Trans Children in their own words.

[CosmicCanary]

So there is a piece in the DM this morning about Mermaids and a recent trans prom they held.

The DM interviewed 9 children about their trans identity and what it means to them and how it started.

These are some of the childrens comments:

15 yo who was brought up by mum and nan since the age of 1.
Started blockers at 12 years old.
I liked to wear princess outfits from the age of 2
When I was 6 mum let me experiment wearing girls clothes
I'd get panicky if a teacher called me he
I wore glittery silver shoes

17 yo who lives with mum and dad who are Christians and 2 sisters.
Puberty felt wrong. I was very unhappy I tried to kill myself many times
I feel my breasts are a useless encumbrance
It was so liberating to go the the prom and wear what I wanted
A gay man had been thrown out of our church

16 yo lives with mum and dad. Parents were reluctant but blockers started at 14 years old.
When I was 4 I was in a fancy dress parade and forced to wear a bikini with a stuffed bra
When I was 6 at a party my friends were all putting on make up I hid so I did not have to join in
When I was 4 I wanted to be a boy
Aged 11 I saw a magician on tv and wanted to wear a suit like his I went on the internet and knew I was trans

15 yo lives with mum dad and sister. Mum is Christian.
To start with I thought I was gay so did my mum she found it difficult to reconcile her faith but then I learnt about transgender
We go shopping together now
I am getting blockers

16 yo lives with mum dad and siblings.
I hated dresses and always wore jeans
I was hysterical at the thought of starting puberty
I wore sports bras and bound my chest and cut my hair short
When I was 12 I realised I was trans
My brain is a boy and my body is feminine

17 yo lives with mum.
At 12 I said to a friend I hated the fact I am a girl. I want to be a boy
I looked it up and realised I am trans and want to change my body
Puberty was horrible I was repulsed by it
This prom waa great I did not have to worry what my body looked like

11 yo lives with mum and dad. Dad is muslim.
I was happy when mum bought me a doll when I was 4
I didnt want to wear trousers
I always like knitting singing and dancing
I socially transitioned at 9
I love sparkly things

13 yo lives with mum dad twin sister and 2 older siblings.
The prom was great and I was able to be myself
My school is accepting and inclusive
I knew from a young age I was different

The things that stand out the most for me is that for those born female it is about their body changing. Their breasts growing and puberty causing them distress. They just want to wear trousers and have short hair.

For those born male its about sparkles and glitter. Potentially their sexuality maybe causing them distress due to their parents religion and social views.

I dont think any of these children are trans and I dont think puberty blockers should be given to 12 year olds.

We're not judging the children. We're judging the adults for giving the children drugs which will put the on a life long pathway of medication. And also for their homophobia and the abject stupidity in suggesting distress at puberty means you have been 'born in the wrong body'.

Bespin with that statement you are both glorifying and isolating them in one fell swoop.

No one's judging - we're relating, and horrified at how the world is now treating people like us. It's barbaric.

Bespin

Some of us have teenage children. We all know teens who are clever, funny, supportive, enlightened and some of whom have experienced mental health crises and self-harming behaviours. There is not enough mental health support for teens and us adults are putting far too much pressure on them. They are learning from terrible messages given to them via social media.

We don't believe that altering your body is the answer

most of that is sensible advise for a gender non conforming young person, when all of that doesn't work and your child still insists that something is wrong then I would. suggest you keep being positive and supportive and that you listen to them still and help them explore the fact that they might be trans. I have meet a number of questioning young people who do exactly what your daughter as done and that's fine I'm. glad. they have worked it out and supporting them helped that but sometimes the answer is also that they are trans and what should you do then

As for saying they're all absolutely smart and funny and overall perfect - talk about dehumanising a group and putting huge pressure on them. They're also humans who mess up and have tempers and so on. They need guidance and protection from others (and sometimes themselves).

A lot of them are autistic like me which makes this so much worse.

But then I've noticed that you're very good at making a thread about you, so I'm not engaging after this.

Cosmic Canary I don't. assume anything about your post I do however assume things about the posts that state child abuse and misgender people who I know.

I can't help thinking that for the girls especially, porn has a part to play. When I was young, all you could do was look up sex in the dictionary and perhaps see a porn mag. Now a child can type sex into Google and see done pretty disturbing things.

As these girls bodies go through puberty, they associate their changing body to these images they've seen and become distressed.

Bespin
I think the majority of parents are happy to support their children in growing and learning who they are but stopping puberty taking hormones is not the answer.

I am relating my experience of working with them nothing more and yes some of them can be buggers too just like other young people and I sadly also know that some of them have mental health problems and are fighting hard to over come them. I no way would I glorify them but neither would I judge them or there motives without actually talking to them

Bespin Some of those children may have decided to transition as adults. They should have been given the chance to grow up first and make that decision as mature adults, not forced down an irreversible path as children.

I'm glad that some of them have grown up to be happy as adults, but this is not a guaranteed outcome and nobody knows if they would have been just as happy, or happier in their natal sex or if they had transitioned later. And for some children it will be the wrong path, and they will regret for the rest of their lives a decision they made when they were too young to fully understand the consequences of what they were doing. Have you no compassion at all for those children?

