5 Gateshead councillors stick their heads above the parapet

[PimmsnLemonade]

Let's see if this gets agreed on Thursday:

democracy.gateshead.gov.uk/documents/s18511/Notice%20of%20Motion%20-%20Gender%20Recognition.pdf

It would have felt unreasonable to reject a discussion, when an open, respectful discussion is what we're calling for.

You’re starting from the very difficult position - the current rhetoric on these issues has been specifically designed to put pressure on those who disagree.

Caution is needed here though. I suspect the WEP put in place what seemed like very reasonable proposals about decision making being made by all members, and those in charge would have no more say than anyone else. But seemingly fair rules can sometimes be used by those with an agenda.

So go into the meeting with a healthy suspicion of any suggestions that appear reasonable, but would take power away from you.

I know I may be coming across as overly cautious, but the incredible power currently being wielded by a group that on the surface has little traction is indicative that you should take nothing at face value.

Good luck.

Get ready for the kids and guilt trips. No doubt you’ll get the usual ‘denying us the right to exist’ and usual lies trotted out about suicide statistics. Good luck, but unfortunately I’ve seen too many people back down in the face of lies and bullying.

Good luck Leigh, stand firm. I hope you will let us know how the meeting went?

Good luck Leigh - hope the meeting is genuinely productive

Well done. How else can I show my support. The TRAs are asking for emails of support how we support this sensible motion. I live near by Gateshead is no my council.

Welcome Leigh and massive solidarity to you & your fellow councillors. If you were my local councillor you’d have my vote, and I feel I can’t vote for my own labour MP at the moment due to your party’s behaviour otherwise. Thankyou for standing up for women’s voices, for lesbian voices, for our rights to fair representation of our sex, and for safeguarding of vulnerable women and children.

I sincerely hope that the meeting is productive, and that your camp is able to remain firm in wanting to voice its objections and concerns on these matters. LGBTLabour cannot actually prevent you from bringing this motion, can they, however much they tweet. If they decide to lodge formal complaints etc, well, that just reflects on them & draws more attention to the concerns being raised.

Thank you for this Leigh. I hope you are able to stand firm in what you have said. It really isn’t unreasonable but you can’t negotiate with narcissists. Its all their way or nothing at all. Many of us have seen how conceding ground in one area makes them push for even more. And it’s why many of us have started saying no.

you can’t negotiate with narcissists. Its all their way or nothing at all.

Yes, this is a concern. From the ‘transactivist playbook’ discussed on this thread
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3487089-Trans-activist-shares-their-activism-tactics
“The important thing to remember is you cannot debate in good faith with someone who will not debate in good faith. You cannot win on those terms.”
Probably worth reviewing that whole thread - it’s likely aligned to LGBTLabour’s approach to this matter.

Surely as this is backed up by the EA it will get through? They ANBU here.

Thanks Leigh. I have been following this with interest elsewhere.

LGBT Labour write a lot of letters of disapproval. I think it was them who wrote to Jess Philips to express their horror that she had enjoyed a documentary about Germaine Greer. They are Disgruntled of Tunbridge Wells but with rainbows and a more authoritarian air.

Disgruntled of Tunbridge Wells but with rainbows and a more authoritarian air

Is it the same LGBT Labour group that were photographed on the steps of the Commons? The group with not a person with XX chromosomes amongst them?

This group?

LGBT Labour have given their email for views on this.

I wouldn't say we've caved. We've agreed to defer the motion to meet with LGBT Labour at their request.

Will you be meeting any women’s groups? I don’t mean to be dismissive but this is how we ended up in this mess in the first place.

twitter.com/LGBTLabour/status/1088032815231438848?s=20

LGBT labour are looking for responses to share at that meeting. I'm not a labour member, so don't know if I can legitimately 'respond' but I -' quite certain they are looking for views from the broad church of Labour Party members.

Agree Aspie v good point

Maybe Leigh could provide an email for non LGBT constituents/labour party members to forward their views/feedback on the motion. Seems reasonable to give balance.

www.lgbtlabour.org.uk/

I don’t know if that group was representing LGBTL directly, Heather Peto (LGBTL’s trans officer) is in that photo though.

to me it's obvious that the Geordies will never accept this brave new world of multiple genders

I'm from Yorkshire I I would have typed those exact words about Yorkshire tykes a couple of years ago but look at what's been going on Leeds.

And yes to Aspie’s point, @LeighKirton would you also meet with a group representing women? Seems only fair. I’m sure there are FPFW or WPUK members reading this who could reach out.

And final point I really resent this persistent framing of LGBT vs women - it is very possible to be both of these groups, very many of us gender critical women are lesbian or bisexual, there are gender critical gay men and gender critical trans people too.

The motion has been postponed or deferred after a call to arms from LGBT Labour.

twitter.com/LGBTLabour/status/1088032815231438848?s=19

I’m very confident that the Cllrs will be meeting with women’s groups 😁