I just can't even right now - "trans" toddler

[aidelmaidel]

NC for this because very un-PC

Acquaintance has a three-year-old girl, who has decided that she is a boy. Has picked a different name, a different birthday (?) and Mum is extremely vigilant about defending this child's New Identity in all directions. Nursery, grandparents, colleagues have all been told, and parenting support group (mostly academics) are terribly supportive whenever anyone refers to this child as "she." She's even posted links to those weird sites that sell fake penises for small children (so that they can have an authentic bulge in their nappies?) so I assume the kid is packing one of those.

This has been going on for a good few months now.

Recently the mum posted that the child regularly has epic two-hour tantrums.

I can't help but think well, you're letting the kid insist that their name, their physical makeup, and their birthday can be altered at will and every adult around them must bow down accordingly, does it really surprise you that the kid can't cope with life when other things aren't treated the same?

Venting here because this sort of thinking is verboten in real life. Is this one of those things where once you have a toddler of your own you get a totally different perspective?

“I feel this is child abuse...not sure what kind but there is something seriously wrong with a parent that adopts this approach with a toddler”

It’s emotional abuse. I haven’t yet dealt with this example, but I can see it coming. Our council safeguarding course was very cagey about it. I’ve known the trainer for years and she was clearly unhappy with having to “move with the times” as she put it.

I have seen other examples around food and allergies, where a parent will insist that a child must not eat certain foods. The most extreme was a lady who self-diagnosed her children with allergies to almost every allergen going; she was making them ill with their restricted diet.
It’s why many settings now insist on medical proof of allergies. I wonder if that will come to be the rule with trans-identifying toddlers: medical proof of dysphoria or we raise concerns. Of course, it may go the other way and that really scares me.

Why does it scare me?
It’s because it’s so important to toddlers that they understand their own identity. I have seen the real distress caused by teasing that a girl is a boy, for example. Blurring these lines is going to cause some massive mental health issues in the future.

Which brings me on to those tantrums. Kids of any age can have tantrums; 2 year olds are notorious for them.
Regular, epic 2 hour tantrums in a 3 year old, particularly an older 3 year old, aren’t usual. I would be concerned if that was happening with a child in my care. I’ve known similar and there was a definite and traumatic reason for them.

Exactly Tanith
It also occurs to me that tantrums such as these might be a symptom of a developmental disorder, such as ASD

Sweet baby Jesus - DS used to pretend to be a cat at that age and my sister was called Bill apparently.

Some parents just need to stop.

Unfortunately for some parents now a trans child is the ultimate accessory - you get to virtue signal your wokeness to the world, and get nothing but uncritical adoration for what a great supportive, loving parent you are.

It speakers me sick.

Makes me sick

It also occurs to me that tantrums such as these might be a symptom of a developmental disorder, such as ASD

Absolutely. Someone up thread mentioned that 2 hour tantrums aren't normal even for a three year old. The only one of my children who had two hour (and more) toddler tantrums was the one who turned out to be autistic.

And like virtually everyone else on the thread my kids have taken on all kinds of weird and wonderful identities at that age. But there's an obvious distinction between playing along in good humour where appropriate and actually believing that your child is Peppa Pig or whatever.

Lastly what the actual fuck with those "packers". I didn't know they were a thing for adults (sheltered...) let alone kids. Please will someone come along and tell me it's a joke...

Warning, this is disturbing. Don't watch it with small children around.

Sorry, should have said this is a video that starts by looking at the packer phenomenon and goes on to look at the links between that business and others which should really have nothing to do with children at all. Worrying.

FFS
I have a a 3yr nearly 4yo child who is very intelligent but completely unaware of gender to the point where they misgender me and everyone around constantly.

"Mummy is making lunch! He says it's ready!" His best female friend is always "he".

We got him a silver Chinese waving cat yesterday. Someone asked is it a boy or girl cat?
"No. It's a silver cat!"

This is normal child level understanding at this age.

The transing of children to an adult agenda is really upsetting.

Someone up thread mentioned that 2 hour tantrums aren't normal even for a three year old. The only one of my children who had two hour (and more) toddler tantrums was the one who turned out to be autistic.

I cannot for the life of me remember where I read it, but I came across a post somewhere that suggested that the coincidence of ASD and wishing to wear the clothes of the opposite sex in very young children is about sensory issues. That is to say, a girl might choose the less decorated or seamed, unrestricting, soft clothes of a boy; a boy might choose more figure-hugging girl clothes for the swaddled-like feeling, or appreciate strokable satiny fabric you find in dressing up clothes. Struck me as interesting, not least because my own girls regularly rejected "fussy" clothes at that age (cheers for those, grandma) and I loathed anything with seams and labels myself - I still cut most of the labels out even now.

If a parent only sees a child reaching for "opposite sex" clothes without thinking any deeper, and is blinded by wokeness or incipient Munchausen's, I can see where you'd get the "actually wants to be the opposite sex" from.

