Gender neutral school uniform = Trousers

[ItIsOnlyAnOpinion]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5906031/Girls-banned-wearing-skirts-40-schools-insist-gender-neutral-uniforms.html

No more skirts.

I say trousers and nice kilt option for all

Yes, I think that sounds perfect too. Although, I'm actually a big fan of no uniform at all since my kids started at a school like that.

At my all girls school, in summer it was probably 25/75 trousers/skirts, but come winter, the vast majority of us did the switch and wore trousers - because why wouldn't you. I don't recall us all looking terrible, we all managed to find some kind of trousers that fit the strict standards

I think it's the culture of the school that determines how many girls wear trousers, because at that girls school, I don't recall any comments at all, but when I moved and went to another school, the vast majority of the girls wore skirts, and I remember lots of policing comments from both the boys and the girls.

I'm not a fan of school uniform. It takes too much time to police.

But Lass is right. Why not let boys and girls choose from the currently available options? I see no reason for girls to be prevented from wearing skirts if they wish.

Decency?? Why are girls wearing skirts not decent? What a warped view of society - and from a Headteacher as well. Too many people are so concerned to be 'right on' that they completely fail to engage their brains.

The Times covered this as well.
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/schoolgirls-face-ban-on-skirts-kxr7jcwqq?shareToken=3f74a1508264b5b7d4bf1b736f9f3040

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3293595-Schoolgirls-face-ban-on-skirts?msgid=79074536

Cross referencing!

I live on the continent. My daughter's uniform school lets girls wear trousers, a dress or a skirt. The international school she walks past every day enforces a "British" school uniform, with skirts for girls. I and she find that very restrictive and she hates skirts anyway after classmates made a comment about her legs (I would kill to have her legs but she now thinks they are fat :-( ).

I hate the way that it seems to be girls 'forced' into specific clothing

It seems that schools with a strict dresscode seem to either insist on girls wearing skirts or girls wearing trousers

It's probably a combination of wanting to appear 'gender neutral' , 'inclusive' and right-on with the TQ crowd, plus worrying about lawsuits resulting from boys upskirting, perving, Trump-style 'grabbing', etc, but being unwilling to confront and address that sexually abusive male behaviour. I don't really see a problem with uniforms actually being uniform though.

[And I wanted so much to be allowed to wear long pants and shorts at my school, because I always felt uncomfortable, restricted and kind of vulnerable in the summer dress and winter skirt that was our uniform]

If he is hung up on enforcing rules then he may be wanting to head off a boy insisting on the right to wear a skirt, and think if it's trousers for all then that won't be possible. If LM had been at a school where the girls had been made to wear trousers then they would have had no grounds to insist on their right to wear a skirt in order to 'dress as the girl they truly are' because they would be dressed the same as all the girls (and boys).

This is based on my assumption of abuse = abusing school rules as opposed to sexual abuse. The emphasis on 'decency' is concerning as well as the authoritarianism

This is how I read it. With all the gender bending going on at the moment they probably just want to take that element out of it so that they don’t have people seeking attention by wearing ‘other’ uniform and stating it’s their right due to being trans. By all means go and buy your trousers from the boys or girls dept but anything that takes out the ‘cross-dressing’ element of trans kids is helpful IMO. How often do trans stories start with “I never wanted to wear trousers, I always wanted to wear pretty dresses”? Now if they feel the need to dress ‘like a girl’, guess what, they’re already doing it.

I'm OK with this.
I don't view skirts in schools as a critical right of anyone, and I wouldn't blink at any school that presented uniform choices of shorts and trousers for all.
If I felt skirts presented some sartorial advantage over shorts or trousers I'd be arguing for them to remain as part of school wardrobe, but I don't.

The head teacher's motivations may be wrong, but in principle I'd be thrilled if skirts were left off school uniform lists.

DD goes up to secondary soon and I know she'll quickly fall in with the other girls and stop wearing her trousers, and all the other freedoms of cartwheels and sitting comfortably with legs splayed will go.
And the knees together like a lady lessons begin.
She'll have the option of trousers, but the expectation of skirts.

I don't rate HTs, every week you read of some senior teaching staff being banned by the teaching regulation authority. Or a story about them being paid six figures a year whilst children have no resources to learn.

Studies show a high proportion than in the population, of people with personality disorders like Anti-social and narcissistic, reach positions of power and trust.

No wonder they think a skirt is... these people don't have a brain wired up like the rest of us.

Dd wore trousers

Girls in skirts were always being told off fro breaking uniform rules

Girls in trousers don't

In her school obviously...no idea about any others

If the head really believes that wearing trousers will prevent girls being harassed, then he's got his head right up his arse.

Maybe we should all just go back to tunics and hose.
I think I'd look rather fetching thus attired and proper "gender neutral"

Suit of armour works too.

the vast majority of the girls wore skirts, and I remember lots of policing comments from both the boys and the girls
See this is a problem to me. If girls clothes are going to be 'policed' that indicates they're not making a free choice, and its better that any 'policing' isn't done by teenage boys.
There is evidence that a lot of teenage girls feel pressurised to remove body hair, to have long hair, and to present themselves in a certain way. Are they being pressurised or 'policed' into wearing skirts, often very short skirts at school?

