the Tavistock Institute of Human Relations was created in 1947 to carry out organisational research when the Clinic was incorporated into the NHS.[9] The Rockefeller Foundation awarded a significant grant that facilitated the creation of the TIHR.
end quote

Tavistock has had a very interesting role in the promotion of agendas. The government learnt a great deal about psychological warfare during WWII and I would say that the trans issue exhibits all the hallmarks of a concerted campaign against its own population. This does not mean that the clinic is still actively involved in these measures or that the staff are consciously complicit but I still find it interesting that they are at the forefront of promoting the most radical shift in how we see humanity ever attempted in human history.

ChattyLion · 06/03/2019 08:18

This page is actually worse, and aimed st teenagers:
www.nhs.uk/live-well/healthy-body/trans-teenager/

Hormone blockers
If you need more time to think through your gender identity and you are approaching puberty, you may be offered the choice of being prescribed hormone blockers in addition to talking therapy. Hormone blockers are usually prescribed by your GP on the recommendation of the GIDS.
The hormone blockers will pause the physical changes of puberty, such as breast development or facial hair, and can also provide the time and opportunity you may need to decide how you feel about your gender identity.
^Older teenagers who are already going through puberty can also find hormone blockers helpful in alleviating distress around the way their body is developing.
Although the effects of hormone blockers are reversible once the medication is stopped, it’s important that you understand the physical implications of hormone treatment before you go ahead with the treatment.^
You may require further physical treatment after the hormone blockers. From the age of around 16 and after additional assessment, you may be offered gender-affirming (cross-sex) hormone medication. These are hormones that masculinise or feminise the body and these changes are largely not reversible, including loss of fertility.

Fertility
Although you may feel you are too young to think about having children later in life, it's important that you consider your future fertility and other possible effects on your body before choosing to move on to gender-affirming hormones.
The GIDS team will help you to consider your options and recommend you seek further specialist advice via your GP regarding gamete storage. This is the harvesting and storing of eggs or sperm for your future use.
Gamete storage is sometimes available on the NHS.