It’s not about judging the children.

It’s about judging the adults giving them crap advice.

It’s about judging a society that offers children such restricted definitions of masculinity and femininity and that sexualises teenage girls so much that fewer and fewer children feel happy with the box they’ve been dumped into.

Instead of just accepting them as they are.

susie green's daughter is now not 13 years old she is a grown woman who if you have actually meet or talked to is smart, funny and living her life, she as done some pritty amazing things in her life and always seems to be living it to the full.

It should be possible to discuss the possible influence on vulnerable young people of newspaper articles, online talks and comments by the CEO of a charity without someone (who has described their background in Social Care) derailing and making it about an individual.

I have seen Jackie Green speak. I admire how articulate and confident she is. The atrocious bullying and hatred by adults when in year 7 which both Suzie and Jackie have described is appalling.
You should be in no doubt, that many of us here would have confronted this.

It doesn't help to make this personal about one young person.

If a CEO of a charity involved with children makes statements, it is wholly appropriate to discuss the possible implications.

If there are potential safeguarding concerns it would be remiss not to consider them.

Cosmic Canary I don't. assume anything about your post I do however assume things about the posts that state child abuse and misgender people who I know.

I dont think its wrong to feel that its child abuse for adults to encourage and provide medication to children which stops the very natural process of growing up. I do think its abusive to tell children that their bodies are wrong. I think it is abusive to lie to them about what is achievable.

As for misgendering if you dont believe in gender is it still misgendering?

Has the mail opened comments yet? Do you think they’re going to?

OldCrone

I have massive compassion for those young people and I'm often at odds with mermaids around the timing of things and the proper process and assessment periods for young people I do not support the private fast track pathway 100% and would always want to see proper checks put in place for this very reason.

Bespin
when all of that doesn't work and your child still insists that something is wrong then I would. suggest you keep being positive and supportive and that you listen to them still and help them explore the fact that they might be trans.

If a child insisted that their body was wrong in some other way, for example, if they insisted that their right leg didn't belong to them, and they wanted to have it amputated, what would your response be? Would you continue with the therapy to get them to accept their body, or would you book them in for an amputation?

I also wonder how much choice parents get really - once you child starts off down this road and has professional support and backup from school etc. What can you do. You are going to look unsupportive/old fashioned if you say the opposite of school, doctors, the law and then your vulnerable child is just going to pull further away from you and be even more vulnerable.

bespin how far would you agree with the statement:

there needs to be better support for transchildren but this needs to be coupled with better support for gender non compliant children in general

And a second statement

The prevalence of trans identifying children may in part be linked to restrictive stereotyping which social media today is enforcing

OldCrone this comparison is often used and that of eatting disorders both are not eqiverlent as they focus only on body image and being transgender is only partly about bodily dysmorphia and even with all of the treatment that can still not go away as this is about believing your gender is wrong and not your body though it is often linked as your body does play a big part in defining who you are. I have meet a lot of young people who surgery is not something they want as they have workout how to live as the gender they know they are.

Waiting lists for NHS services, especially mental health, can be difficult to access and waiting lists long.

Charities, helplines and forums for transgender issues are always available, always there to listen and never turn anyone away. Unfortunately, they have limited medical staff. Children accessing these services aren't talking to professionals.

I worry how many children are been 'diagnosed' as trans not by the health services, but by a transperson on a chat forum.

God this is all so hard to navigate. Had a long conversation with gay DS yesterday about it.

The point DS very coherently made to me is that these people are suffering profound mental distress. They are very like to die young from suicide or murder. They are exceptionally open to physical attack and violent abuse. It's vitally important that no one on MN is seen to condone or dismiss that as meh-not-my-problem. It's a huge issue.

Must bear in mind these descriptions are DM, not known as we well know for balanced or probing reporting, so they may have highlighted or even rewritten the material to shrink it to fit their agenda. Of course none of that evidence is strong enough to support surgery and hormone blockers. And the first port of call should be a strong course in self-acceptance, self-love and focus on the person you are - not what gender you are.

"I'm personally of the opinion that when you tell your doctor your trans it should be like a change of address..."

TedTalk (Covent Garden Women) Toby Walker 62,700 views

MIdgebabe

Totally agree with the first statement I wish you all on here would promote that. the biggest number of young people are identifying as non binary and not trans the two are simular but diffent.

the second statement again in. relation to non. binary identification I think this may be true and I am glad that young people are reacting to these stereotypes in this way.

for the young people who are Truely trans then I am. glad that they are building support networks when I grew up I felt isolated and alone and I have worked hard to reach the young people who still feel this or are not in the big cities where real life support is available

Bespin

The comments in my OP are from trans children.
They talk only of clothing, glitter, sparkles, short hair and for the females hating the changes that puberty brings to their body.
Those are the reasons they feel they are trans.
They dont talk about an internal belief that they are the opposite gender. They talk about the image they portray to the world and how they did not feel comfortable following societys idea of what girls and biys should wear or how they should act.