BACP Gender,Sexual, and Relationship Diversity by Dr Meg-John Barker

[R0wantrees]

Good Practice Guide, British Association for Counselling and Psychotherapy
(extract)
2.6 Gender identity: woman
Definitions
"Whether trans or cisgender, intersex or not, many people identify as
women. However, what this means varies a great deal depending on their other intersecting attributes. It is important not to assume, for example, that being a woman necessarily involves being able to bear children, or having XX sex chromosomes, or breasts. Being a woman in a British cultural context often means adhering to social norms of femininity, such as being nurturing, caring, social, emotional, vulnerable, and concerned with appearance.
However, of course, not all women adhere to all these things. For example some neurodiverse women (on the autistic/aspergic/ADHD spectrums) may struggle to express emotions, or with social situations. In some northern working-class contexts femininity is associated with strength and aggression. As always an intersectional understanding is vital and we need to be mindful that what is culturally regarded as the epitome of femininity is white, middle class, youthful, non-disabled, heterosexual, cisgender, and thin. This strongly shapes all women’s experiences of womanhood.
Common concerns
While gender may not always be relevant to a woman’s presenting issues, mental health struggles are often gendered. Women have such high rates of body image issues that this has been labelled ‘normative discontent’.
It has been related to both narrow ideals of feminine beauty, and the
contradictory pressures on women today to conform to stereotypical
femininity and to be independent and successful. Food and body
can represent one potential area of control in an uncontrollable and
contradictory world. Women are more likely than men to be diagnosed with depression, anxiety, and many other emotional disorders. This has been linked to the way women’s identities are often bound up with other people, for example, rates of depression often peak for mothers when children leave home. Therapy with women may well involve exploring their relationships with others, and with being desirable, pleasing and/or approved of" (continues)

My understanding is that the majority of counsellors in the UK are BACP accredited. There is a great deal in this document to consider.

The author is the partner of Edward Lord who identifies as non-binary see recent threads:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3323475-Surprise-The-Masons-now-welcome-Transwomen-but-not-women
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3317922-City-of-London-Corporation-consultation-is-out-this-covers-Hampstead-Ponds
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3316098-Childrens-Convenor-Elected-Councillor-calls-women-cunts-on-Twitter-rants

Bolleaux. Have read the Op. Now I'm going to read what you all say, to cheer me up.

Thank fuck I'm northern and allowed to be agressive and uncouth. Otherwise if I needed the services of BACP councillor i'd be told I'm tans Oh and yes there is a special northern training school you are enrolled in at birth for female assigned babies who have southern born parents who faced the challenge of emigrating north. We wouldn't want those poor FAABers picking up any of those namby pambly southern female traits

Northern toughie signing in- assigned northern at birth

I found the northern, working class reference very offensive, as well as this sentence:

Being a woman in a British cultural context often means adhering to social norms of femininity, such as being nurturing, caring, social, emotional, vulnerable, and concerned with appearance.

Sums up the ideology really. Does 'emotional' mean blowing a gasket whenever I come across more of this crap?

I find it really highly offensive and if BACP counsellors were to use this on me they'd be gaslighting me.

It is very concerning that someone who could be counselling vulnerable women - especially those who've suffered based on the reality of their biological sex - will be peddling this claptrap, and if they really sign up to it the counselling could easily be adding to the abuse not helping.

Also, I'm really fucking furious at the "assigned at birth" shit. Both my DDs are Xx, we know this from genetic testing, their sex wasn't even observed it was scientifically and genetically proven. And probably will be for more and more children now this can be done with a simple maternsl blood test. Argh. When I have time I will be complaining to BACP.

*maternal

OK, so suppose you live on the Scotland-England border, you might live on one side and work on the other. Do you change throughout the day form being northern (English) to southern (Scottish) and back again? Are southern Scots like the southern English, and northern Scots like the northern English? Why does it all change on a geographical man-made border?

It's juts like the stereotypical child playing football is a boy in the UK but a girl in the US. How confusing for the midwife, trying to work out where someone might live in the future, in order to assign a gender .

Fuck that shit. (Comment aimed at original post.)

on the autistic/aspergic/ADHD spectrums may struggle to express emotions, or with social situations.

I don't struggle with emotions but certain social situations can be challenging. But that is not the same. For a comparison to be meaningful, it needs compare like with like.

Do not compare being a man who 'identifies' as a woman with a woman. Transwomen are not and never will be women.

Being a woman in a British cultural context often means adhering to social norms of femininity, such as being nurturing, caring, social, emotional, vulnerable, and concerned with appearance.