If I felt skirts presented some sartorial advantage over shorts or trousers I'd be arguing for them to remain as part of school wardrobe, but I don't

Well bully for you. Hard as it is for some of you to comprehend trousers do not suit or are even comfortable for all women. Any problems I have had with thrush or cystitis were when I wore trousers.

As others have said let's police what women and girls wear rather than male behaviour.

Girls in skirts were always being told off fro breaking uniform rules

At son's schools it was boys for being scruffy. The girls wore kilts which are virtually impossible to roll up or dresses in summer which would have to be hemmed to be shortened.

The girls now have the option of wearing trousers- it hasn't caught on.

Sorry not rtft but just seen them talking about this on the wright stuff.

So apparently the reason for skirt banning is because :

Little girls are sluts showing too much flesh
Little girls flash their sexy legs when sitting in the floor
Little boys harass the little girls by pulling up their skirts
It makes the school too uncomfortable letting trans girls wear skirts.
Trans boys will not have to change uniform.

So basically, girls have to change their uniform to make life easier for the school and trans kids, but girls deserve to have rights taken away anyway because they're a bunch of sluts and tarts.

Nice to know society is so progressive toward girls and their rights. I would have hated to wear trousers, I never wear them now, they don't suit most girls/women because they are tailored to mens bodies.

I knew there'd be someone on this board delighted by this.
I've never got why some people are so anti dress/skirt on here.
Let people wear what they want.

I always struggle with these debates because I hate skirts and hate having to wear tights so I would have been so relieved to have to wear trousers that I cant see beyond that.

It had nothing to do with decency, harassment or anything, I finds tights sweaty and I am a very hairy lady so got teased if I showed my leg hair, or had to get rid of my leg hair and the relief at it all being covered up would have made school better for me.

but I know other women feel the exact opposite and find trousers show their bums off and make them feel exposed or don't get enough of a breeze.

I reckon I could have tolerated a kilt with compulsory knee high socks. so that would be the most gender neutral uniform for me.

I knew there'd be someone on this board delighted by this.
I've never got why some people are so anti dress/skirt on here.
Let people wear what they want.

Not actually read the thread then?

The closest we've got to 'delighted' was "I'm OK with this"....

Some people are anti-dress skirt, some are anti-trousers. How nice for us to be able to talk about it.

From my count, the overriding opinion is 'just put both on the uniform list, and let anyone wear what they want' - or, your third sentence.. But by all means, read something entirely different and use it to beat us, we're used to that by now.

Any problems I have had with thrush or cystitis were when I wore trousers.

Good point. Although I've found that tights are the worst for bringing thrush on. I had to buy the kind with a diamond gusset in the crotch and then cut the gusset out. The option of cotton trousers, unlined, would have been the best for me.

I'm ok with this, I would have killed for the option to wear trousers in high school (all girls school) and was made up when I was moved to a mixed school and everyone wore shorts everyday.

What I'm not ok with it the lack of appropriate summer uniform in secondary schools. I have had a very poorly child being sent home due to heat several times this past few weeks. No shorts and blazers on when moving around school, it's awful and kids are suffering. We live in England aircon isn't the norm here.

I hate the way that it seems to be girls 'forced' into specific clothing

Boys already are: trousers, trousers, or trousers.

Maybe we should all just go back to tunics and hose.

I already have done. Leggings are basically modern-day hose and I wear them with a long top.

Am I alone in remembering that school tights itched like crazy?

I'm not a huge fan of uniform, but I think if you're going to have a uniform, trousers and shorts for all are a good thing. Practical and unproblematic. Op you clearly have a bit of an axe to grind about schools in general though. The majority of day-to-day problems (clothing-related or otherwise) in schools are caused by the pupils, not by 'power-crazy' teachers and the restriction of freedom and choices.

I lived in a country for a while that made it illegal for women to wear trousers or shorts.

That's policing women's clothes.
Literally.

A school announcing ' this is the school polo shirt, this is the school jumper, and these are the choices of shorts or trousers for all' is not policing girls.

I haven't met a teenage girl that possesses not a single pair or trousers/jeans/shorts/sweatpants/ in her wardrobe. Girls already wear trousers and they are not a 'boys' garment.

This isn't imposing an outlandish requirement on girls. They're school trousers, not dayglo onesies.

Kids get to wear what they want outside schools, but schools have a duty of care to create an environment that doesn't foster inequalities. If the practical effect of including skirts in a uniform choice is that only one sex 'chooses' them, and then either self-censors their own behaviour (how you must sit nicely, how physically active you can be, how short you can make them) or is policed by peers, then you aren't fostering that healthy environment.

As I said, recognising that people have the wrong motivations for banning skirts shouldn't result in throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Stilettos are banned too - a dodgy headmaster suggesting the reason is because they are too sexy and distracting for boys, rather than an impractical and damaging item that disproportionately hurts only one sex, shouldn't result in a backlash of protests for the right to wear stilettos.

Where skirts DO remain on uniform lists, they should of course be available for boys. But I won't mourn some schools dropping them entirely. I think girls will benefit overall from this.