The 'c' word

[Terfing]

As in, the 4-letter word that refers to female genitalia.

I have started a thread in 'Site Stuff' asking them to ban the use of this word on Mumsnet. Personally, i find the word hugely offensive. It is shocking that one of the worst insults in the English language involves comparing someone to female genitalia. Even worse, I've seen it many times on the feminism boards.

What are other people's thoughts on this?

*how men see sex

That is interesting Blind yeo. I suppose "we're doomed" and "up the creek without a paddle" could be substituted.

lydiamajora

Because it’s horrifically racist.

Can’t believe you had to ask tbh.

I noticed a few years ago how lots of words for ending up in a bad situation are the same as a word for someone penetrating you: you are fucked, shafted, stuffed, screwed, buggered. I think it is extremely telling about how men really see sex.

Are you saying that men don't like sex or think it's a bad thing? I'm not sure I agree. Most of the phrases above allude to a man being 'buggered', not them having sex with a woman.

I don't think you can read too much into sayings. I mean, a lot of women talk about waiting for their 'prince', 'being swept off their feet', 'waiting for my knight in shining armour' - it's all over profiles on dating websites. You could equally read this as being telling of the fact that women want men to be the provider/do all the hard work if you were going to start reading into figures of speech.

I also suspect that men calling each other 'pussies' etc isn't so much indicative of a dislike of females as it is calling a man weak.

Agree blindyeo and sure there's existing analysis around this.

They reveal a couple of things at least -

Association of violence and sex or at least winner and loser rather than mutual
Person who is penetrated has "lost" and it's not a desirable position to be
ie person who is "fucked" is not in a good place
It's a game / or conquest view

You can see this in porn > the language imagery is all about dominating
And also in homophobia >> the men who get fucked are deemed "worse" than the ones who do the penetrating >> thread the other day mentioned a country where this is codified in law. (Harsher punishment for the man penetrated).

Men often use language about being fucked up the arse when they have had something bad happen > bending over etc

I don't think this language on the whole comes from women, it comes from men and their view of the world and insecurities -
A lot of it is about not being able to get a woman - mother fucker (you have to fuck your mum), wanker (no-one to have sex with) and so on.

And the ever present references to anal sex > which you're right is not about women it's about gay men > although the reason the recipient is reviled is because he has taken the "woman's role" which is seen as losing / submissive and that according to toxic masculinty is just all wrong.

What would swearing look like if women ran the world?

There's an exercise for a sat night!

Raisin >

And why was the word pussy chosen for that, do you think?

tarziew

lydiamajora

Because it’s horrifically racist.

Can’t believe you had to ask tbh

Well why not tarziew?. You've told us you call children cunts and that you like to drop the c word in for the effect it causes.

Unlike other posters for example NothingOnTellyAgain who has presented a reasoned argument for her use of the word you seem to use it just for the shock value.

Why not have the courage to go for a word which is truly shocking?

tarziew I would never utter the n-word though, and would always asterisk it to n**ger.

Was quite shocked to see it written out in full on here

It was me who wrote it in full. I did think about whether it was appropriate in this adult context, as my instinct was to use asterisks. I wouldn't have done it if I'd realised anyone would be actually upset by seeing it written in full. The Guardian uses it in full in this discussion of Huckleberry Finn, arguing against censoring Mark Twain's words.

See also this current Penguin Classics Conrad offering from Random House.

Apologies for the derail.

Back to the c-word!

On a purely pragmatic note, asterisks on MN doesn't work well because they're used for bolding markup. The bane of education threads discussing grades, and has mangled a post or two on this thread.

nothing that's a really interesting analysis which says it better than me.

There is some linguistic/phonetic analysis about swear words having hard consonants - fricatives and plosives apparently. So cock and cunt and fuck score highly on that. Maybe shorter vowel sounds too. Penis and vagina don't really feature very often as swear words, which would fit with that theory, even though they mean the same thing.

I saw a T-shirt the other month which read: "Intelligent people swear more than stupid motherfuckers" and have to admit to laughing.

And also in homophobia >> the men who get fucked are deemed "worse" than the ones who do the penetrating >>
And the ever present references to anal sex > which you're right is not about women it's about gay men > although the reason the recipient is reviled is because he has taken the "woman's role" which is seen as losing / submissive and that according to toxic masculinty is just all wrong.

Good point Nothing on telly
I don't know if it's used much in real life but in US films "Blow me" or "Suck my dick" gets used quite a bit as a contemptuous insult used by straight men towards other men.
In The Shawshank Redemption, Andy getting anally raped was bad enough but being threatened with having to give blow jobs was so beyond the pale he would rather die. His counter threat and apparent willingness to die carrying out the threat are, I think, meant to show his dignity and strength of character. The writer could not bear to have his straight male hero give a blowjob like a woman; does he think that this was pushing it so far that the audience would have lost some respect for Andy if he had acquiesced? The implication seems to be that it is preferable and more honourable for a straight man to die rather than perform this sexual act which is deemed to be submissive and the ultimate humiliation....something for only women to do.