I am not nurturing but I am good at mentoring people in a work setting. Caring? If I like you, I care about you. Social? Social what? Emotional? Emotional what? Vulnerable? Yes, physically - which is why I don't want men in private space reserved for women. Concerned with appearance? Meh. On days that I am out and about I make sure to be tidy. If I'm at home on my own, anything goes.

Fuck off, author of this nonsense.

Is the author a woman (in the real sense)?

That’s really bad, regressive stuff.

I have several friends who are counsellors/training or in therapy type roles (it’s our age!) and I know they would agree with it though. ‘Love is the answer’ etcetc.

The meg John Prounouns are them/they

Dies laughing in a tough rough non feminine way

They also signed the "academic's letter", a copy of which was posted on MN some time ago.

They signed the one in support of Nic Shall (Bristol Student facing disciplinary).

openletterbristol.wordpress.com/
thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3259500-Trans-Student-Faces-Expulsion-from-Univeristy-of-Bristol?pg=2

Being Northern and working class means I can punch the author on the nose then?

What a load of fucking shit. My Northern aggressiveness rages at the phrase 'assigned at birth'. Please let this person only be allowed to write shite papers and not actually do any actual counselling of vulnerable actual people.

I can imagine her advice to me. 'What you need dear, is to find yourself a nice man, then you can give up work, and make your home nice for him. Bake him cakes and have his slippers and pipe ready for when he returns from his arduous day at work. Be the best you can, fix your make-up and hair and don't speak unless spoken to, let him relax after his hard day'.

The sort of shite written in the 40s and 50s.

Where do I get my special ‘oppressed’ status for being forcibly assigned Northern at birth ?
I identify as Cornish, it’s definitely true because I love pasties and clotted cream.

As always an intersectional understanding is vital and we need to be mindful that what is culturally regarded as the epitome of femininity is white, middle class, youthful, non-disabled, heterosexual, cisgender, and thin. This strongly shapes all women’s experiences of womanhood.

this hasn't in any way shaped my experience of womanhood.

damn

I must be doing it wrong

Urgh, there are no redeeming features of that piece of "work". From the truly garbled definitions of words and outright ideological propaganda, to unironically writing "Google is also your friend in this!" under terminology. Then deliberately putting trans people before "cis", both in the "gender status" section, and the descriptor of gender identites. Then the insult of pretending the author has read Cordelia Fine. Even the relationships stuff was highly questionable. Did anyone else notice the "Secret non-monogamies" bit (AKA adultery/cheating)? I would really HATE for this to be marriage counselling advice:

With secret non-monogamy it is easy for therapists to become focused on the non-normativity of what is being done: going against the normative rules of monogamy. However, under a GSRD affirmative approach, non-monogamy is an equally valid form of relating to monogamy, and the boundaries between them are blurred anyway. Given this, the key issue with secret non-monogamy is its non-consensual nature and the secrets, lies, and deception which are involved. There may also be non-consensual deception and invasion of privacy on the part of a partner who has ‘discovered’ another’s infidelity.
Thus the goal of therapy is not to stop the non-monogamous person or people from being non-monogamous – just as we would not attempt to stop a gay or trans person from being gay or trans – rather it is helping them navigate their relationship such that non-monogamy can either be done consensually and openly, or the relationship can end or change if partners are too incompatible in terms of where they are at with non/monogamy for this to be possible.

This person is female.

This person maybe female but what they've written is worryingly regressive offensive bs.

What is so striking is the comparison between this and other ‘queer’ writing and that produced by gender critical academics, reporters and essayists.

Gender critical writing is lucid - the writer knows what they want to say and the aim is to communicate to the reader. Even when the ideas are complex it is possible to put the work in and understand what is being said.

When I read things like this by Meg-John Barker and other queer or trans theorists (or even commentators on twitter) I cannot get a secure mental footing. Definitions are either not given or they shift and change within the same paragraph or even the same sentence, trains of thought are impossible to follow or lead nowhere and arguments often just come down to “believe what I say because I am saying it.”

Language is used here not to communicate but to obscure- as Shakespeare said “it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.”

I don’t think it’s a matter of intelligence or skill (in all cases), I think it’s a matter of clarity of thought and willingness to test your own ideas so that you are able to present those ideas with confidence and allow others to make up their own minds about what you’re saying - rather than just this combination of propaganda and self promotion

Nice try, 'Meg-John'.

Tell us again who those cultural expectations are attached to from birth, I forget...

There are still two sexes, dipstick.

The non-monogamy bit Lets see if we can help you persuade your partner to accept a polyamorous relationship and by the way lets help you deal with your feelings at invasion of your privacy when your partner found out you were cheating.
And some people can't be monogamous- they were born that way - so if you find that your partner cheated they are just being their authentic self and you are probably bigoted for not accepting it.

Sound familiar?