How stressed are you about the loss of female-only spaces?

[DoctorW]

How stressed are you that the UK Govt may legalise self-declaration of sex, enabling any man to become legally female and gain access to female-only spaces such as refuges, sports, awards, jobs (e.g. performing smear tests), dormitories and lesbian groups?

We want to find out how big this issue is so we are running a poll to get a snapshot. This link takes you directly there. Please vote and share the link with friends so we can get as many participants as possible.

twitter.com/fairplaywomen/status/1010959564701880321

Very concerned indeed about the possibility of my boundaries not being respected with regards to e.g. health care. Don’t want to share sleeping/changing space with male bodied people. I feel for those vulnerable women in prisons who are trapped with far fewer choices than us outside. And I have found feminist women-only spaces healing and empowering when needed. I feel angry and sad at this backlash against our hard-won progress.

I don't have any problem whatsoever sharing spaces with transwoman. They are my friends.

They might be YOUR friends but they're not mine and I want them kept away from me and my daughters in female ONLY spaces.

I want to vote but dont do twitter. Any chance of a non twittery link please? Ta !

You can just create a twitter account. I have one in a random made up name with a Gmail address I never use. I've never tweeted and never will but there are about half a dozen people whose tweets I occasionally look at and having a twitter account keeps them all in one place. It allowed me to vote.

Oh i see. Thanks Lass

And when people are told they can't even try to challenge them??

Self ID will not make sexual harassment, intimidation, or sexual acts in public legal. If someone is using these spaces in these ways, you can still challenge them, rightly so.

I'll say again, trans women and men have been using female spaces without ID for a very long time. If you saw (what you suspected to be) a transexual using the woman's loo now, would you demand they drop trou and show you their genitals?

I'm on the fence about self ID to be honest. I agree that transitioning medically and legally should be a well thought out and regulated process. But perhaps my arse is so firmly wedged on the fence because all this hysteria is not a reality for me. I'm around transpeople most weekends. The people I see IRL are considerate, lovely people who just want to pee and then leave.

@beautifulday when will you have to share a sleeping/changing space?

I don't share changing or sleeping space with any stranger just now. Can't see what the difference will be to most people. In a shop there are cubicals, in the swimming it's family change and cubicals, in the toilets it's cubicals.

They might be YOUR friends but they're not mine and I want them kept away from me and my daughters in female ONLY spaces

This

Random that's great that you find the lovely considerate people you spend time with who just want to pee and leave great.

But this debate isn't about that.

It's about the general edging towards mass groupthink; the trans ideology is demanding that's pushing people towards feeling 'wrong' to challenge any male-bodied person in female-only spaces.

This is not hysteria. This is very knowledgable and experienced females, many very familiar with sexual harrassment, intimidation and sexual acts, seeing and experiencing a targeted erosion of women's boundaries, pushing towards demands that you should not ever question anyone in female-only spaces (and I'm not just talking about 'peeing and leaving' spaces). Just in case the male-bodied person 'feels like a woman'.

Your splinters from sitting on that fence because 'this hysteria is not a reality for me' will be much less uncomfortable for you than the hurt for the females who experience the repercussions of 'hey, you can still challenge them' logic in the future.

I'm now very concerned. Used to be unconcerned.

I don't want males in female spaces, whether or not they identify as trans.

No Twitter account either!

Not stressed but not keen. Don't have Twitter account.

Very concerned, anxious and angry.

Absolutely no problem with it myself.

I am also concerned, anxious and angry. Even about toilets as I have ducked onto them to avoid men more times than I care to count. Even those dodgy fuckers 'respected' that boundary felt afraid of drawing attention to themselves.

Hospitals etc, yes angry. Angry that we are having to fight for this.

Very stressed and anxious. We were promised single sex hospital wards, partly because so many women are raped and assaulted on mixed wards.

Women worked hard and died for the right to women-only spaces. I'm angry they are under threat to the delusions of a minority. Of course trans people should have rights - human rights. But what they shouldn't have is the right to be in single-sex spaces when they are not of that sex.

Luckily, it won't hugely affect me. I'm a tough woman and not bothered about getting naked in front of anyone.

However, I feel hugely angry on behalf of the women and children it will affect. My grandmother, my nieces, my elderly neighbor. They don't deserve this.

I am very concerned for the women in female estate prisons, refuges, homeless services, mental health services, hospitals etc who do not seem to have a voice (or access to powerful legal and political representation). Who are already vulnerable and whose needs and the nature of the services that have evolved to support them seem to be completely disregarded.

I am angry that long established and evolved safeguarding principles & protections are being disregarded.

All of them? Even the paedophiles and rapists amongst them? You keep dubious company

Sorry but that is crossing a line. This is hateful, bigoted transphobia. This is why the frenzied thinking on here upsets me. I'm GC myself, though not to the same extent as lots of people on here, but equating transpeople with pedophiles and rapists is bigoted and wrong. The vast majority of transpeople are lovely people who just want to get on with their lives.

Just imagine I had said 'I have no problem sharing a space with black people'. For you to then say 'you keep dubious company'. Hateful, no?

This is why the wider community accuses mumsnet of transphobia.

I'm surprised at the posters who think that women who want to be in sex segregated areas are bigots. I really think they should start listening to women and the experiences they have with male violence and intimidation. May be then they would understand their needs for female only spaces.

Baroque, I don't know if that was aimed at my post or not, do apologies if it wasn't, but I do understand and listen to women who think that. I totally agree re: DV shelters, though maybe not bathrooms. I have many experiences with male sexual violence, trust me.
The only person I am calling a bigot was someone who was insinuating that my friendship with many transpeople is 'dubious' because transpeople are likely to be be pedophiles and rapists. That is bigoted.

Actually I'm stressed about it.

First off, I get anxious when I go to a restaurant toilet and it's down a long, isolated hallway with men and women's next to each other, and there's a man closely following behind me.

I always breathe a small sigh of relief when I go into the ladies and he goes into the men's.

None of that "you should seek help" patronizing shit btw - I don't like being closely followed by men no matter how innocent the setting (restaurant/street) and I'm entitled to feel that way.

There was also a good thread on here a while back about what women do in women's toilets they may not want to do in front of men. In my case I have a chronic condition that I don't always want/need to deal with inside a cubicle but do want to deal with in the privacy of the women's toilets where possible.

Also at the gym I have recently been concerned about what to do if I see someone with a penis in the women's changing rooms.

So it does stress me out yes.

Very stressed and cross. I want to be able to go into a women's ward at a hospital and there to be NO people with penises there. When I'm at my most vulnerable I want to feel secure. And especially if I ever had to go into a mental health ward.

We need to keep toilets and changing rooms women only too otherwise things will get eroded bit by bit.

However I'm not on twitter...

If you are hoping for non biased results you probably should have worded the question quite differently. You are linking to the survey from a chat room known for negative views on this subject too so again, are likely to get more people 'anxious' than in the general population.
What are you trying to achieve with the survey/what do you want to do with the results?

I agree, just because some what to abolish sex segregation in toilets and changing rooms, it doesn't stop women and girls wanting and needing those spaces segregated by sex. It's not a personality flaw to want to be in a female space, it's a need based on experience.