Scarlett J pulls out of trans role

[LighthouseSouth]

Bullied out

No links to sites I'd want to drive traffic to but info on Twitter etc.

Maybe the film won't be made.

I can't think who they could get for the role who'd be acceptable to TRAs.

To be fair Scarlet J looked nothing like Dante Tex Gill, so maybe a more masculine-looking woman would be appropriate, but not a man as at least one TRA was suggesting.

It says she has pulled participation. I wonder if that means the production company will pull out too, as it's hers?

She owns the show? Awesome

Ahh, I see what you mean NotTerfNorCis:

Just saw this too. So if the argument is only 'transmen' can play 'transmen' (even the definition of this role is wonky in this case as the person Scarlett was due to play, Lois Jean Gill never described themselves as 'trans' - they've been historically-transed by the transjuggernaut) because Scarlett, as a female, 'doesn't fit the criteria'.

The logic follows, after protests online at her casting in that role, that only 'transmen' should play this part as they are the only ones who represent and can know what this role is about. And only they 'fit the criteria'.

So the logic has to therefore follow that trans actors must only play trans roles, because , say, if a transwoman plays the part of a female, that wouldn't be right as they can't represent a female because they don't have that lived experience and don't 'fit the criteria' - because they are trans?

A transman can never play a male role, because they don't have the lived experience of a male. Like Scarlett playing a supposed-transman, she doesn't 'fit the criteria'.

So either those who champion and celebrate Scarlett stepping aside from this role celebrate transpeople either only playing trans roles and no other role or, unsurprisingly, there seems to be a logic fail along the way here.

Forgot to add - therefore, only trans people can play trans roles because noone else represents them.

Therefore they are separate from male and female people, so the statement of 'transwomen are women' and 'transmen are men' cannot stand? It's more like 'trans people are trans people'?

Unless, I guess.the protestors against Scarlett's appointment would have been happy for a male person to play the role? But all the protests seemed to be about transmen wanting to audition for the role, not males?

The debate seems to tangle itself up in knots once you go down the rabbit hole.

One problem with having a transman play the role is that the transman would have had medical treatment, so would have a deep voice and stubble. Dante Tex Gill never went through that. She looked like a powerfully built, masculine woman in men's clothes.

And surely it would be triggering for a trans man to have to woman up to play the pre trans bit?

Actors act. It's what they do. Pretend to be someone else and get paid for it. It's all bollocks.

@pombear

"Therefore they are separate from male and female people, so the statement of 'transwomen are women' and 'transmen are men' cannot stand? It's more like 'trans people are trans people"

My thoughts exactly.

OK, so find a butch woman - it's not that hard, I can think of two or three off the top of my head - top of the list being the woman from Orange is the New Black, who could come very close to that photo above if she wanted.

www.them.us/story/the-true-story-of-dante-tex-gill

I've never heard of Dante Tex Gill but basically he/she was a corrupt and violent criminal, pimp , brothel keeper and gangster.

Why the writer of this article thinks he/she deserves respect or , for that matter, why Scarlett Johansson thought this was a story worth telling escapes me.

Looking forward now to the next King Lear productions with a 'real' King. A Midsummer Night's Dream with actual fairies, with real wings etc.
Looks like 'acting' as well as being what I am a woman etc, is now illegal.

Funny old world.

We get this the whole time. Should black actors be cast in Skakespear? In fact, should women be cast if a production is truly authentic? Should able bodied actors play disabled parts - and vice versa.

This is just more of the same. There are always going to be people who feel an actor has to match all the characteristics of the part and others who believe that actors are versatile. It's not a trans argument.

No Disturbingly a 'butch woman' does not fulfill the category of a transman, so therefore they could not play the part of a transman according to the argument against Scarlett.

Unless you're a transman, you can't play the part of a transman.

(Hence, following the argument down the hole, that probably doesn't play well to the woke audience, transmen cannot play any other part than a transman).

It's not a trans argument.

Of course it's a trans argument. She was vilified on social media for taking a role TRAs felt was for a 'transman'. It was very much a trans issue. In fact that role could only realistically have been played by a woman.

As the character isn't beautiful it seems silly to have a beautiful actress playing her when Id have thought less conventionally beautiful women have fewer roles to choose from anyway. The trans bit is irrelevant.
I get annoyed when they cast beautiful actresses as Jane Eyre and think they're plain because they don't have much make up on.

www.them.us/story/the-true-story-of-dante-tex-gill

Clicky link. I honestly don't think the world is missing anything if this story doesn't get told.

Very well summed up Pombear. You receive MN's logical argument of the week award!

We get this the whole time
What like Daniel Day Lewis in My Left Foot and Eddie Remayne?

Nope snappity it has since equalities legislation and just plain thoughtfulness been considered carefully. It is why black actors playing various eminent Shakespearean roles has happened, why Glenda Jackson played King Lear and why the Graeae theatre company was created.

Who gets which roles is always a racialised and question of sexual and physical equality. And we women, BAME people and disabled are at the back of the queue.

It is important and it is relevant. The vicious nature of the attacks made on Johannson quite understandably made her pull out. Like all the attacks we are withstanding right now, it is wrong, cruel and sexist. It's just same old angry limp white blokedom controlling our art.

And I really like her as an actress.

To be fair Scarlet J looked nothing like Dante Tex Gill, so maybe a more masculine-looking woman would be appropriate, but not a man as at least one TRA was suggesting.
Charlize Theron looked nothing like Aileen Wurnos, etc padding, make up, prosthetics can do an awful lot

I'm not sad this probably isn't being made because it would definitely glorify the exploitation of women by Gill.
I am sad that a woman was hounded out of a job when there aren't a lot of leading roles for women. I've never seen any man who plays a trans woman be vilified in the way that Scarlett has over the past week or so.

I wonder will Hollywood just decide its too much trouble to make films with trans characters

ScarJo was most likely cast because she's a proven box office draw and filmmakers do want people to go see their films. Are there any transman actors with any box office pull at all?

I can't think of any trans man actors with a physical resemblance to the person the film is meant to be about period. I can think of a couple of butch women who'd fit the bill, but apparently they're not acceptable, so...

I wonder will Hollywood just decide its too much trouble to make films with trans characters

I'm guessing this is exactly what's going to happen, unless they can figure out a way to spin the negative reaction for publicity purposes.

Women will be hounded out of work, like we have always been in this type of cult. Even more abhorrent, in a way, is that it is the arts which should speak truth to power, but white men run it obviously, too.

Unless you're a transman, you can't play the part of a transman.

I’m just going to leave this here for anyone who’d like to reflect on it. I offer no comment.

Unless you are a bank robber, you cannot play the part of a bank robber in a film.

Unless you are a serial killer, you cannot play the part of a serial killer in a film.

Got it. They call it ACTING, duh!
What an utterly stupid position by the TRAs, and one they have tried before.