Pussy Riot pitch invasion

[speakingwoman]

So, whilst our idea of protest is an anti Trump carnival in London, this group invades the World Cup final knowing that prison and worse awaits, no doubt.

They can spoil my football enjoyment anytime. Truth is inconvenient.

Wow, the above article pretty much echoes my point.

LaSqrll, not so fast with the hat eating....

The "orgy" and the chicken vag thing weren't pussy riot, but another protest group called Voina. The media have frequently wrongly attributed both actions to PR so you're not alone in making this mistake.

Tolokonnikova was part of a performance in which couples were photographed having public sex in the Timiryazev State Biology Museum in Moscow in February 2008.[167] This exhibitionist act was intended as a satire of Dmitry Medvedev's call to increase the birth rate in Russia,[168] but was typically described as an "orgy" by the media....

Some critics made little or no distinction between Pussy Riot and Voina, incorrectly attributing past actions of Voina to Pussy Riot. In particular, a notorious performance by Voina in St. Petersburg, in which a woman stole a chicken from a supermarket by stuffing it in her vagina, is sometimes cited by detractors of Pussy Riot. However, there is no evidence that members of Moscow-based Pussy Riot participated in this action.[162]

You can find the full text on the wiki entry, along with links to sources.

So no, still not accepting the porny descriptor, nor the assertion that the collective is led or governed by a bloke.

radfemworldnews.wordpress.com/2012/08/20/pussy-riot-whose-freedom-whose-riot/

No, not FEMEN. There are cross-overs between PR and Viona though.

speakingwoman I know of two 'events' that Pussy Riot were involved with (one of them not actually Pussy Riot but one of the members involvement - thanks AssassinatedBeauty).

Both consisted of invading a public space (one a museum and one a church) to have sex in front of people (including children) or to play music. In both cases the ordinary people witnessing these events were shocked, upset and hurt, especially the people who were worshipping in the church.

I only know about these incidents because I read an interview in the Guardian with one of the members (which I've looked for but I can't find now). I found these methods of protesting quite shocking and disrespectful. I only remember the description of the events, I can't remember what the message of the protest was supposed to be. That's why I think their methods of protest are hugely flawed.

You know hornets, an awful lot of people were shocked, upset and hurt by, for example, the Get the L Out protest at Pride.

How do you feel about that protest in terms of its impact on bystanders and the people there's to celebrate Pride? That impacted on an awful lot more people in terms of spoiling an event of cultural importance to the participants and spectators. Here it's been celebrated as brave and heroic, if somewhat misunderstood.

Protest pisses people off. It's kind of in the job description.

" That's why I think their methods of protest are hugely flawed."

And what, I ask again, do you think are suitable methods for protesting in Putin's Russia?

And what, I ask again, do you think are suitable methods for protesting in Putin's Russia?

I suppose a bigger question here is what kinds of protests for women and by women succeed and what kinds fail?

"Protest pisses people off. It's kind of in the job description."

this.

When I've lived life with just one passport, Russian, and protested Putin's dictatorship in some more effective way, at that point (in the unlikely event I'm not dead) will I offer my sage advice to Pussy Riot and let them know that they might want to consider "bigger questions."

Until then, they have my admiration.

But this is an FWR board? Surely we should be concerned with questions of sex and gender?

What tactics should women in Russia use to protest, if Pussy Riot are going about it the wrong way and under the control of men?

Did you read YetAnother's link?

'Utterly devastating' - give over. I've been at games where people have got onto the pitch - usually some pissed up male who thinks we all want to see his knob. Everyone has a laugh and it's over in the blink of an eye. And if it had really happened when England were 1-0 down to France, it might have worked in England's favour (dream on).

Yes.

Presumably you think that Pussy Riot is simply Voina under another name, and that there are men behind the scenes controlling what these women do.

Presumably you think that Pussy Riot is simply Voina under another name, and that there are men behind the scenes controlling what these women do

Errr no. Not quite. But where there is smoke I do think that it is worth investigating the fire.

What tactics should women in Russia use to protest, if Pussy Riot are going about it the wrong way and under the control of men

This seems to keep being repeated, much like I see 'Tell me what it feels like to be a woman' here. I personally don't think this is a good or a fair tactic when the debate here is between women who are regulars on the board and who are all feminists. Our collective goal is to end women's oppression and this should be assumed to be in good faith. If some of us disagree on tactics then surely the response should be open and genuine questioning and debate as well as genuine listening? remembers why she ran away from feminism in circa 1995

PR are not the be-all and end-all of women's protests in Russia. There are many women blogging, setting up support groups, joining human rights watch organisations and providing information to these.

I agree that Pussy Riot are not perfect and are not above criticism, at all. I don't agree with everything they do or represent. But I can't criticize them for protesting in this way at this event. I don't think it was counter productive or pointless.

Saying that they’re doing it wrong from our sofas is So “let them eat cake” though.
Not everyone has choices.

IntercontinentalButtCrack I actually wrote a complaint to the Guardian about their coverage of the Get the L Out protest (in fact two emails, one to the reporter Patrick Greenfield and the other to the Readers Editor Paul Chadwick). I complained that they'd not once described the protester as Lesbians or explained what the protest was about, but had instead referred to them as 'anti-trans' (which they were NOT).

Another thread on here has links to a New Statesman article by Sarah Ditum in which she says this "If the mark of successful direct action is getting your message out, Get the L Out failed. Never mind assessing if their grievance was legitimate – most of the coverage failed even to describe what it was."

If people were shocked and upset by 8 Lesbians laying down on the floor or walking with banners which said 'Lesbians are female homosexuals' for the reasons you describe, then I am sorry that the protest hurt them but some things need to be said. I don't disagree that protest is about pissing some people off. However, there is a big difference between that kind of peaceful protest (however much the message might hurt some people who don't agree) to indulge in group sex in public or invade a church when people are worshipping. Those acts tend to turn people off whatever message the protesters were trying to convey which seems to render the whole thing pointless.

And what, I ask again, do you think are suitable methods for protesting in Putin's Russia?

I can't answer that because I don't know.

I just think that group sex in public and invading a church with people worshipping in it is not the best way to protest.

I have a mate who has met/ ‘worked’ with them a number of times (mate also spent a period of time cooling heels in a Russian prison for activism related offence.) Mate has nothing but admiration for them - a strong and committed bunch who are determined to protest and prepared to take the very personal consequences.
Protesting at the World Cup final was a stroke of genius. Really. I am actually a bit worried for their safety though. You have to hope that the international media interest will hamper any disappearances.
And lol at the grave concerns over a football match being ruined - ruined I tell you! It’s practically a tradition to have someone running round, usually starkers. Kudos for them being brave enough to do it there, though. These gals are committed.

Pussy Riot don't protest by having group sex in public.

I can see why some people find the church protest to be counterproductive and offensive. Is the pitch invasion in the same category for you, Hornets?

Saying that they’re doing it wrong from our sofas is So “let them eat cake” though. Not everyone has choices

So if you don't support them you are Marie Antoinette? I don't think so. Many of us are activists in other contexts and we (well most of us) on FWR all have a vested interest in feminism and women's rights, including where these are 'threatened' by those claiming to act in the name of feminism.

I agree that Pussy Riot are not perfect and are not above criticism, at all. I don't agree with everything they do or represent. But I can't criticize them for protesting in this way at this event. I don't think it was counter productive or pointless

I didn't see the protest. I was referring to PR more generally.

slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/05/pussy-riots-nadezhda-tolokonnikova-on-trans-rights-trump-and-the-activist-messiah-complex.html