Jazz Jennings mother decided he was really a girl at 18 months because, wait for it... Jazz used to undo the poppers on the bottom of their sleepsuit to pretend they were wearing a dress. I read this on Jazz's own blog.
Ok, I'm sure there were other 'signs' as well, but what kind of batshit parent looks at an 18 month old undoing poppers and thinks it means they're really secretly a girl?
Another parent decided his daughter was really a boy because she liked taking a leadership role in games. Literally anything can be interpreted to indicate that a child is really trans, it would seem.

The baby girl who pulled hair clips out - that was evidence she was really a boy

Maybe you could suggest your friend see her HV or GP about the tantrums?

Tiger

That video is disturbing. A necessary watch

If this was any other condition then it would be seen as a case of Munchausens/Munchausens by proxy.
Which makes it more worrying that TRAs are pushing the claim that trans is not a medical condition.

From the age of 3 DD was insistent she was a boy. She wanted, and had, short hair, she only wore football kits, her friends were only boys, she played with “boys@ toys and had no interest whatsoever in anything girl related. Last summer when she was 11, she wore boys swimming trunks and a rash vest on holiday, she didn’t own a skirt and I’d had to have conversations with her new secondary school about how I was concerned about her fitting in and asking for support.

Fast forward a year and her hair is now bob length and she wants to know when it will be shoulder length, she has lots of girl friends who love her for being her. We just came back from holiday where she wore pretty bikinis and she has a big PINK (the shop) obsession. She still has great friends who are boys and is a fortnite champion but she’s comfortable as a girl.

We could so easily have gone down the trans route but she just supported her and let her grow into who she truly wants to be and it’s looks like she’s an independent strong minded girl

The crazy thing about those toddler packing products is that they don’t even look like a small boy’s penis, not any that I have seen as the parent of a six year old boy at least. They are just mini versions of mature adult penises which is even creepier. Not to get too graphic and this might only apply to non-circumcised boys, but a kid penis is narrow and straight, it doesn’t have the shape of that prosthetic at all.

Such lunacy.

Anyway: update on 3 year old - currently singing along to her new favourite musician of the moment, Johnny Cash and ‘The Ring of Fire’ I guess she is trans-genre now, gone a little bit country... I’ll need to get her a cowboy hat and boots to respect her newfound persona.

I find it very disturbing when adults entertain this nonsense. Children cannot understand the social construct of gender at such a young age.
I find it horrifying that there are professionals who are encouraging this.

She's going to see someone about the tantrums. Someone who will be 100% supportive of the child's new gender identity, of course. She suspects ADHD...I don't know, it's just depressing now. Maybe kid has ADHD and maybe they don't, I have no idea, but how can subjecting them to this weird pretend reality be helping?

Going to hope DD decides to be a T-rex or a doggie or something, that'll be ever so much easier than if she decides to be a boy, you don't have the College of Pediatricians on your case for telling your kid they aren't really a doggie once in a while.

Amaaboutthis that's reassuring. I'm glad your DD is enjoying her own awesomeness.

Thanks aidel she is totally awesome and I’m really proud that we let her just ride through the stage. We never made a big deal about it, just let her get on with it and never ever suggested to her that it was possible for her to become a boy because there was a time when she would have fully embraced that concept if it had been put to her.

I can’t stress enough how much I feel your accquaintence is wrong. It’s so utterly normal for girls to be non conformist and to be a “tomboy” and it’s so fine and NORMAL. Yes, in a world of pink and glitter it can be hard for a parent to see that but to guide their child and say that’s ok is the best thing they can do. Perhaps the child will grow out of it, perhaps as a teen they’ll start to question their identity but until they have the maturity to understand their own feelings then the parents role is not to make any decisions for them

Ps virtually all the girls who were similar to DD, and we know quite a few as she plays football which seems to attract lots of like minded girls, have moved on from their “boy phase” as they’ve reached puberty.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3340145-article-on-transgender-children-in-preschool

Recent discussion about a bloody academic paper talking about trans toddlers

Thought this was a very interesting and worrying news story

Nearly a quarter of 14-year-old girls in the UK said they had self-harmed, a report suggests.
A survey of 11,000 children found 22% of the girls and 9% of the boys said they had hurt themselves on purpose in the year prior to the questionnaire.
Rates of self-harm were worst (46%) among those who were attracted to people of the same or both genders.
The Children's Society report said gender stereotypes and worries about looks were contributing to unhappiness.

All this gender stereotyping shite is just so regressive and damaging

Fifth of 14-year-old girls in UK 'self-harm'

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-45329030

My friend's 3yo boy likes to wear princess dresses. He says he wants to be a girl when he grows up. When my DD was 3, she told me that she was a unicorn.

My friend, doesn't react to her toddlers statement, because he is a toddler. He may well want to be a girl when he is older, time will tell, but you certainly do not push it onto a 3yo, you sit back and see what happens. he might be gay, he might not. He might be a cross dresser, he might not.

He might just be a small child who wants to play dress up like his older sister.

Fifth of 14-year-old girls in UK 'self-harm' Are they all actually 14/female? How do we know?