Letter in the Times - Plea To The Trans Lobby from group of transsexuals

[PimmsnLemonade]

www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/comment/times-letters-reasons-for-private-schools-oxbridge-success-sqjb6kkgt

Classy.

I hate the way transsexuals and transgender people force gender stereotypes into children and encourage children to take puberty blockers and wear binders.

In what way have transsexual people being doing this ? Transsexual people have been around for decades without a problem. It is the new modern transgender agenda that brings the problem.....you cannot attribute this to transsexuals.

Indeed it is the transsexual people that want proper medical diagnosis, a stop to self id and who see transition only as a last resort.

Please don't lump two very different things together.

I fear that what Kay has said this evening has very much been taken out of context and used in the most negative way possible.

Kay is a very genuine person who is like many fed up with the attack on transsexual people by modern transgender ideology.

I am unsurprised that Kay would be upset because what we are seeing at the minute isn't just about stopping the modern agenda but a reversal of things that have been in place for many many years. When someone has enjoyed certain privileges how should they feel when told these privileges should now be taken away because a non medicalised group wih their own agenda are attempting to hijack them.

Please don't lump two very different things together.

There is not a clear separation.
As discussed previously.

Please don't attempt to rebuke posters who are expressing safeguarding concerns for children.

This is a parenting site.
It shouldn't be surprising that many here are concerned for children.

current thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3452489-Mermaids-given-500-000-by-National-Lottery-Sunday-Times

Kay is a very genuine person who is like many fed up with the attack on transsexual people by modern transgender ideology.

It is very understandable that some transsexuals are fed up with the damage done by transgender ideology.

This has been going on for some time, driven in part by some prominant transsexuals.

With respect, energies may be better spent challenging this elsewhere.

I fear that what Kay has said this evening has very much been taken out of context and used in the most negative way possible.

No.
What Kay has said is clear.
Please don't blame women who can read.

The current 'transgender' thing grew from the 'transsexual' thing.

With respect I strongly disagree.

Transsexuals are a medicalised group in a minority who were given the GRA.

The transgender ideology came out of a group who appropriated transsexual rights that were never intended for them. Simply they liked what they represented and they took them. If anyone is to blame it's the government.

You cannot blame the victim of theft.

With respect, energies may be better spent challenging this elsewhere.

Yes. Take it up with PFC, with Stephen Whittle and Christine Burns who have been working to make yours an 'inclusive' movement since the mid 90's (even inclusive of cross dressers). Unless I missed it they haven't yet issued a similar condemnation of TRA violence, have they?

The transgender ideology came out of a group who appropriated transsexual rights that were never intended for them. Simply they liked what they represented and they took them. If anyone is to blame it's the government.

Some research may prove useful.
There are many women who have done the work on the site.

Have a look at threads re Press for Change, Yogakarta principles, hansard GRA, transgender enquiry.

Governments were lobbied.
See who was involved with the lobbying and take it up with them.

You cannot blame the victim of theft.

Wow.

Those things you speak of that 'have been in place for many years', that you regard as 'privileges'? Those were our spaces that we fought for, not as a privilege but as something that permitted us to participate in public life (as if we were actual human beings), or to escape or heal from male violence.

You certainly cannot blame us for being pissed off at the theft of them. We were never asked.

Those things you speak of that 'have been in place for many years', that you regard as 'privileges'? Those were our spaces that we fought for, not as a privilege but as something that permitted us to participate in public life (as if we were actual human beings), or to escape or heal from male violence

Just 100 years ago this week that some women (adult human females) were able to vote.

you cannot attribute this to transsexuals

We can do whatever we like, love. And we can evidence it too - as you'd know if you'd read the thread. Transsexual activists were front and centre in genderist policy creation and you've been provided with a far from exhaustive list.

And, by the way, not a great idea to use the imperative as a male person on a feminist board. It's a ruddy great red flag, along with all the others on display on this thread.

So TS people get attacked and I'm not allowed to make a single statement because its apparently a red flag for being an imperative.

So what's "We can do whatever we like, love." ?

Whatever you choose to think I'm not the enemy, Shock horror but there are TS people medical diagnosed who transitioned as last resort who are completely against the modern transgender movement. Some of us just want a quiet life.

So TS people get attacked

The only Transsexual who was attacked was miranda yardley who isn't on the thread. The attack was challenged by a number of people.

Posters are disagreed with because of specific things they say in their posts.

Not because they are made by people who describe themselves as transsexuals.

Please don't suggest transphobia.

Do you know what an imperative is? Did I order you to do anything there? Or did I - shock, horror - assert my right to say what I want? But you know - do feel absolutely free to keep digging.

Go and tell PFC. Go and tell GIRES. None of this is our fault, we didn't ask for any of it. We were never consulted.

The victims of theft? Rotfl
Transsexuals- men whose gender dysphoria is deemed severe enough to be classed as a medical condition.
Transgender- any other man who fancies being a woman whenever he wants.
Both types take issue with women asserting their boundaries, both remain biologically male. A GRC does not magically switch XY to XX.
The only theft is of the word woman.

I see Kay's vile comment about Miranda has been deleted. I kept a record of it, so please, Kay, don't pretend it wasn't what it was.

I think what we see here is how difficult the situation really is. One part of me is pragmatic that TS are in womens spaces and have been for many years. Part of me does not like it at all. And I am especially upset with regard to the TRAs and the effects on younger women.

I think its fine for one TS to say that another doesnt speak totally for them . Why would it not be? Everyone is different.

I dont find TS dominant on the Feminism boards. There are very few. Im glad they can contribute. And I found it helpful to hear their views here. The words be kind does tend to rile feminists now though so should be avoided! :)

there are TS people... who are completely against the modern transgender movement

There also are TS people who are pushing the current trans agenda.

In this thread, we have see from self-identified transsexuals:

• derail from the original topic which was violence against women carried out in the name of transgender activism, the entire point of the letter;
• defiant statements from a biological male affirming that male’s belief in having a right to share women’s spaces; and
• women in the thread being told what to do.

What it really comes down to is this: if you’re going to claim to be different to TRAs, then you actually have to be different to TRAs.

In the meantime, I shall hope the letter achieved some good in highlighting the original problem and I hope that an appetite to challenge violence against women may be found within today’s transgender activism.

*Transsexuals- men whose gender dysphoria is deemed severe enough to be classed as a medical condition.
Transgender- any other man who fancies being a woman whenever he wants. *

Transexualism up until 1983 was a medical condition. In the 90s it was replaced with Gender Identity Disorder and then in 2013 became Gender Dysphoria. Putting the modern ideology aside and the manipulation and political agendas going on GD diagnosed correctly is a severely debilitating condition that massively impacts someones life. Actual incidence of transsexualism is rare ... you only have to consider the fact that 4900 people in total have attained GRC.

By all means say no to TG, argue against TS too but please never trivialise what genuine GD sufferers experience.